Hi all,
So i have a question, i never usually listen to vynle but been asked to repair an NSM jukebox for someone.
Anyway today i finished recapping the amp and replacing dead transistors on one channel, full carriage rebuild and new stylus's.
That was the tip of the iceburg but you get the point its a proper rebuild.
Listening to records on it while testing, connected to modern speakers which i have heard before.
I am pretty sure that both spotify streams and cd should be much better than vynle but this thing sounds amazing i can hear every little detail in songs i have listened to on spotify and cd for years and im hearing new things i never noticed.
But why? Its suppost to be lower quality but this sounds much better to me.
So i have a question, i never usually listen to vynle but been asked to repair an NSM jukebox for someone.
Anyway today i finished recapping the amp and replacing dead transistors on one channel, full carriage rebuild and new stylus's.
That was the tip of the iceburg but you get the point its a proper rebuild.
Listening to records on it while testing, connected to modern speakers which i have heard before.
I am pretty sure that both spotify streams and cd should be much better than vynle but this thing sounds amazing i can hear every little detail in songs i have listened to on spotify and cd for years and im hearing new things i never noticed.
But why? Its suppost to be lower quality but this sounds much better to me.
Well now you know. Also, Spotify is low rez, so even a cheap record player should sound better.
jeff
Well yes.
Most prominent thing seems to be drums, listening to clear water revival and the drums sound - well like drums but there was something not quite right before but I dont know how to describe it.
Also midrange background detail, little things not heard before.
Why do i get the feeling this experience is going to cost me a fortune lol.
Different LPs/CDs/tapes/streaming can have very different mastering/processing. Your jukebox may even be mono.
It is stereo this one, one of the repairs was a broken ceramic cartridge, no longer made had to carefully open it up and resolder a tiny strand of wire back on the pogo plugs inside.
Luckily its a metal cased one so could be opened.
Luckily its a metal cased one so could be opened.
Just out of interest, which NSM model is it?
They've made a large number of Classic Jukeboxes: https://www.nsmmusic.com/jukeboxes/
They've made a large number of Classic Jukeboxes: https://www.nsmmusic.com/jukeboxes/
Its an e160 es classic.
I only have the workings, the cabinet was beyond saving, but the customers intention is to mount inside the tail end of a cadilac and wire the rear lights to be on.
I only have the workings, the cabinet was beyond saving, but the customers intention is to mount inside the tail end of a cadilac and wire the rear lights to be on.
Im actually after a central control board if you know anyone, this one has a strange fault where it wont always start up.
You reset power a few times and then it works and stays on.
Its not power supply related, been through all that.
Been through all analogue components too, its an ic i think but no idea which one and there are many.
You reset power a few times and then it works and stays on.
Its not power supply related, been through all that.
Been through all analogue components too, its an ic i think but no idea which one and there are many.
The Consul Classic ES 160 was manufactured between 1979 and 1983.
But that one says it's fitted with a Shure magnetic cartridge.
Yup, it's full of integrated circuits!
P.S. 45 RPM singles were cut to sound loud and clear on portable Dansette type record players.
Played on a huge jukebox, they could knock your socks off!
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Yep thats the one es160 classic.
Cartridge is a shure17.
Contoller issue is wierd, no errors and once its on it works perfect as long as it stays on.
Have looked for back up batteries etc but none found.
Apparently later models had a battery in a chip, but they also show error codes when it fails and this does not have that ability.
Cartridge is a shure17.
Contoller issue is wierd, no errors and once its on it works perfect as long as it stays on.
Have looked for back up batteries etc but none found.
Apparently later models had a battery in a chip, but they also show error codes when it fails and this does not have that ability.
Interesting about the records being cut louder, never knew that.
If the records were not so crazy expensive to collect now i would be tempted to get a portable player to hook up to my sonos fives.
But at £20 a record its too much for me
If the records were not so crazy expensive to collect now i would be tempted to get a portable player to hook up to my sonos fives.
But at £20 a record its too much for me
Amp is 70w per channel which is a fair bit for those days.
Uses a Darlington transistor pnp and npn, tricky buggers as the pnp needs to be isolated from the chassis and its very hard to get the screw right in the middle so the washer can isolate the screw.
The new package replacement has a silico sleeve over the end cap so was physically bigger but self isolating.
Seems to work fine anyway.
Uses a Darlington transistor pnp and npn, tricky buggers as the pnp needs to be isolated from the chassis and its very hard to get the screw right in the middle so the washer can isolate the screw.
The new package replacement has a silico sleeve over the end cap so was physically bigger but self isolating.
Seems to work fine anyway.
Thanks, it has been a very difficult job but i think its there now.
Had multiple power rails down in the amp, one channel was dead as well.
The carriage was jamming up and gummed up from old greese, i had to completely strip and rebuild cleaning all the parts and shafts and relube.
Microswitches were faulty, the optical "end of record switch" also had a transistorised relay control board which had a short holding the relay closed in the amp which ment the record was returned straight after picking.
The amp has a seperate electronic mute circuit for each channel and left would come up before right, so i had to locate a capacitor which had lost capacity (changed them on both channels).
Its great to hear it working now, the sound was horribly distorted before and so many problems i had doubts i could fix it all but just the central control unit remains but i think we will try and replace that if we can because without a schematic its just too involved to figure out how it works by probing.
Had multiple power rails down in the amp, one channel was dead as well.
The carriage was jamming up and gummed up from old greese, i had to completely strip and rebuild cleaning all the parts and shafts and relube.
Microswitches were faulty, the optical "end of record switch" also had a transistorised relay control board which had a short holding the relay closed in the amp which ment the record was returned straight after picking.
The amp has a seperate electronic mute circuit for each channel and left would come up before right, so i had to locate a capacitor which had lost capacity (changed them on both channels).
Its great to hear it working now, the sound was horribly distorted before and so many problems i had doubts i could fix it all but just the central control unit remains but i think we will try and replace that if we can because without a schematic its just too involved to figure out how it works by probing.
I could not understand some years ago after spotify was introduced in a high end listening test the audience came up with usb sticks and spotify what sounded somehow flat and lifeless.
Couldn't believe I was so outdated with my CD player!
Couldn't believe I was so outdated with my CD player!
1. Mastering may be different. I have noticed that my old CDs sound better than some of the remasters that Spotify streams. I tend to prefer Tidal. (But my car has the Spotify app, not one for Tidal, so I still use Spotify when driving.)
2. Records have a different sound than digital. My son prefers records over digital, but I am the opposite (assuming it is not a crappy remaster). Different strokes for different folks.
I think I'm saying that listening through the same speakers (different amp as juke box is integrated).
The jukebox sounds better than my cd player and spotify streamed at the highest resolution.
Its not obvious if you havent heard both, and i cannot tell the difference between cd and spotify on the highest settings, but the vinyl seems to have a more natural tone and although im struggling to describe what i hear, the sound is better to me overall.
Midrange clarity is much better i noticed things never heard before in minutes, could be a better mix on vinyl however i am listening to many different singles which i have heard all on cd, even been doing AB because i didnt believe my ears.
Bass is not as deep but again has a nice tone which means i can hear drums sounding more reall.
Treble is more subtle but definately just as detailed, cd sounds bright and in your face on treble, vinyl sounds more subtle but overall better balanced.
Minor surface noise on vinyl is obviously not on cd and thats the only negative.
There is a sense of "recording location" in vinyl, creedance clearwater vs black sabbath you can hear a sense of space in black sabath like they wanted a kind of distant sound to their recording rather than studio clean like clear water revival.
There are probably better terms to describe these phenomenon but i dont know them (im not an audiophile) but i do have a pretty good system which will show subtleties in a recording.
I can hear the deficiency's in vinyl overall but it sounds more real to me,
Its really hard to explain.
Probably on paper vinyl is worse but in real life its sounds more authentic if that makes sense, expecially on old recordings which is mostly what i am listening to.
Norman greenbaum "spirit in the sky"
That instrument he uses throughout the track sounds so detailed compared to cd (you can hear the timbre of the instrument).
The jukebox sounds better than my cd player and spotify streamed at the highest resolution.
Its not obvious if you havent heard both, and i cannot tell the difference between cd and spotify on the highest settings, but the vinyl seems to have a more natural tone and although im struggling to describe what i hear, the sound is better to me overall.
Midrange clarity is much better i noticed things never heard before in minutes, could be a better mix on vinyl however i am listening to many different singles which i have heard all on cd, even been doing AB because i didnt believe my ears.
Bass is not as deep but again has a nice tone which means i can hear drums sounding more reall.
Treble is more subtle but definately just as detailed, cd sounds bright and in your face on treble, vinyl sounds more subtle but overall better balanced.
Minor surface noise on vinyl is obviously not on cd and thats the only negative.
There is a sense of "recording location" in vinyl, creedance clearwater vs black sabbath you can hear a sense of space in black sabath like they wanted a kind of distant sound to their recording rather than studio clean like clear water revival.
There are probably better terms to describe these phenomenon but i dont know them (im not an audiophile) but i do have a pretty good system which will show subtleties in a recording.
I can hear the deficiency's in vinyl overall but it sounds more real to me,
Its really hard to explain.
Probably on paper vinyl is worse but in real life its sounds more authentic if that makes sense, expecially on old recordings which is mostly what i am listening to.
Norman greenbaum "spirit in the sky"
That instrument he uses throughout the track sounds so detailed compared to cd (you can hear the timbre of the instrument).