Hi all,
Novice builder here looking to build a new wide baffle midbass cabinet for my system.
Over the years I've experimented with different horns, I prefer the big radials.
Current 4way active system contains 2 x Community Light and Sound fiberglass radial horns per side:
1" SRH w/ND350 driver (4000Hz-up)
2" BRH w/M200 driver (600Hz-4000Hz)
12" 2206H (75Hz-600Hz)
18" VBSS (down-75Hz)
The midbass cabinet with single 2206H is only 16" wide, it was originally built to compliment a much smaller horn, I now want to make it same width as 33" wide BRH.
I can buy another pair of 2206H locally for a good price.
Assuming the new cabinet is to be 33" wide... would it be best to keep the midbass as single 12" or would it be better to incorporate dual 12" instead ?
See current setup pic and drawings for new midbass concept.
Look forward to your opinions and comments.
Current 4way setup
NEW Wide Baffle midbass - Single 12" vs Dual 12"
Novice builder here looking to build a new wide baffle midbass cabinet for my system.
Over the years I've experimented with different horns, I prefer the big radials.
Current 4way active system contains 2 x Community Light and Sound fiberglass radial horns per side:
1" SRH w/ND350 driver (4000Hz-up)
2" BRH w/M200 driver (600Hz-4000Hz)
12" 2206H (75Hz-600Hz)
18" VBSS (down-75Hz)
The midbass cabinet with single 2206H is only 16" wide, it was originally built to compliment a much smaller horn, I now want to make it same width as 33" wide BRH.
I can buy another pair of 2206H locally for a good price.
Assuming the new cabinet is to be 33" wide... would it be best to keep the midbass as single 12" or would it be better to incorporate dual 12" instead ?
See current setup pic and drawings for new midbass concept.
Look forward to your opinions and comments.
Current 4way setup
NEW Wide Baffle midbass - Single 12" vs Dual 12"
Better regarding what parameters?
I see a clear advantage in having two 12" vs one on membrane area and efficiency ( lower distortion).
The directivity behaviour could be a different story when matched to the horn ( hypothetical as you do not give info about the horn behaviour at xover (600hz)).
The 2x12" could easily be simulated to know what to expect from them. And i would strongly advice to check what'll happen on this point.
For bsc with 33" wide baffle you can expect the freq to be around 140hz ( 137hz) so up to ~550hz, here again 2x12" will be 'better'.
I see a clear advantage in having two 12" vs one on membrane area and efficiency ( lower distortion).
The directivity behaviour could be a different story when matched to the horn ( hypothetical as you do not give info about the horn behaviour at xover (600hz)).
The 2x12" could easily be simulated to know what to expect from them. And i would strongly advice to check what'll happen on this point.
For bsc with 33" wide baffle you can expect the freq to be around 140hz ( 137hz) so up to ~550hz, here again 2x12" will be 'better'.
@krivium, better regarding 'most' parameters. Knowing there is always compromises, I'm trying to understand which would be more suitable to my application, overall. I appreciate your insight.
From an old BRH datasheet the directivity behavior at 600Hz is -3dB @ 85 degrees, -6dB @ 90degrees.
I tried using Edge software and noticed dual drivers appeared more even up to 550Hz vs single driver which appeared more like a bell curve. Admittedly I don't much about BSC but think I understand what you mean by it being 'better'.
From an old BRH datasheet the directivity behavior at 600Hz is -3dB @ 85 degrees, -6dB @ 90degrees.
I tried using Edge software and noticed dual drivers appeared more even up to 550Hz vs single driver which appeared more like a bell curve. Admittedly I don't much about BSC but think I understand what you mean by it being 'better'.
Looks like fun.
2x12 seems good
2x15 would work too.
Some Onken style cabinets
are around 31 to 32 inches
could be extended.
2x12 seems good
2x15 would work too.
Some Onken style cabinets
are around 31 to 32 inches
could be extended.
@marconi118, I really like the sound of the JBL 2206H, used as a lower mid/midbass it is an excellent driver. I've tried using it with smaller horns up to 1.2kHz-1.6kHz and it sounded very good too. Personally, don't think I would be satisfied using it without a subwoofer though.
I would try something more up to date software for simulation, like Vituixcad.
From some study i've done about this kind of config (but with TH-4001 instead of biradial) 500/600hz is the upper limit for 2x12", beyond that and there is serious lobing appearing from woofers configuration.
It kind of explained why i prefered the Kinoshita Rm7 ( d'appolito config) to the Rm4 ( 2x15" juxtaposed) i've heard. I felt the Rm4 were too directive at xover freq.
http://www.reyaudio.com/large-e.html
I spent time in front of another system using 2x12" and TH4001 and it was less severe issue with this but it was dsp filtered using much steeper slope and xed lower in freq ( circa 500hz iirc) which helped too.
See attached file.
Kind of explained the choices made about the Rey Audio's Warp monitors ( Kinoshita's baby too) were 12" are used instead of 15" and even lower xover freq at 420hz. And they are angled too ( Auspurger used same arrangement with their studio monitors too) in order to widen sweetspot.
http://www.reyaudio.com/warp-e.html
Attachments
do you plan 2x 2206h and keep the subwoofers?
I am going 2 way without sub crossed at 800hz still uncertain to use 2206 or 2226...
I am going 2 way without sub crossed at 800hz still uncertain to use 2206 or 2226...
@WhiteDragon, I would need to invest quite a bit more in buying some nice 15" drivers. A few years ago I had a pair of Kappa Pro 15" but the 2206 sounded much better. Haven't experimented with other 12" or 15" options since I got the 2206's.
Is it safe to assume the dual driver layout in the Onken style cabs would be vertical ?
Is it safe to assume the dual driver layout in the Onken style cabs would be vertical ?
@krivium, thanks for the links. This angled design is way beyond my capabilities but definitely gives me something to research and perhaps copy a proven design. Leaning towards the dual 12's. I can experiment and drop my crossover down to 500Hz, the horn flare rate is 240Hz. Using LR 24dB slopes now, but I can also experiment here too.
@marconi118, yes I plan to keep the subwoofers. I often listen to bass heavy music so playback down to 25Hz-30Hz is a requirement for my system. Depends on your musical taste, you might be content with 2 x 2206. You'll definitely dig deeper with the 2226, that would be my choice without using subwoofer.
It seems you're looking at response in one spot. For all we know it might just average all over and not be a problem..