Hallo,
I have already shown my combination of ribbon and HiVi 7500 in the midrange dome thread, but I am not satisfied with the cheap 10” bass, I am thinking about how I should design the bass section.
The HiVi 7500 will later be separated passive at 500-800 Hz with 12 Db.
I am considering one 8“ or two 6" drivers.
The loudspeaker should later also work directly on the wall.
That's the plan...
A closed volume with a high-pass filter (condenser 900-1700uF).
If the bass tends to boom when placed on the wall, the high-pass filter can be bypassed.
Simulation 8" SB23NRXS45-8 with and without high-pass filter.
Simulation 2x6" SB17NBAC35-8
Without bass reflex the maximum volume is limited but would be enough for me.
I like the slight drop in the bass range, which helps to avoid booming.
My questions:
Are two parallel 6” speakers too loud for the HiVi 7500?
What do you think about the arrangement of two 6" bass drivers above and below the tweeter-midrange unit (distance center to center 400mm)?
If you still have questions or suggestions, please!
I have already shown my combination of ribbon and HiVi 7500 in the midrange dome thread, but I am not satisfied with the cheap 10” bass, I am thinking about how I should design the bass section.
The HiVi 7500 will later be separated passive at 500-800 Hz with 12 Db.
I am considering one 8“ or two 6" drivers.
The loudspeaker should later also work directly on the wall.
That's the plan...
A closed volume with a high-pass filter (condenser 900-1700uF).
If the bass tends to boom when placed on the wall, the high-pass filter can be bypassed.
Simulation 8" SB23NRXS45-8 with and without high-pass filter.
Simulation 2x6" SB17NBAC35-8
Without bass reflex the maximum volume is limited but would be enough for me.
I like the slight drop in the bass range, which helps to avoid booming.
My questions:
Are two parallel 6” speakers too loud for the HiVi 7500?
What do you think about the arrangement of two 6" bass drivers above and below the tweeter-midrange unit (distance center to center 400mm)?
If you still have questions or suggestions, please!
Attachments
You always could pick a crossover with both woofers in series. That way the HiVi can keep up.
Nice to see an AJHorn user around.
Nice to see an AJHorn user around.
Get better bass driver. There is new Volt RV2501 albeit price is not nice.
I would also recommend Dayton Reference 10 inch. You will need to spend 2-3 times more to make it better. Or look for some 18sound or FaitalPro drivers, like 10RS350.
I would also recommend Dayton Reference 10 inch. You will need to spend 2-3 times more to make it better. Or look for some 18sound or FaitalPro drivers, like 10RS350.
For low end: Scan speak 26W/8534 or Visaton W250S-8
For high end: Scan speak 26W/8867 or little smaller Satori WO24P-8
For high end: Scan speak 26W/8867 or little smaller Satori WO24P-8
So. I agree for the second part, however your low end propositions are not good at all: those cheap Scan Speaks (which measures like a crap vs other drivers of similar range) needs Veeeeeeerryyyy muuuchh aiiiirrrr.
Viston has extremely low efficiency, you need at least two to get something at least reasonable.
I completeley disagree with your 26W8534 ratings; its an excellent driver with very low distortion and very low mechanical losses, and one of the best choices you have. Better than WO24P for my taste (I have both drivers running here), close to the Revelator.
https://audio-hi.fi/download/pdf/Hobby-HiFi_2012-2_Scan-Speak_26W-8534G00.pdf
https://www.justdiyit.com/grand-comparatif-de-10-pouces-partie-2/4/
https://audio-hi.fi/download/pdf/Hobby-HiFi_2012-2_Scan-Speak_26W-8534G00.pdf
https://www.justdiyit.com/grand-comparatif-de-10-pouces-partie-2/4/
Last edited:
I was going to recommend the Dayton Audio RS270 also.
I have the HiVi DM-7500 with the RS270P-4, the 10" paper cone version. Dayton Discontinued the 10" paper cone last year (which is too bad, its quite good) but the standard aluminum version will go lower anyways and I'm sure is good.
If you go with an 8", consider the Dayton RS225.
All Discovery drivers have high distoring vs their price range competition.
And the OP does not have washing machine, in which that driver needs to be placed, but small 3 way enclosure.
I'd try the Silver Flute W20RC38. Yes, it's cheap but its an amazing driver. The 8 ohm version does 91 dB @ 2.8V and goes low with very good distortion performance, even compared to $100 + woofers. They're becoming my favorite woofer under $150. They have a very natural midbass response as well as down to 30 hz.
'I am not satisfied' - why?
'Are two parallel 6” speakers too loud for the HiVi' - they need a combined sensitivity of the HiVi + whatever baffle step is required (+4dB is a good target)
How big is your room? - bass is very room dependent
What kind of music?
'Are two parallel 6” speakers too loud for the HiVi' - they need a combined sensitivity of the HiVi + whatever baffle step is required (+4dB is a good target)
How big is your room? - bass is very room dependent
What kind of music?
Both logical choices.
My vote would be larger 8" even 10"
More likely for resonant frequency ( Fs ) to be lower, also likely to have good efficiency.
Lower Fs and assuming vented enclosure allows much lower vent tuning frequency
I like accurate bass created by accurate electrical cone movement.
Vented enclosure has tradeoff of reduced cone movement before and at resonance.
Response is extended but is only port energy not accurate reproduction.
For nice clean bass. port resonance is ideal with lower system resonance frequency.
More bandwidth reproduced by electrical cone movement, not port velocity ramp.
Basically speaker Fs will define port frequency. The lower the better.
I've linked independent measurements before that prove your blanket statement completely wrong....
Thank you for all the answers.
I have now decided on the Dayton RS225P 8A and am going for bass reflex after all.
I already have the 26W8534 at home, I bought 4 of them a long time ago.
Two are reserved for another project (also closed box).
But according to my philosophy, I don't want to mix soft domes and aluminum.
That's why I've now bought the Dayton and am building something with bass reflex.
I'm tuning it so that the speaker can be placed directly against the wall.
In fact, I could have tested the scanspeak 26W8534 with the HiVi...
Well, it won't be bad and one day I'll find a use for it.
In addition, I can separate higher with an 8” bass and the dispersion still fits at an angle.
Yesterday I did a quick sketch of what my near-wall speaker could look like.
It will be combined with absorbers directly on the wall.
This way I gain in the bass range and disturbing reflections are absorbed.
I have now decided on the Dayton RS225P 8A and am going for bass reflex after all.
I already have the 26W8534 at home, I bought 4 of them a long time ago.
Two are reserved for another project (also closed box).
But according to my philosophy, I don't want to mix soft domes and aluminum.
That's why I've now bought the Dayton and am building something with bass reflex.
I'm tuning it so that the speaker can be placed directly against the wall.
In fact, I could have tested the scanspeak 26W8534 with the HiVi...
Well, it won't be bad and one day I'll find a use for it.
In addition, I can separate higher with an 8” bass and the dispersion still fits at an angle.
Yesterday I did a quick sketch of what my near-wall speaker could look like.
It will be combined with absorbers directly on the wall.
This way I gain in the bass range and disturbing reflections are absorbed.
@PingPongTennis I would think someone would import them over there? You could look on ebay.
These W20RC38 work very well in larger ported cabs. I recently used them for a B&W repair. They were just going to be a cheap substitute for the odd sized NLA drivers, but they absolutely exceeded expectations when I first listened to them. The bass is very punchy and well rounded. You'd expect to hear just another cheap Chinese driver, but they are far from that.
These W20RC38 work very well in larger ported cabs. I recently used them for a B&W repair. They were just going to be a cheap substitute for the odd sized NLA drivers, but they absolutely exceeded expectations when I first listened to them. The bass is very punchy and well rounded. You'd expect to hear just another cheap Chinese driver, but they are far from that.
Attachments
I am not sure 500 hz is a safe 12db filter for that dome ? Seems more 800/900 hz is the beginning of the safe area ???
Metal driver below will need some taming around their too near resonance. You have some nice containder like the Dayton 8" . The 10" from the Discovery is attracting. The high cut off needed is challenging for the baffle step.
I find interresting but risky the mix of mid dome and a horn above. I certainly try to cut off the higher I can vis à vis of the dome dispersion in the highs...
I wanted to input about Seas ERNX or the woven URNX serie, but I fear a little about the efficienty...
The SB paper sounds goods but lacks of life in the bass...
That is nice to see some designs w/o the expensive Bliesma as well ! 🙂
Really my 2 cents, I find the bass driver to be a casse-tête choice as well...
Metal driver below will need some taming around their too near resonance. You have some nice containder like the Dayton 8" . The 10" from the Discovery is attracting. The high cut off needed is challenging for the baffle step.
I find interresting but risky the mix of mid dome and a horn above. I certainly try to cut off the higher I can vis à vis of the dome dispersion in the highs...
I wanted to input about Seas ERNX or the woven URNX serie, but I fear a little about the efficienty...
The SB paper sounds goods but lacks of life in the bass...
That is nice to see some designs w/o the expensive Bliesma as well ! 🙂
Really my 2 cents, I find the bass driver to be a casse-tête choice as well...
Have you used the SB Acoustics SB20PFCR30? If so, how do they compare to the Silver Flute?
I gave the HiVi a good pounding at 400Hz 12 dB. It survived.
With the Dayton 8” I want to go up to 600Hz and then you're really on the safe side.
The manufacturer specifies a cutting frequency of 350Hz, so it should work.
I used to have this titanium dome tweeter from Visaton which was cut off at 800 Hz but also had a much smaller cone. 3” is already an announcement. My PC speakers have a bass with this size.
I've just half-finished two cabinets and the Dayton is on its way. At the end of the week I could test it with an active crossover.😎
👍
Maybe I have mixed it with another unit. Then it gives you a lot of more choice. Maybe as well the Seas units I listed.
I'm always estonished by the good skill of some here when it comes to make cabinets ... Working with angle should not be as easy than setuping the angle on saw tables....
You have ab active crossover ? Cool thing, you can easily notch the break-ups of the Dayton ! But for the price of it here in Europe, I think the SS Disco & the Seas is good choices. If you live in North America, Dayton prices here is hard to beat. I would listen to Profiguy advices as well, always very reliable.
Maybe I have mixed it with another unit. Then it gives you a lot of more choice. Maybe as well the Seas units I listed.
I'm always estonished by the good skill of some here when it comes to make cabinets ... Working with angle should not be as easy than setuping the angle on saw tables....
You have ab active crossover ? Cool thing, you can easily notch the break-ups of the Dayton ! But for the price of it here in Europe, I think the SS Disco & the Seas is good choices. If you live in North America, Dayton prices here is hard to beat. I would listen to Profiguy advices as well, always very reliable.
Last edited: