I am designing studio monitors for an 800 sq. ft room that need wide dispersion and more SPL than I can get from standard hifi drivers within the budget I was given. There will be subs so I don't need the mains to go much below 50 or 60Hz. I will likely be using two Faital Pro NFE400 woofers for 50Hz-300Hz. I plan on using a compression driver and a horn for 1500Hz and up. I need recommendations on a mid-range driver. The system will be all active with a MiniDSP processor and a Buckeye 6 Channel Hypex Ncore amplifier (500 watts for the low woofers and 250 watts each for the mid and high).
These are the three mid-range drivers I'm looking at (mostly because they're round and that will make it easier to get them flush mounted on the baffle since I don't have a CNC machine). They also fit the budget which is around $100 a driver.
I'm leaning towards the B&C driver because of their reputation, but I am unable to find any independent measurements, especially distortion. These speakers will be used to mix on and I am hoping that they can be as transparent as possible after I flatten them out with the active crossover.
Thanks in advance for your thoughts. I would love to hear from anyone who has used these drivers or has another recommendation.
These are the three mid-range drivers I'm looking at (mostly because they're round and that will make it easier to get them flush mounted on the baffle since I don't have a CNC machine). They also fit the budget which is around $100 a driver.
Ciare CMR160 6.5" Full-Range Driver 4 Ohm
LaVoce MAN061.80 6-1/2" Neodymium Midrange Woofer 8 Ohm
B&C 6PEV13 6-1/2" Midrange Speaker
I'm leaning towards the B&C driver because of their reputation, but I am unable to find any independent measurements, especially distortion. These speakers will be used to mix on and I am hoping that they can be as transparent as possible after I flatten them out with the active crossover.
Thanks in advance for your thoughts. I would love to hear from anyone who has used these drivers or has another recommendation.
They are 3 slightly different drivers.
Ciare
+ sensitivity 93dB.. but
- 4 ohm driver
Lavoce
8 ohm driver
+sensitivity 93dB
+smooth response
-Lavoce datasheets have significant smoothing applied.
B&C
8 ohm driver
+ very sensitive (99dB)
- response less smooth
Here's my measurement of MAN061.80
Ciare
+ sensitivity 93dB.. but
- 4 ohm driver
Lavoce
8 ohm driver
+sensitivity 93dB
+smooth response
-Lavoce datasheets have significant smoothing applied.
B&C
8 ohm driver
+ very sensitive (99dB)
- response less smooth
Here's my measurement of MAN061.80
Wow. Thank you for this! It certainly is smooth on-axis. The distortion doesn't look bad for the price range. There's a bump there at 660Hz but this driver is very useable between 300Hz and 2Khz. Did you end up using it in a speaker?
I haven’t yet.
From a low DI / wide dispersion point of view, a 6.5” cone driver works best under 1KHz.
From a harmonic distortion point of view, my interpretation of the data is that it works best between 500Hz and 2.5KHz.
My plan when I acquired these was to transform it into a pure midrange coaxial.
I have had some hiccups but will continue with that plan.
If I was looking for a pure midrange for 400+Hz use, I would look 4” sized drivers. In this price point the only ones with copper caps are the Faital Pro 4FE35/42, and Lavoce FSN041.0, but they may not have high enough sensitivity (89dB/W) for your use,
but the do have lower directivity wider dispersion than a 6” cone.
I do have preliminary measurements of the 4Fe42, but need to retake them…
From a low DI / wide dispersion point of view, a 6.5” cone driver works best under 1KHz.
From a harmonic distortion point of view, my interpretation of the data is that it works best between 500Hz and 2.5KHz.
My plan when I acquired these was to transform it into a pure midrange coaxial.
I have had some hiccups but will continue with that plan.
If I was looking for a pure midrange for 400+Hz use, I would look 4” sized drivers. In this price point the only ones with copper caps are the Faital Pro 4FE35/42, and Lavoce FSN041.0, but they may not have high enough sensitivity (89dB/W) for your use,
but the do have lower directivity wider dispersion than a 6” cone.
I do have preliminary measurements of the 4Fe42, but need to retake them…
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The problem with the 4" drivers is the SPL capabilities. I'm fine with a 6.5" and a compression driver crossed in the 1.5Khz range. Thanks again for having that distortion measurement. I am leaning towards using that driver for this project now.
B&C 8pe21 is the finest midrange driver I’ve ever heard or used in HiFi/high output situations.
https://www.parts-express.com/pedocs/specs/294-652--bc-8pe21-spec-sheet.pdf
It’s also a better directivity match for an intended xo region of 1.5k to reduce a bunch up.
https://www.parts-express.com/pedocs/specs/294-652--bc-8pe21-spec-sheet.pdf
It’s also a better directivity match for an intended xo region of 1.5k to reduce a bunch up.
Yeah. An 8" is too big. My main woofers are 8". My biggest problem is I want a round woofer so it's easier to flush mount, but all of these mid ranges are shaped differently so I'm probably just going to have to make a jig and figure it out. I'm leaning towards a 5" mid woofer now after some thought and direction from tktran303.
Beymas 4FRxx range.
https://usspeaker.com/beyma 4FR40-1.htm
https://www.redcatt.net/html/cn/details251.html
https://bassfacecaraudio.co.uk/prod...und-quality-ultra-full-range-speaker/teamsq44
https://lavocespeakers.com/single-product/?id=49
https://lavocespeakers.com/single-product/?id=49
https://loudspeakerdatabase.com/LaVoce/FSN041.00
https://en.toutlehautparleur.com/br...aker-kartesian-wib100-vpa-s-8-ohm-4-inch.html
@Arez has the right idea though, by shortlisting drivers with
-smooth and flat amplitude response out from 2x the impedance peak to 1 octave beyond where you intend to use it
-smooth and flat impedance responses, with minimal (or lack of) resonances out to 1 octave beyond where you intend to use it.
Until manufacturers produce more detailed datasheets (I'm not holding my breath) this is how I shortlisted the Lavoce MAN06.180 and Faital 4FE42 drivers to acquire and test, based on what @TMM taught us
The FSN04.10 / FSF04.10 was also on my radar. But knowing that the Lavoce datasheets are smoothing applied, I'm a little reluctant.
The Beyma is the opposites- very sharp graphs!
Now I don't mind paying for performance, when it's there eg. Purifi.
I'm buying electromechanical devices, not audio jewellery.
Until FSAF is more widely used, we are stuck with sine-sweep measurements:
luckily @stoneeh had previously measured the MAN061.80 and his measurement is consistent with mine. So there's a total sample size of 2 or 3 in the public domain...
-smooth and flat amplitude response out from 2x the impedance peak to 1 octave beyond where you intend to use it
-smooth and flat impedance responses, with minimal (or lack of) resonances out to 1 octave beyond where you intend to use it.
Until manufacturers produce more detailed datasheets (I'm not holding my breath) this is how I shortlisted the Lavoce MAN06.180 and Faital 4FE42 drivers to acquire and test, based on what @TMM taught us
The FSN04.10 / FSF04.10 was also on my radar. But knowing that the Lavoce datasheets are smoothing applied, I'm a little reluctant.
The Beyma is the opposites- very sharp graphs!
Now I don't mind paying for performance, when it's there eg. Purifi.
I'm buying electromechanical devices, not audio jewellery.
Until FSAF is more widely used, we are stuck with sine-sweep measurements:
luckily @stoneeh had previously measured the MAN061.80 and his measurement is consistent with mine. So there's a total sample size of 2 or 3 in the public domain...
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I have Lavoce in 3way, 400-1800Hz. Very good measurements, little bit challanging rolloff (higher order crossover needed). Keeps its performance also at very loud levels. I dont have so many listening experiences, but it sounds very clean. In comparison with another speakers with Scanspeak 15m4531k, lavoce is cleaner (but it is comparison of very different speakers and setups)
Btw, back then I made midrange decision, I considered also Faital 6rs140 (some constructers like this driver a lot), but I was not able to find any independent measurements (audioxpress test distortion looks strange)
Btw, back then I made midrange decision, I considered also Faital 6rs140 (some constructers like this driver a lot), but I was not able to find any independent measurements (audioxpress test distortion looks strange)
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I read (I believe) on another DIY forum a post where someone tested the LaVoce MAN061 at various power levels and the distortion basically remained low for all of them. Seems like a very good driver of that size and it is not expensive.
Also, these comments by user @Eric J :
Good to know
Yup. If it was up to me, it would be an all Purifi design. But they don't fit the budget for this project.
I'm using an active crossover so I'm not worried if the slopes have to be steeper. The challenge is that it has to get louder than a regular hifi setup but also be low distortion and fit a tight budget. It sounds like this could be a good choice for the mid-range. Thank you!