I am in the process of purchasing a jmlabs sib & cub system. (6 sibs) The sub that comes with the system is only 75 watts with a down firing 9" driver. I have the opportunity to get 2 of these subs OR the Chorus SW700 S sub which is a 300 watt front firing 11". Would the 2 subs work better?...They are definitely smaller and better fitting in the room. Any concerns with bass cancellation?...What will give me the most pounding volume?
this isn't really my cup of tea _grin_
But since no one else has posted to this thread, I'll give you some input -
caveat - there's all sorts of info not available in this thread
IMHO, watts quoted by manufacturers of such items is usually next to meaningless,
As a former bass player for a number of years, long time ago.
I would unhesitatingly go for a 11" over two 9"s if all other factors are equal although theoretically they should be about the same
and that's a pretty big "if"
However, I would generally go with one heavier piece of equipment than two lighter/smaller pieces -
I also as personal preference would take forward firing over down firing generally speaking
regards
Ken L
But since no one else has posted to this thread, I'll give you some input -
caveat - there's all sorts of info not available in this thread
IMHO, watts quoted by manufacturers of such items is usually next to meaningless,
As a former bass player for a number of years, long time ago.
I would unhesitatingly go for a 11" over two 9"s if all other factors are equal although theoretically they should be about the same
and that's a pretty big "if"
However, I would generally go with one heavier piece of equipment than two lighter/smaller pieces -
I also as personal preference would take forward firing over down firing generally speaking
regards
Ken L
to be honest when it comes to buying commertial products the best thing to do is demo them, manufacturers specs are dubious andthey sometimes include average room gainwhen they give you the f10 response of 25Hz to 200Hz as an example, diy spec are more reliable. so i say goin the store and say i want either 2 of those 9"ers or 1 11" and get them to set that up for you.
from the info you gave there id say the11" just because of the size, it will probly have longer xmax and higher power and it will have larger sd, an likely lower response, resulting in better deep bass and 1 enclosur is easier to place without problems
from the info you gave there id say the11" just because of the size, it will probly have longer xmax and higher power and it will have larger sd, an likely lower response, resulting in better deep bass and 1 enclosur is easier to place without problems
Buy subs? What a novel concept... i'm sure for what any of those subs cost you could build a pair of push-push subs with decent plate amps... and have some change left.
dave
dave
I REALLY recommend getting two subs and place them at different sides of the room. This really helps to nullify standing waves and will make things sound alot more even. And, although people are iffy about this, I really recommend using subs below each speaker in a stereo setup, running in stereo. THere are things that won't sound the way they were supposed to unless you have stereo subwoofers.
The Paulinator said:
I thought most receivers put out the LFE in mono, so no stereo is really possible?
I could be wrong though. 🙂
The two 9" subs probably have a cone area slightly greater than the 11 incher. However, However, since excursion tends to get greater the larger the diameter of the sub, (it doesn't have to be that way, but usually that is how it works out), I would guess the 11 incher probably can move a little more air-which means produce a little more bass.
Two subs, at equal volume, will sound 6 dB louder than one sub at the same power. It takes four times the power to raise a single sub 6 dB. However, the 11 incher, at 300 watts, has four times the power of the 9" subs powered by 75 watts.
Statistically, it is a standoff between the two 9s and the single 11.
However, my guess is that the 11 incher is probably built to go deeper, and is probably a better sub. 75 watts and an 8 inch sub says to me that the manufacturer really didn't have very high goals for his sub in terms of bass output. While 11 inches and a hefty 300 watts tells me the manufacturer at least intended intended to produce a fine sub.
Best thing-audition. If going in cold-buy the 11 incher.
Really the best thing-build your own.
Two subs, at equal volume, will sound 6 dB louder than one sub at the same power. It takes four times the power to raise a single sub 6 dB. However, the 11 incher, at 300 watts, has four times the power of the 9" subs powered by 75 watts.
Statistically, it is a standoff between the two 9s and the single 11.
However, my guess is that the 11 incher is probably built to go deeper, and is probably a better sub. 75 watts and an 8 inch sub says to me that the manufacturer really didn't have very high goals for his sub in terms of bass output. While 11 inches and a hefty 300 watts tells me the manufacturer at least intended intended to produce a fine sub.
Best thing-audition. If going in cold-buy the 11 incher.
Really the best thing-build your own.
Two 9" subs has 25% more cone are than one 11" sub.
Comparing cone areas is easy, comparing the power ratings between the two is not.
I would try both set-ups in your room.
If these subs have high level input, you could have stereo bass if you use the (2) 9".
Regards
KevinLee
Comparing cone areas is easy, comparing the power ratings between the two is not.
I would try both set-ups in your room.
If these subs have high level input, you could have stereo bass if you use the (2) 9".
Regards
KevinLee
I personally prefer two subs in a stereo set-up. In an HT or multi-channel sudio set-up, another pair at the back.
It is common notion to consider bass frequencies as non-directional so one finds many receiver giving out mono LFE. Non-directionality is true only if the sub's crossover starts at around 60 hz. Above that, directionlaity becomes apparent. One needs only to listen to a headphone to distinguish between bass that is mono and one that is in stereo. One can still identify a kick drum or a viola/piano's lowest notes coming from either a left or right speaker. Summing their 80-100 hz together into a mono signal losses much of the stereophonic soundstaging.
While it is possible that two bass sources may cancel each other out in a room where speaker placement is critical, it is also possible to get smoother and more uniform bass dispersion with multi sub placement. I have expereinced using only one sub and there are room nodes where the bass is stronger while in other areas, there's hardly any. Putting another idnetical sub in another location solved the uneveness nicely.
Bass frequncies are best reproduced in general with the largest cone area possible in order to displace as much air volume as possible. (Ofcourse recent designs with more pliant and long throw 8" woofers can also do the jub.) So between a single 11" and a double 9" I'd go for the latter, with all other asoects equal. The latter's cone area is effectively 18" together. Also, having two woofers doubles the "engine" of the speaker. (Vandersteen uses three downfiring 8" woofers in its subs)
But in this particualr case where the 11" sub uses a 300 watt amplifer versus a couple of 9" subs using 75 watt amps each, I'd chooce the former as it should give more slam due to its higher amplifier rating. Better still if you use two of these. Just my 2 cents.
It is common notion to consider bass frequencies as non-directional so one finds many receiver giving out mono LFE. Non-directionality is true only if the sub's crossover starts at around 60 hz. Above that, directionlaity becomes apparent. One needs only to listen to a headphone to distinguish between bass that is mono and one that is in stereo. One can still identify a kick drum or a viola/piano's lowest notes coming from either a left or right speaker. Summing their 80-100 hz together into a mono signal losses much of the stereophonic soundstaging.
While it is possible that two bass sources may cancel each other out in a room where speaker placement is critical, it is also possible to get smoother and more uniform bass dispersion with multi sub placement. I have expereinced using only one sub and there are room nodes where the bass is stronger while in other areas, there's hardly any. Putting another idnetical sub in another location solved the uneveness nicely.
Bass frequncies are best reproduced in general with the largest cone area possible in order to displace as much air volume as possible. (Ofcourse recent designs with more pliant and long throw 8" woofers can also do the jub.) So between a single 11" and a double 9" I'd go for the latter, with all other asoects equal. The latter's cone area is effectively 18" together. Also, having two woofers doubles the "engine" of the speaker. (Vandersteen uses three downfiring 8" woofers in its subs)
But in this particualr case where the 11" sub uses a 300 watt amplifer versus a couple of 9" subs using 75 watt amps each, I'd chooce the former as it should give more slam due to its higher amplifier rating. Better still if you use two of these. Just my 2 cents.
CZ Eddie said:
You can either put the subs next to each of your front speakers (best for running them in stereo mode) and use the speaker level inputs, borrowing from your speaker wires, or if you want to place each sub at different points in the room and run them mono to help cancel out standing waves (best for home theater), you can divide the sub out (my Sony ES 777 has two outs). Remember to raise the level of your sub out as much as possible so you get more output from the half-signal going to each sub.
do you know what a circle is?
2 9" woofers are nowhere near the sd of an 18, as said earlier they are only 25% more sd than the 11"
um not to sound rude but why hasent anyone mentioned xmax, as a general rule the larger the cone the higher the xmax, a 12mm xmax 11" driver would move alot more aire than 2 6mm xmax 9" drivers.
A pair of 9" drivers will have an Sd of about 88 sq in -- an 11" about 71 sq in. -- an 18" about 200 sq in.
And what is with the unusual size of the drivers, 8, 10, 12 are much more common.
dave
And what is with the unusual size of the drivers, 8, 10, 12 are much more common.
dave
michael said:
Somebody did. Post #7, second sentence. 🙂
michael said:
We don't know that the excursion difference is necessarily that great between the two drivers. Although it might be that big. If I had to bet, I would bet that the 11 incher was more likely to have the big excursion.
planet10 said:
Now that you mention it, I was wondering about that, too.
Odd size drivers do happen now and then, but what a coincidence that the two subs you are comparing are both odd sizes.
Are these subs being measured around the outside of the frame, or is just the cone itself being measured here?
Could we be taking about two 10 inchers vs one 12 incher?
The link Google translated from German below calls it a 300mm speaker. That normally means 12".
http://translate.google.com/transla...arch?q=Chorus+SW+700+S+sub&hl=en&lr=&ie=UTF-8
The reason why i asked is that for commercial subs, I dont think you can do better for the price than svs or hsu sonotubes, where you can get true 20hz extention for under 400 a piece NOT including the amp, though there are some very inexpensive amps out there. If youre sattelite speakers are small, "stereo" subs might be the way to go because you might have to have a higher crossover setting to blend them smoothly. Two hsu or svs subs should shake the house also.
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