I got ahold of 12 pics of Peerless 830870 midbass drivers and wanted some ideas for a fun project with them.
I bought them based on their very flat and extended FR and other specs.
I was thinking of perhaps a circular array with 6 drivers surrounding a horn loaded tweeter of sorts ie. Morel CAT378
Any ideas or thoughts?
I bought them based on their very flat and extended FR and other specs.
I was thinking of perhaps a circular array with 6 drivers surrounding a horn loaded tweeter of sorts ie. Morel CAT378
Any ideas or thoughts?
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we use them for helper woofers, but they reach up quite a ways.
Heven’t put the drivers back into these.
dave
Heven’t put the drivers back into these.
dave
FWIW, in the late '70s did a similar POC using an abandoned 36" satellite dish, (8) inexpensive mobile audio whizzer cone 6.5" 'FR' drivers and Altec 511/1000 Hz/1st and once level adjusted/CD horn EQ'd 'we' were quite pleased with it as a backyard speaker for cul-de-sac parties behind our (then) property. Not so great up close, though corner loaded in the ~26' x 46' half cathedral ceiling 'great' room it did way better than I'd assumed once far enough away, so if I hadn't been so horn centric at the time, using some quality wide range Altec 414 or similar might have been the 'hot ticket' 😉..........
Anyway, looking forward to your POC since for folks that can handle the width I consider it a very viable option when controlled directivity is a prime goal.
Anyway, looking forward to your POC since for folks that can handle the width I consider it a very viable option when controlled directivity is a prime goal.
Both interesting ideas.
@GM - ingenious recycling of a satellite dish. I was thinking of some wall surface mounted, shallow cabs. I'm sure WinISD could sim the multiple driver gain and LF extension. With a higher Qts and Fs, this driver doesn't strike me as a very useful candidate for a ported box, unless I'm willing to settle for lousy LF transient response.
@GM - ingenious recycling of a satellite dish. I was thinking of some wall surface mounted, shallow cabs. I'm sure WinISD could sim the multiple driver gain and LF extension. With a higher Qts and Fs, this driver doesn't strike me as a very useful candidate for a ported box, unless I'm willing to settle for lousy LF transient response.
No, not really; forgot to mention mine was OB as the drivers were nearly 2 Qt for use in open/flat dash, lossy kick panels etc..
@bucks bunny - i like the look of those alot. I forgot about the concept of omnis. Could be interesting in a larger room. I have fond memories of the ITT sphere speakers from back in the day.
Assuming similar behavior to a large coax, xover point shouldn't be hard to determine. I could use a larger tweeter like the TW034 in a WG to allow for a lower xover, but I really like the CAT378 alot.
For a while there, I was trying to restore a set of Infinity Preludes:
https://www.diyaudio.com/community/threads/restoring-infinity-preludes.327540/
As with all of my projects, I didn't finish it. But the midbasses that you have were the best match I could find for the Infinity speakers. Each side has one subwoofer, four midbasses, two midranges and a tweeter. Efficiency is in the 90s IIRC. The speaker was Stereophile rated Class A or B in the 90s IIRC.
https://www.diyaudio.com/community/threads/restoring-infinity-preludes.327540/
As with all of my projects, I didn't finish it. But the midbasses that you have were the best match I could find for the Infinity speakers. Each side has one subwoofer, four midbasses, two midranges and a tweeter. Efficiency is in the 90s IIRC. The speaker was Stereophile rated Class A or B in the 90s IIRC.
I vote for an active cardioid Kii style. Although I’m not sure about the distribution of six units.
A thin floorstanding line array with a tiny horn on the top, drivers spaced at such distance where the tweeter is brought to a desired height. Or.. more transportable array (requiring a stand) with the tweeter in the center and all the drivers stacked to a minimum space (would be 30"/75cm+ tall) In both cases drivers 3 paraller 2 series, no xover necessary and tweeter with a sensitivity of at least 96db/2.83V (=about the same as max sensitivity of the woofers 3/2@2.83V) crossed 2th order around 10k, opposite polarity to woofers and depth set to such with the best match in phase..
Haha, and for the fun of it.. why not test a small closed cube with the drivers pointing to all directions, to be hanged from the ceiling by its own cable, might sound interesting, depending on the room and placement.. no tweeters here and all that nice high frequency capability used..
Haha, and for the fun of it.. why not test a small closed cube with the drivers pointing to all directions, to be hanged from the ceiling by its own cable, might sound interesting, depending on the room and placement.. no tweeters here and all that nice high frequency capability used..
Would love to see the ring of peerless around the CAT378 plus a SB Bianco 15OB350 in an Open Baffle setup. The SB 15OB was used by Scott Hinson in his OB3 available as a kit from Madisound.
Below I had a very quick look-see > Note not for use, manufacturer data, no baffle loss, XY position or diffraction - so pretty meaningless but looks like they may play nicely together with xovers around 275hz and 3500hz giving around 90-92dB sensitivity depending on the baffle step.
Something like this - http://www.dnaudio.com/DNA Speaker.html
Below I had a very quick look-see > Note not for use, manufacturer data, no baffle loss, XY position or diffraction - so pretty meaningless but looks like they may play nicely together with xovers around 275hz and 3500hz giving around 90-92dB sensitivity depending on the baffle step.
Something like this - http://www.dnaudio.com/DNA Speaker.html
@Ugg10 - I saw that thread and looked it over carefully. There's alot to like about it regarding performance, but I'm convinced with the right tweeter and (not too complicated) xover, it could yield satisfying results to go with a less techy design with more drivers.
From what I've already learned, the circular array I propose is similar to a large coax, so some of those rules would apply. The biggest factor IMO is choosing xover frequency and slopes, especially considering a passive solution with the needed phase response.
That said, I'd be open to basic DSP application, but not several channels of shading and the necessary amplification for it to work well enough. If possible, I'd like to use analog filters. If I need time alignment, DSP is the way to go. I just want to try simplicity first, then apply the more complex solutions as needed.
The main reason I'm intrigued by a circular array is the lack of info on them compared to line arrays. The other reason is partial efficiency gain and the cool look. Im also open to some omni solutions, like the design above using complex geometrical shapes. I just don't want super complex signal processing if it's avoidable.
Another aspect is using a WG, sort of like a MEH but without the complexity of design. I chose these drivers based on their flat FR and reputation, not so much for their potential fit for WG applications. Im open to the use of WGs in this design, but I don't want to build another typical MEH - I believe these drivers aren't as suitable for this compared to lighter weight paper cone equipped drivers.
From what I've already learned, the circular array I propose is similar to a large coax, so some of those rules would apply. The biggest factor IMO is choosing xover frequency and slopes, especially considering a passive solution with the needed phase response.
That said, I'd be open to basic DSP application, but not several channels of shading and the necessary amplification for it to work well enough. If possible, I'd like to use analog filters. If I need time alignment, DSP is the way to go. I just want to try simplicity first, then apply the more complex solutions as needed.
The main reason I'm intrigued by a circular array is the lack of info on them compared to line arrays. The other reason is partial efficiency gain and the cool look. Im also open to some omni solutions, like the design above using complex geometrical shapes. I just don't want super complex signal processing if it's avoidable.
Another aspect is using a WG, sort of like a MEH but without the complexity of design. I chose these drivers based on their flat FR and reputation, not so much for their potential fit for WG applications. Im open to the use of WGs in this design, but I don't want to build another typical MEH - I believe these drivers aren't as suitable for this compared to lighter weight paper cone equipped drivers.
BTW I've found 2 more 830870s, making it a total of 14 pcs. Having 16 would open up more possibilities, but I don't want to spend top dollar just to get 2 more. If someone had another new pair for a reasonable price, I'd be open to taking them off their hands.
Tweeters i have to choose from are Morel CAT378, SS H2606-9200, Seas H1212. H0881, Audax TW034, TW025A28, Vifa D27TG45, Peerless DA32TX, SB Acoustics SB26STCN.
Also have some Morel CAM558 and SS D7608-9200 I've considered putting in the center along with an offset smaller dome ie SB26STCN. That would allow for lower xover.
Also have some Morel CAM558 and SS D7608-9200 I've considered putting in the center along with an offset smaller dome ie SB26STCN. That would allow for lower xover.
Something like this-
https://www.martinlogan.com/en/product/motion-slm
https://www.eastporters.com/product/martinlogan-motion-slm-lcr-ultra-slim-on-wall-speaker-high-gloss-black/?utm_source=bing&utm_medium=cpc&utm_term=&utm_campaign=0 - Standard Shopping Campaign&msclkid=c12f1b2b1dfc1ba26f0c7f15ff8699ff
PE Showcase- Open Baffle Rookie
https://projectgallery.parts-express.com/speaker-projects/open-baffle-rookie/
https://www.martinlogan.com/en/product/motion-slm
https://www.eastporters.com/product/martinlogan-motion-slm-lcr-ultra-slim-on-wall-speaker-high-gloss-black/?utm_source=bing&utm_medium=cpc&utm_term=&utm_campaign=0 - Standard Shopping Campaign&msclkid=c12f1b2b1dfc1ba26f0c7f15ff8699ff
PE Showcase- Open Baffle Rookie
https://projectgallery.parts-express.com/speaker-projects/open-baffle-rookie/
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Thats along the lines of what I considered, although I don't want to restrict myself to wall mounted line array solutions alone. A narrow vertical dispersion HF driver has its benefits here, but the narrow listening window is a turnoff. I honestly don't like AMTs that much, but thats a whole different discussion.