Yup, Ed's gone and a shuffle of current exec's.
https://www.cnn.com/2024/02/21/busi...cutive Ed Clark,ongoing problems with the jet.
jeff
https://www.cnn.com/2024/02/21/busi...cutive Ed Clark,ongoing problems with the jet.
jeff
Yes, there are many questions - will the right person replace him, and will enough other "right people" come in to replace current management to get it back to a more safety-conscious organization?
Or will Boeing have another "bad day?" This wasn't Boeing, but like the door panel blowing out it was from missing bolts, and at least two groups not doing something right, the group that removed the bolts and not documenting that they did so, and the group that turned the stand not checking that the bolts were still there. If only ONE of them had followed established procedures this wouldn't have happened.
Sorry for the long link, most sensible URLs are easily trimmable, but not Googe Images links:
https://www.google.com/search?q=bad...g&ei=1IfWZYPiGfbZptQPo5aq6Ak&bih=632&biw=1280
Or will Boeing have another "bad day?" This wasn't Boeing, but like the door panel blowing out it was from missing bolts, and at least two groups not doing something right, the group that removed the bolts and not documenting that they did so, and the group that turned the stand not checking that the bolts were still there. If only ONE of them had followed established procedures this wouldn't have happened.
Sorry for the long link, most sensible URLs are easily trimmable, but not Googe Images links:
https://www.google.com/search?q=bad...g&ei=1IfWZYPiGfbZptQPo5aq6Ak&bih=632&biw=1280
C919 in China now in final stages of entering certification and full production, IIRC 4 units are in airline service already.
Given the style of Chinese production, they are quite likely to mass produce them, at a rate exceeding the competition.
There is a ready market for them, and their quoted price is much below the Western prices.
I am in the plastic industry, there are at least ten makers in China each producing more than 10,000 injection moulding machines annually.
The largest non Chinese / Taiwanese producers are at the 5,000 or so mark, from many continents (Cincinnati has factories in India among other places, they make 5,000 all put together).
My information may be out of date, or my memory may be hazy...criticism is welcome.
Imagine what will happen if China starts making the C919 at 1500 annually...or more than that.
Given the style of Chinese production, they are quite likely to mass produce them, at a rate exceeding the competition.
There is a ready market for them, and their quoted price is much below the Western prices.
I am in the plastic industry, there are at least ten makers in China each producing more than 10,000 injection moulding machines annually.
The largest non Chinese / Taiwanese producers are at the 5,000 or so mark, from many continents (Cincinnati has factories in India among other places, they make 5,000 all put together).
My information may be out of date, or my memory may be hazy...criticism is welcome.
Imagine what will happen if China starts making the C919 at 1500 annually...or more than that.
Strongly disagree. The environment of the factory/company needs to be one where those employees are constantly empowered and encouraged to follow and use the procedures and QC in a compliance-forward, no-fault system.
People WANT to do things right. Make the environment to do so.
That’s what was/is missing at Spirit and Boeing.
People WANT to do things right. Make the environment to do so.
That’s what was/is missing at Spirit and Boeing.
This line from the article tells you all need to know:
"
You would think that what they fear most is a plane going down. But apparently they're ok with that.
"
Where Boeing goes from here
The outcome Boeing, its investors, and its customers fear most: a repeat of the delays that have saddled the manufacturer with giant stockpiles of planes waiting for delivery"You would think that what they fear most is a plane going down. But apparently they're ok with that.
Our aged people tell us that a person's basic nature will not change after 12 years of age.
That is why a new mindset is difficult to achieve for a 40 year old who is probably divorced, paying off mortgages, and child support.
And doing alcohol / drugs to reduce stress.
The result is a person not fully alert, and physically not at peak due to sleep deprivation and poor eating habits.
This has happened in the Detroit area in the auto industry, must be well documented if you look hard enough.
That industry also could not compete or innovate enough to withstand competition, that always happens when the management gets complacent.
And it is not the only place where it happened, many US and European manufacturers shifted to China for reasons of cost and ease of doing business, they had had enough of workers making unusual demands.
It happened in India as well, the canteen contractor at the Parke-Davis factory in Bombay could not supply the contracted midnight snack, and offered a similar snack instead.
They went on flash strike, the plant manager had to go across town, got the snack made at a five star hotel coffee shop, and the production started at 4 am.
As a result, the plant was shifted out of the city, most workers quit, (they were offered work at the new location, did not want to shift 150 km), and starved / drank to death or worked at lower wages as odd job workers, a 45 year old is difficult to absorb as an employee.
The Benadryl production is now done at a contract manufacturer many miles away, the company now works as a trader.
The problem at Spirit is that the management or supervisors are allowing shoddy goods to be made and supplied, their thinking needs change, and with an aged workforce who got away with making rubbish, it will be difficult.
Also, Mitsubishi makes the wings in Japan, no problems reported in a much more complex part....so it is also to be thought about.
And believe me, when Toyota set up a factory in the USA, they preferred to be far away from Detroit, because they needed fresh taught workers, not already taught workers with old style working in their heads.
That is why a new mindset is difficult to achieve for a 40 year old who is probably divorced, paying off mortgages, and child support.
And doing alcohol / drugs to reduce stress.
The result is a person not fully alert, and physically not at peak due to sleep deprivation and poor eating habits.
This has happened in the Detroit area in the auto industry, must be well documented if you look hard enough.
That industry also could not compete or innovate enough to withstand competition, that always happens when the management gets complacent.
And it is not the only place where it happened, many US and European manufacturers shifted to China for reasons of cost and ease of doing business, they had had enough of workers making unusual demands.
It happened in India as well, the canteen contractor at the Parke-Davis factory in Bombay could not supply the contracted midnight snack, and offered a similar snack instead.
They went on flash strike, the plant manager had to go across town, got the snack made at a five star hotel coffee shop, and the production started at 4 am.
As a result, the plant was shifted out of the city, most workers quit, (they were offered work at the new location, did not want to shift 150 km), and starved / drank to death or worked at lower wages as odd job workers, a 45 year old is difficult to absorb as an employee.
The Benadryl production is now done at a contract manufacturer many miles away, the company now works as a trader.
The problem at Spirit is that the management or supervisors are allowing shoddy goods to be made and supplied, their thinking needs change, and with an aged workforce who got away with making rubbish, it will be difficult.
Also, Mitsubishi makes the wings in Japan, no problems reported in a much more complex part....so it is also to be thought about.
And believe me, when Toyota set up a factory in the USA, they preferred to be far away from Detroit, because they needed fresh taught workers, not already taught workers with old style working in their heads.
One of the problems at Boeing is poor subcontractor management.
A company like Boeing, or a large automaker -for example- rely on their subs to do good work and to verify the design requirements that the prime specifies.
This requires money.... It raises the price of the product. If Boeing or its subs gets cheap ( guess...) or puts its short term finances first, well.
Example. Eons ago I worked two contracts on the CSS (cabin subsystem). Both contracts relied on talking to each other to manage the PA system. They used a discrete keyline between them. As it just so happened, I programmed the first system at one company and then went to program the other side at another company... lo and behold I realized the requirements were wrong. What was true on one side was false on the other. The interface specification was incorrect.
So, I brought this up to my boss at the second job... they could have easily dropped the whole thing. They could have delivered the product per specs, passed Acceptance testing and got paid... BUT, once they integrated the system, it would have NOT worked.
To my satisfaction, the management did bring this up to Boeing, they caught their error and updated OUR requirement at very little cost.
When the stuff got put together, it worked.
But this called for good management, a long term QC plan and good prime/sub coordination. I doubt this is the case with this Spirit/Boeing relationship.
A company like Boeing, or a large automaker -for example- rely on their subs to do good work and to verify the design requirements that the prime specifies.
This requires money.... It raises the price of the product. If Boeing or its subs gets cheap ( guess...) or puts its short term finances first, well.
Example. Eons ago I worked two contracts on the CSS (cabin subsystem). Both contracts relied on talking to each other to manage the PA system. They used a discrete keyline between them. As it just so happened, I programmed the first system at one company and then went to program the other side at another company... lo and behold I realized the requirements were wrong. What was true on one side was false on the other. The interface specification was incorrect.
So, I brought this up to my boss at the second job... they could have easily dropped the whole thing. They could have delivered the product per specs, passed Acceptance testing and got paid... BUT, once they integrated the system, it would have NOT worked.
To my satisfaction, the management did bring this up to Boeing, they caught their error and updated OUR requirement at very little cost.
When the stuff got put together, it worked.
But this called for good management, a long term QC plan and good prime/sub coordination. I doubt this is the case with this Spirit/Boeing relationship.
797... baby 787 coming up.
No choice.
It will be much better in the long term as the 737 is simply too low to the ground.
That, or they will be stoopid and just build new wings and a new wing box
Or, they could be really stoopid and lower the price and sell it for peanuts.
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Jedi, the point was a worker who is 45 years old is difficult to train for another job, most are let go, and find lower paid work outside their fields.
If you are going from metal to composite, a lot less metal workers are needed, and the old workers are let go, instead of training for the new material, because their way of banging metal will not work on a composite part when it is in the green stage before curing.
And many have issues with their lives, mostly out of management control..better to end the matter than let it become a liability, a younger worker will be cheaper, more physically active, and easier to train.
We could propose robots for a lot of this work, easier to program again, no sick leave, etc.
That requires a big investment and a sense of purpose, which seems lacking at Boeing right now.
If you are going from metal to composite, a lot less metal workers are needed, and the old workers are let go, instead of training for the new material, because their way of banging metal will not work on a composite part when it is in the green stage before curing.
And many have issues with their lives, mostly out of management control..better to end the matter than let it become a liability, a younger worker will be cheaper, more physically active, and easier to train.
We could propose robots for a lot of this work, easier to program again, no sick leave, etc.
That requires a big investment and a sense of purpose, which seems lacking at Boeing right now.
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