Not to mention all of the cars and big trucks smashed up along the side of the road.
Not really a problem for most modern cars even at -20 F if the battery is relatively new and not run down from age. But for the all electrics it clearly is a problem getting them to perform and even be recharged at those temperatures.
Appropriate to the conversation: Electric vehicles fail at a lower rate than gas cars in extreme cold
Data from Norway where there is both the largest concentration of electrik cars and it gets cold there.
dave
Data from Norway where there is both the largest concentration of electrik cars and it gets cold there.
dave
As the article rightly points out most electric vehicles are much newer than gas powered vehicles and that could be a significant factor in the difference in failure rate. So it's difficult to make an absolute assessment in comparing the two.
that article Dave pointed to notes a key takeaway from the fuss in Chicago which was that the charging points weren't working in the cold.
It's clear that if you live somewhere cold enough to need a block heater with your ICE car you probably need to plug your EV in at night to prewarm the battery or park it up full each night.
Other places I can't help wondering if the manufacturers haven't educated users fully or the users refuse to RTFM and adjust their schedules accordingly. So not parking up on a cold night with only 10% in the battery thinking 'I'll top it up in the morning' which we've all done (and got the coffee and donut at the same time).
Batteries can be sadistic BTW. My aging diesel didn't start first crank a few times in early december when we had a cold snap. So I ordered a new battery. As soon as it was paid for it's been starting perfectly each time. Will still fit it as soon as I get a chance as I think its the original the car came with so 15 years old. But still annoying.
It's clear that if you live somewhere cold enough to need a block heater with your ICE car you probably need to plug your EV in at night to prewarm the battery or park it up full each night.
Other places I can't help wondering if the manufacturers haven't educated users fully or the users refuse to RTFM and adjust their schedules accordingly. So not parking up on a cold night with only 10% in the battery thinking 'I'll top it up in the morning' which we've all done (and got the coffee and donut at the same time).
Batteries can be sadistic BTW. My aging diesel didn't start first crank a few times in early december when we had a cold snap. So I ordered a new battery. As soon as it was paid for it's been starting perfectly each time. Will still fit it as soon as I get a chance as I think its the original the car came with so 15 years old. But still annoying.
From the Daily Mail
'Tesla graveyards' form in Chicago as arctic blast runs batteries flat
Tesla supercharging stations around Chicago have become what some residents are referring to as ' Tesla graveyards' as the arctic blast runs their batteries flat. EV owners have spent days crowded around charging stations, hopelessly trying to power up their cars in temperatures as low as -5 °F and in many cases left with no option but to hire a flatbed truck to bring their vehicles home.
The batteries charge much, much slower if they're cold. It's just like your cell phone. I get messages like "reduced charge rate because of cold temp" on my cellphone if I leave it sit in a cold part of the shop.
Back in the day there was J.C. Whitney and they had everything automotive. One popular item was a heated jacket for your battery. I forget if it plugged into the wall or needed an auxiliary battery, but there you go. Anyone that browsed the J.C Whitney catalog would be able to figure out how to rig it up.
My father had one of those ill-fated Oldsmobile diesel cars in the early 1980s. One January day the temperature got down to -27 degrees F (a record that has been tied once since then). The Olds had two batteries, and built-in plug in heaters and battery chargers. The car had "glow plugs" (combustion chamber pre-heaters) and a heater in the gas tank. My father didn't think it would even start, but it fired right up. The car went about ten miles, stalled, and didn't start back up. He had to be rescued by a passing motorist, a very dangerous situation in that kind of weather.
Back in the day there was J.C. Whitney and they had everything automotive. One popular item was a heated jacket for your battery. I forget if it plugged into the wall or needed an auxiliary battery, but there you go. Anyone that browsed the J.C Whitney catalog would be able to figure out how to rig it up.
My father had one of those ill-fated Oldsmobile diesel cars in the early 1980s. One January day the temperature got down to -27 degrees F (a record that has been tied once since then). The Olds had two batteries, and built-in plug in heaters and battery chargers. The car had "glow plugs" (combustion chamber pre-heaters) and a heater in the gas tank. My father didn't think it would even start, but it fired right up. The car went about ten miles, stalled, and didn't start back up. He had to be rescued by a passing motorist, a very dangerous situation in that kind of weather.
Well, it's nice that you don't have a problem, but lots of other people do. Here are just a few examples being reported by Newsweek.
Tyler Beard, a Tesla owner in the satellite town of Oak Brook, Illinois, told Fox32 that his car remained on zero percent battery after attempting to charge it for three hours at a time on two successive days.
"This is crazy. It's a disaster," Chalis Mizelle, another Tesla owner, told the outlet, adding she abandoned her car to ride with a friend after it failed to charge.
It's also being reported that in its owner's manual, Tesla advises motorists that they should drive to a charging location 30-45 minutes away or precondition the battery before driving in order to adequately warm the battery so it can sustain charging.
So no problem, right? In cold weather just drive to a charging station 30 to 45 minutes away instead of the one that is around the corner that you usually use. Then drive another 30 to 45 minutes back to your home. And don't worry about all the snow and dangerous traffic conditions that exist at the same time. After all - YOU'VE GOT A TESLA and you are going to save the planet.
Tyler Beard, a Tesla owner in the satellite town of Oak Brook, Illinois, told Fox32 that his car remained on zero percent battery after attempting to charge it for three hours at a time on two successive days.
"This is crazy. It's a disaster," Chalis Mizelle, another Tesla owner, told the outlet, adding she abandoned her car to ride with a friend after it failed to charge.
It's also being reported that in its owner's manual, Tesla advises motorists that they should drive to a charging location 30-45 minutes away or precondition the battery before driving in order to adequately warm the battery so it can sustain charging.
So no problem, right? In cold weather just drive to a charging station 30 to 45 minutes away instead of the one that is around the corner that you usually use. Then drive another 30 to 45 minutes back to your home. And don't worry about all the snow and dangerous traffic conditions that exist at the same time. After all - YOU'VE GOT A TESLA and you are going to save the planet.
OK it's clear you want to believe a certain narrative and nuanced discussion is not what you are after. Fine.
The ISS shows that there's hope for solar/battery power, it operates in extreme cold, always, and has done for 20 some years.
Wow, this thread hits home. Just had my 11yo's soccer tourney last weekend in -38C weather. Lots of coordination, team manager brought a booster pack, I brought my giant booster cables. Made sure team hotel had plugins for block heaters. Luckily only 1 parent had trouble starting car, another parent got scared because tires flat spot at those temperatures and take time to warm up. Passed plenty of vehicles abandoned on side of road.
By the way none of the vehicles discussed above were electric. 😀
By the way none of the vehicles discussed above were electric. 😀
The good thing about that is the battery is fully charged once you need the car as battery is being charged while car heating is on.
How about hydrogen fuel cell or ICE cars?
There are big investments planned here for 'green hydrogen', basically electrolyser plants powered by solar or wind, to get hydrogen from water.
There have been fire incidents here, basically a too small battery (in two wheelers), gets overloaded / short circuited, burns.
There was only the frame and rims left of one near my house, I meant to take a photo, it was shifted from the bridge.
Tesla fire means swimming pool dunk, happened in California, burned three days.
Be thankful nothing of that sort happened.
Siberia, I read they left the engines on all winter long, six months. Or used blow lamps to warm the blocks.
They also used reactors based on designs from their nuclear submarine program to give power and heat in remote locations, no fuel trucks needed. The secondary coolant (heat exchanged from main coolant) was piped all over the towns, steam radiators were used to transfer heat to air.
Quite an elegant and effective solution in my opinion.
There are big investments planned here for 'green hydrogen', basically electrolyser plants powered by solar or wind, to get hydrogen from water.
There have been fire incidents here, basically a too small battery (in two wheelers), gets overloaded / short circuited, burns.
There was only the frame and rims left of one near my house, I meant to take a photo, it was shifted from the bridge.
Tesla fire means swimming pool dunk, happened in California, burned three days.
Be thankful nothing of that sort happened.
Siberia, I read they left the engines on all winter long, six months. Or used blow lamps to warm the blocks.
They also used reactors based on designs from their nuclear submarine program to give power and heat in remote locations, no fuel trucks needed. The secondary coolant (heat exchanged from main coolant) was piped all over the towns, steam radiators were used to transfer heat to air.
Quite an elegant and effective solution in my opinion.
Except, with just a jump start the gas powered ones are good to go again. And they make pretty small jump starters now.
Looks like those EV batteries get a little "flat spot" in them too. Methinks people expect too much. Temperature? What does that have to do with anything - it should still work no matter what's going on with the outside atmosphere.
I remember being surprised of the battery found inside one of those car jump start boxes. Pretty small, yet can get the car started. I once jumped a car with a lawn tractor battery - started right up. One would think with a better connector than jumper cables; one that was designed for quick connect, lots of amps, multiple contact wipes - you could have a smaller battery you'd keep warm in the house to help out your ICE starter battery on cold mornings.
Currently, electric cars have situations they work well in and situations where they don't work well. Imagine if people back then were looking at declarations that in a short time they couldn't get any more horses. People had the option and demand grew organically based on easier use; currently we are going the other way. We went from horses that needed care and housing to gas engines that didn't.
There are differences in design and construction for lead acid batteries intended for cranking cars, and those used for telephone exchanges, the first will need a high current for a brief time to crank the car, the latter will give a lower current for a much longer time.
Horses for courses.
And with all the smart controls and their software, it gets difficult to analyze the problem and suggest a proper solution.
Horses for courses.
And with all the smart controls and their software, it gets difficult to analyze the problem and suggest a proper solution.
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