A lot of Teslas just aren't working in the very low temperatures now covering much of the US.
https://www.msn.com/en-us/autos/new...&cvid=aa6ce07ace9944b8aa6450a66cc321a5&ei=279
As the article points out: "Electric vehicles don’t produce as much heat as regular internal-combustion vehicles, which means that an EV has to use some of its battery power to warm the car. Furthermore, chemical reactions are slowed or even stopped in cold temperatures creating an additional obstacle for the battery to overcome."
So rather than being able to use the excess heat from an internal combution engine to warm the interior you have to use current from the battery to warm it, which just drains the battery down even faster.
Not a good combination of things. And people are just abandoning their electric cars at the charging stations because the they can't run.
https://www.msn.com/en-us/autos/new...&cvid=aa6ce07ace9944b8aa6450a66cc321a5&ei=279
As the article points out: "Electric vehicles don’t produce as much heat as regular internal-combustion vehicles, which means that an EV has to use some of its battery power to warm the car. Furthermore, chemical reactions are slowed or even stopped in cold temperatures creating an additional obstacle for the battery to overcome."
So rather than being able to use the excess heat from an internal combution engine to warm the interior you have to use current from the battery to warm it, which just drains the battery down even faster.
Not a good combination of things. And people are just abandoning their electric cars at the charging stations because the they can't run.
And: When it's cold the air has more density by some per cent giving more resistance than in summer.
But: if you have a garage the car starts with a warm battery.
If you charge your battery while working with normal household electricity the battery stays warm, too.
All depends how you use your car.
A tesla battery quickly heats up after some minutes and reaches working temperature of 20 degrees.
As the battery of a tesla is big: mostly people drive distances of up to 60km and you have plenty of energy for your trips even with all consumers like heating, light, music etc working.
I drove electric cars since 2007. And know that it's all a thing of habits and knowledge.
My first car was a Twike.
See.
https://twike.com/twike3/
website
But: if you have a garage the car starts with a warm battery.
If you charge your battery while working with normal household electricity the battery stays warm, too.
All depends how you use your car.
A tesla battery quickly heats up after some minutes and reaches working temperature of 20 degrees.
As the battery of a tesla is big: mostly people drive distances of up to 60km and you have plenty of energy for your trips even with all consumers like heating, light, music etc working.
I drove electric cars since 2007. And know that it's all a thing of habits and knowledge.
My first car was a Twike.
See.
https://twike.com/twike3/
website
In an emergency - stationary in a snowdrift/blizzard/traffic queue for example, how long would an EV keep you from hypothermia using its heater, and what is a typical EV heater output in kW?
I guess some people have to learn the hard way before -- reluctantly, dragging their heels kicking and screaming -- finally resorting to sensible design after all non-sensible options have been exhausted...
Clean, easily renewable and easily obtainable fuel, like alcohol,
burned cleanly using continuous combustion methods, like a turbine. Or if that's too complex, use an external combustion chamber, like in ancient times, to boil water and produce thrust from rapidly expanding steam.
Want to use regenerative braking for higher efficiency? Sure, use a battery, one that's suitable for that purpose alone, not for the bulk energy storage for the entire driving range of the car! You'd think that people who design rockets for a living understand that it's grossly inefficient to transport the oxidizer together with the fuel in situations when oxygen is abundantly available from the surrounding environment and it's totally redundant to carry it around.
Clean, easily renewable and easily obtainable fuel, like alcohol,
burned cleanly using continuous combustion methods, like a turbine. Or if that's too complex, use an external combustion chamber, like in ancient times, to boil water and produce thrust from rapidly expanding steam.
Want to use regenerative braking for higher efficiency? Sure, use a battery, one that's suitable for that purpose alone, not for the bulk energy storage for the entire driving range of the car! You'd think that people who design rockets for a living understand that it's grossly inefficient to transport the oxidizer together with the fuel in situations when oxygen is abundantly available from the surrounding environment and it's totally redundant to carry it around.
If there is that extreme cold, or a blizzard, stay home?
It’s easy to say that, but someone has to go to work to pay for that $70,000 car and $5,000 charger.
Current battery powered automobiles fall marginally short of making sense in much of Canada. Even newer, smaller internal combustion engine powered cars do not heat the occupant area effectively - 15-minutes idling and the windshield is still ice and often can’t even be scraped off. Unless there’s a notable forthcoming improvement in insulating technology, we may use a lot of stored energy to heat the cabin and defrost the windscreens. I strongly believe the answer possibly lies in augmentation by an alternative fuel or fossil fuel engine.
Current battery powered automobiles fall marginally short of making sense in much of Canada. Even newer, smaller internal combustion engine powered cars do not heat the occupant area effectively - 15-minutes idling and the windshield is still ice and often can’t even be scraped off. Unless there’s a notable forthcoming improvement in insulating technology, we may use a lot of stored energy to heat the cabin and defrost the windscreens. I strongly believe the answer possibly lies in augmentation by an alternative fuel or fossil fuel engine.
Alchol biofuel takes the place of regular food production on a field so thats a no go in my opinion. If you are worried of beeing caugth in a snowstorm I'd buy a few of those gas mini heatheaters that ViceGripGarage uses in his old american cars.
A turbine have terrible efficiency, thats why only a few test cars were made in the 60's. If your an engineer and you know the customers wants the lowest cost fuel electric is the only way. 30% pump losses on hydrogen..
Most people just heat the car up through the charger, and rent another car for long trips. Buying a car for that one use case/trip is not the best solution in my opinion. Buying an electrical car with a buildt in heatpump is ofcoarse smart in a cold climate, and theres many cars that have heatpumps now.
A turbine have terrible efficiency, thats why only a few test cars were made in the 60's. If your an engineer and you know the customers wants the lowest cost fuel electric is the only way. 30% pump losses on hydrogen..
Most people just heat the car up through the charger, and rent another car for long trips. Buying a car for that one use case/trip is not the best solution in my opinion. Buying an electrical car with a buildt in heatpump is ofcoarse smart in a cold climate, and theres many cars that have heatpumps now.
Gee what a suprise.
Battery cars cant hack the cold.
I guess every person thats ever had a battery die in the peak of winter anywhere around the world isnt smart enough to work that one out.....
And yes, I am super anti battery car.
I have my reasons and dont want to start a 'battery war' 🙂
Hybrids, sure ok, at least you have some sort of reliable engine to keep you going.
So long as the imbecile designers dont screw you over with 'smart' systems that shut down the entire car if one power source is depleted or dies.
Battery cars cant hack the cold.
I guess every person thats ever had a battery die in the peak of winter anywhere around the world isnt smart enough to work that one out.....
And yes, I am super anti battery car.
I have my reasons and dont want to start a 'battery war' 🙂
Hybrids, sure ok, at least you have some sort of reliable engine to keep you going.
So long as the imbecile designers dont screw you over with 'smart' systems that shut down the entire car if one power source is depleted or dies.
I have actual experience driving an electric car in the cold and have no wish to go back to a fossil fuel car. Yes, range will be significantly affected by very cold temperatures, but with a little planning when driving longer distances, this isn't a problem. 90% of my driving is within the range of the car with a full battery and I charge at home when the prices are low (which is done automatically our by charging station). Certainly saves us a lot of money.
A huge advantage is that an electric car get warm very fast in the winter. Most models can be programmed to preheat at a specific time, which is very nice.
A huge advantage is that an electric car get warm very fast in the winter. Most models can be programmed to preheat at a specific time, which is very nice.
Last edited:
Just wait until I get out of the back seat where I have been calling out are we nearly there!!!
Once we get there and the celestial climate change changes from warming to cooling.
We will then need to build heated car parks for these cars that die in the cold.
What do we have to use to hear these car parks. Gas might be a bit too fracky.
Once we get there and the celestial climate change changes from warming to cooling.
We will then need to build heated car parks for these cars that die in the cold.
What do we have to use to hear these car parks. Gas might be a bit too fracky.
Is there any battery technology (at any stage of development) that is optimized for cold temperatures? Some parts of the world tend to stay cold, and at some point in time the only viable energy sources will simply require batteries. I can envision a time/scenario when a “cold” battery is a must-have, not just for cars.
NiCd batteries work pretty fine in cold, but have their own set of problems - e.g. low energy density.
Lets not forget about all the gas powered cars that can't be started in extreme cold because their lead-acid batteries loose capacity.
The low temp battery problem has been around long before electric cars showed up.
The low temp battery problem has been around long before electric cars showed up.
Lots of new EVs have heat pumps fitted to improve range in winter but plenty still only offer it as an expensive extra.
I'm a petrol head but I recon EVs of some kind probably are the future for cars but for now they are completely unaffordable to most people.
I'm a petrol head but I recon EVs of some kind probably are the future for cars but for now they are completely unaffordable to most people.
I recently came to the conclusion EV's at this time were a big mistake. Massive, and I mean massive subsidies for a not ready for prime time tech. It would have made far more sense to build the LiFe batteries for grid storage and bump up the solar/wind with battery backup. I live in TX, number one state in the US in wind generation. And yet in this recent cold snap, wind died, minimal battery storage and the coal/nat gas plants were generating around 85%. And they had to call for conservation as even with 65GW of nat gas and 12GW of coal available, supply barely met demand. Keep in mind TX has close to 30GW of wind nameplate, and if I remember right, that night was producing around 3-4GW, so barely 10%. You need massive battery backup to cover the variability in wind/solar. So all those EV's getting charged that night were getting charged by fossils. Once the fossils are out of the grid, then we can start moving to transportation electrics. And hopefully better batteries. Gas is a wonderfully dense fuel. Great for transportation where you want lightweight energy source.
Yeah, but those are VERY BIG IFs for some people. If you don't have a garage, as many people living in big cities don't have one, and you have to park your car outside on the street without any means of providing power to charge the battery, and it's very cold, below zero like it is now in Chicago, then your are screwed if you own an electric car. I think that is the main point of the news article that I used to start this thread.
Years ago worked for Hunslet Engines in Leeds UK.
We built a diesel loco for Canada.
It had a heater blanket for the starting batteries which were located in the cab under the bench seat, ether injectors for cold start & radiator shutters.
I drive a diesel car and in winter travel ~8km before the temp gauge even starts to move.
We built a diesel loco for Canada.
It had a heater blanket for the starting batteries which were located in the cab under the bench seat, ether injectors for cold start & radiator shutters.
I drive a diesel car and in winter travel ~8km before the temp gauge even starts to move.
Reminds me of a few days one Christmas in Edmonton. If i wanted to start the car in the morning i had to bring the battery into the house. It is a real bitch installing a battery in the dark below -40° C temps.
dave
- Status
- Not open for further replies.