Looking for recommendations on a 2" cone driver, with sensitivity 87db/2.83v or better. Good objective or subjective performance. Need one for <$100, and another high-end. Would probably cover 500-2000hz, LR2. To be used in a WMTMW or MTMW with the intent of smooth and constrained vertical response.
Sounds like you want a wide bander. It would likely have to be a 4 ohm, and maybe a pro brand like Faital to get there.
The best I've seen 3" wide banders go is 88dB, for the home sector, and 2" are usually 81-84dB best case. It's a simple Sd calculation.
I think Faital is the best direction to go.
The best I've seen 3" wide banders go is 88dB, for the home sector, and 2" are usually 81-84dB best case. It's a simple Sd calculation.
I think Faital is the best direction to go.
Thanks Wolf. Faital was on my list, due to sensitivity and subjective reviews. Objective performance is not fantastic, but it still is a good candidate for the budget design.
I am not sure if a 2" will have low enough distortion when crossed at 500 Hz.
Anyone have 3rd-party measurements of the AP?
TBTL> I need to do some polar modeling and see how high I can go.
TBTL> I need to do some polar modeling and see how high I can go.
Please notice that 2.828Vrms into 4 Ohms is 2 Watts (Yes, TWO Watts).
So, for a loudspeaker that is 4 Ohms and has sensitivity of 87dB at 1 meter for 2.828Vrms,
it has 3dB less sensitivity than an 8 Ohm loudspeaker rated at 87dB at 1 meter at 2.828Vrms.
The 4 Ohm speaker driven by a solid state amplifier set for 2.828V, will sound 2 times as loud as the 8 Ohm loudspeaker above.
The amplifier will put out 2.828Vrms, when 4, 8, or both are connected to the amplifier output.
But . . .
Take a tube amplifier, set the signal level to put out 10 Watts (with the loudspeaker on the proper tap; 4 on 4, or 8 on 8)
The 4 Ohm loudspeaker on the 4 Ohm tap of a tube amp, Versus the 8 Ohm loudspeaker on the 8 Ohm tap . . .
The 8 Ohm loudspeaker? 2.828Vrms).
Note: the tube amplifier with a 4 Ohm loudspeaker connected to the 8 Ohm tap will sound louder, the tradeoff is the amplifier will not put out the maximum rated power that way, and even more importantly, the distortion of the amplifier will be more when you mismatch the loudspeaker to the amplifier tap.
When is louder better?
Not when there is more distortion.
Just my opinions
So, for a loudspeaker that is 4 Ohms and has sensitivity of 87dB at 1 meter for 2.828Vrms,
it has 3dB less sensitivity than an 8 Ohm loudspeaker rated at 87dB at 1 meter at 2.828Vrms.
The 4 Ohm speaker driven by a solid state amplifier set for 2.828V, will sound 2 times as loud as the 8 Ohm loudspeaker above.
The amplifier will put out 2.828Vrms, when 4, 8, or both are connected to the amplifier output.
But . . .
Take a tube amplifier, set the signal level to put out 10 Watts (with the loudspeaker on the proper tap; 4 on 4, or 8 on 8)
The 4 Ohm loudspeaker on the 4 Ohm tap of a tube amp, Versus the 8 Ohm loudspeaker on the 8 Ohm tap . . .
The 8 Ohm loudspeaker? 2.828Vrms).
Note: the tube amplifier with a 4 Ohm loudspeaker connected to the 8 Ohm tap will sound louder, the tradeoff is the amplifier will not put out the maximum rated power that way, and even more importantly, the distortion of the amplifier will be more when you mismatch the loudspeaker to the amplifier tap.
When is louder better?
Not when there is more distortion.
Just my opinions
Wattage is irrelevant in speaker design for the most part, and voltage reigns king for xover design.
2 drivers with same voltage sensitivity are just that. A driver comparison as you show are related to efficiency, and the 3dB lower of the 4 ohm driver is efficiency, not sensitivity.
2.83V is the way to go.
2 drivers with same voltage sensitivity are just that. A driver comparison as you show are related to efficiency, and the 3dB lower of the 4 ohm driver is efficiency, not sensitivity.
2.83V is the way to go.
wolf_teeth,
Many vacuum tube amplifiers do not perform as well when they are driving 4 Ohms, versus when they are driving 8 Ohms, whether they are driven from the 4 Ohm tap, or from the 8 Ohm tap.
Now, if the 4 Ohm speaker is 3 dB too sensitive versus the 8 Ohm drivers in the same multi-way loudspeaker, you can either pad the 4 Ohm driver with a 4 Ohm series resistor (often not a good thing to do, for multiple reasons), or you can drive a step-down auto transformer (8 to 4), but that can further complicate the crossover. I am sure you can come up with even more and/or better solutions (including using all 4 Ohm drivers in a multi-way loudspeaker).
I am guessing one of your forte includes lots of knowledge in the loudspeaker arena: drivers, cabinets, crossovers, bi-amping, full range, multi-driver, cabinets, open baffle, etc.
My forte is amplifier design; building; measurements; listening; push pull, versus single ended double blindfolded listening; and parallel/non parallel single ended double blindfolded listening, etc.
And, I do have a reasonable amount of knowledge of loudspeakers too.
And, I know a lot of the differences between the wide range of different solid state amplifiers; and a lot of the differences between the wide range of different vacuum tube amplifiers.
Oh, and yes, I make mistakes about vacuum tube amplifiers, solid state amplifiers, and loudspeakers. I am mortal.
All Generalizations Have Exceptions.
Try logically thinking about that one, Mr. Spock (if he were still alive; and Lenard Nimoy, RIP, is not/was not Spock).
Many vacuum tube amplifiers do not perform as well when they are driving 4 Ohms, versus when they are driving 8 Ohms, whether they are driven from the 4 Ohm tap, or from the 8 Ohm tap.
Now, if the 4 Ohm speaker is 3 dB too sensitive versus the 8 Ohm drivers in the same multi-way loudspeaker, you can either pad the 4 Ohm driver with a 4 Ohm series resistor (often not a good thing to do, for multiple reasons), or you can drive a step-down auto transformer (8 to 4), but that can further complicate the crossover. I am sure you can come up with even more and/or better solutions (including using all 4 Ohm drivers in a multi-way loudspeaker).
I am guessing one of your forte includes lots of knowledge in the loudspeaker arena: drivers, cabinets, crossovers, bi-amping, full range, multi-driver, cabinets, open baffle, etc.
My forte is amplifier design; building; measurements; listening; push pull, versus single ended double blindfolded listening; and parallel/non parallel single ended double blindfolded listening, etc.
And, I do have a reasonable amount of knowledge of loudspeakers too.
And, I know a lot of the differences between the wide range of different solid state amplifiers; and a lot of the differences between the wide range of different vacuum tube amplifiers.
Oh, and yes, I make mistakes about vacuum tube amplifiers, solid state amplifiers, and loudspeakers. I am mortal.
All Generalizations Have Exceptions.
Try logically thinking about that one, Mr. Spock (if he were still alive; and Lenard Nimoy, RIP, is not/was not Spock).
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Oh, so there was another post/(reply actually).. oh well.
-from this one:
https://www.diyaudio.com/community/...air-of-2in-drivers.378995/page-2#post-6907459
Here´s a few fullrangers that have been around a while and would be (mostly) lower endish:
http://www.spectrumaudio.de/
Click "Produkte", then "Breitbandlautsprecher" to get to the table/overview.
1st paragraph is 2" (50mm/ 2 Zoll)
http://www.spectrumaudio.de/
Click "Produkte", then "Breitbandlautsprecher" to get to the table/overview.
1st paragraph is 2" (50mm/ 2 Zoll)
I'm partial to the W2-803SM, but it does not meet the sensitivity goals. Neither do really any others from TB.
The AP drivers have VERY strong Neo motors. There is a model called 'RAM' also that has even more sensitivity, but it's like $200. Nice drivers!!
The AP drivers have VERY strong Neo motors. There is a model called 'RAM' also that has even more sensitivity, but it's like $200. Nice drivers!!