No, those are my honest impressions. I am not laughing.
You know that as a kid I lived in the Old Country where we all live in high rise cities and the population density is quite heavy. Heck, my hometown is one of the most densely populated cities in Europe, hemmed between hills sides and the Mediterranean.
When I moved to the US, I was shocked to see how much land we have here. It was astonishing how much personal space, in and out, we have. The cities in the US, with few exceptions, are nowhere as densely populated as they are back home.
Now, in Australia and Western Canada I have noticed the cities are more densely packed than in the Western US. And I've always wondered why. It seems like an European model of city building in new continents.
What I have noticed is that the "edge" of those cities is quite abrupt and there isn't the gradual blending of city and wilderness. You sort of go from wilderness to a small strip of rural and suburban and then, urban! In the case of Vancouver, as I've noted, this is on the North side. In Australia it was quite a shock.
The Western US never had a strong colonizing impact. when it comes to architecture and urban planning.. it sort of grew hodge podge.. Spanish, Mexican, Old West, styles. Some East Coast touches in San Francisco perhaps... but it was a true mixture of everything. It's like there was no planning from a Central Authority miles away. Even Hawai'i is like that.
Just my honest observations. Do remember where I spent my childhood... hint: I hated it being so cooped up with millions of others... I like space around me.
You know that as a kid I lived in the Old Country where we all live in high rise cities and the population density is quite heavy. Heck, my hometown is one of the most densely populated cities in Europe, hemmed between hills sides and the Mediterranean.
When I moved to the US, I was shocked to see how much land we have here. It was astonishing how much personal space, in and out, we have. The cities in the US, with few exceptions, are nowhere as densely populated as they are back home.
Now, in Australia and Western Canada I have noticed the cities are more densely packed than in the Western US. And I've always wondered why. It seems like an European model of city building in new continents.
What I have noticed is that the "edge" of those cities is quite abrupt and there isn't the gradual blending of city and wilderness. You sort of go from wilderness to a small strip of rural and suburban and then, urban! In the case of Vancouver, as I've noted, this is on the North side. In Australia it was quite a shock.
The Western US never had a strong colonizing impact. when it comes to architecture and urban planning.. it sort of grew hodge podge.. Spanish, Mexican, Old West, styles. Some East Coast touches in San Francisco perhaps... but it was a true mixture of everything. It's like there was no planning from a Central Authority miles away. Even Hawai'i is like that.
Just my honest observations. Do remember where I spent my childhood... hint: I hated it being so cooped up with millions of others... I like space around me.
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I am hoping no one is offended by straying this far off track. If so, I can easily remove some posts, just PM me.
Okay Tony, so it's just a tidbit or two of info you're not putting into the equation
You'e right, Vancouver does abruptly end on the north shore.
Since people and government both agree that building cities where it's flatter, milder, closer to the ocean and that higher density equals less expense, we offer Vancouver. Metro Vancouver is built on a flat river delta and floodplain.
It is bordered to the east by the remainder of the delta and therefore it sprawls.
It's bordered on the south by the USA border.
It's bordered on the west by the Pacific ocean.
It's bordered on the north by mountains. Pretty big ones.
Not many want to live on the side of a mountain given a choice. It's colder, rainier, shadier and there's no place for the kids to play.
The advertisers are at a loss to attract potential investors.
The governments don't want to build the infrastructure.
That being said this area does have a lot of persons living on the hills and cliffs but they only want to be so far away from the sights and sounds of the city so they only go so far. Yes Vancouver comes to an abrupt halt.
I'll let those down under explain Australia even though it's pretty obvious why everyone lives near the coast. Lack of rain might enter into it too, not sure😉
Okay Tony, so it's just a tidbit or two of info you're not putting into the equation
You'e right, Vancouver does abruptly end on the north shore.
Since people and government both agree that building cities where it's flatter, milder, closer to the ocean and that higher density equals less expense, we offer Vancouver. Metro Vancouver is built on a flat river delta and floodplain.
It is bordered to the east by the remainder of the delta and therefore it sprawls.
It's bordered on the south by the USA border.
It's bordered on the west by the Pacific ocean.
It's bordered on the north by mountains. Pretty big ones.
Not many want to live on the side of a mountain given a choice. It's colder, rainier, shadier and there's no place for the kids to play.
The advertisers are at a loss to attract potential investors.
The governments don't want to build the infrastructure.
That being said this area does have a lot of persons living on the hills and cliffs but they only want to be so far away from the sights and sounds of the city so they only go so far. Yes Vancouver comes to an abrupt halt.
I'll let those down under explain Australia even though it's pretty obvious why everyone lives near the coast. Lack of rain might enter into it too, not sure😉
Can't think of a Canadian city that doesn't have at least one major greenspace near downtown and doesn't continue to sprawl to this day.
Well coming from a country with NO wilderness, but what we call 'countryside' I have to say that every american city I have visited ends abruptly. Here unless there is a mountain you get a village every few miles. I just did a quick look and I can plot 100 mile route from my house and never be in a position not to be able to see at least one house in any given second. Driving out of any non mothernature limited area in my experience in USA you hit a field where people are building houses then nothing for ages. Different eyes see different things.
The north american continent is big in a way my islander brain cannot easily compute though, so you will find anything if you look hard enough for it...
Well, I do like BC, don't get me wrong. One the best places to visit in June and July. I'm just making the observation.
And yes, Oz is a big dessert... but so is the Mohave... and yet we have lots of people living there.
Oh well.
I also love Lahaina... even if the best filipino food I've ever had was in Wailuku. I must admit that when wife and I were sipping our rums in Lahaina we were tempted to mail in our resignations.
And yes, Oz is a big dessert... but so is the Mohave... and yet we have lots of people living there.
Oh well.
I also love Lahaina... even if the best filipino food I've ever had was in Wailuku. I must admit that when wife and I were sipping our rums in Lahaina we were tempted to mail in our resignations.
Yes Europe is quite different from North America and Oz- I did note that already. Not only that, but some of those houses, bridges, churches are OLD. Hiking and finding Roman or Visigoth ruins is common in Catalunya. The only way to have a European City "end" is to run into a tunnel and/or a Big mountain and/or a sea.
As you say, it's all how you look at it and what you're used to. The center of cities in the US West just doesn't feel as densely populated as it does in Canada and Australia. The difference between the desert/plains/tundra is quite different from the Western Euro "country side".
The Hawai'ian Islands are interesting because the islands are very steep. So, you got big chunks of the land that can not be build upon as the land is way too steep or it tends to spew hot lava periodically.
LA counts as a megacity now with a population density way above anything canada can offer. I believe that is part of 'US west'?
Note country boy, for me anything over 100k people is too densely populated for me to live in.
Note country boy, for me anything over 100k people is too densely populated for me to live in.
The size of the LA "metropolis" (*) is huge, but it's area is also huge. So, the population density is not so great. The greatest aggregate (at the county level) population density is in Orange County at ~3700 people per square mile ).
Check these numbers, you can see how uneven it is...
https://statisticalatlas.com/metro-area/California/Los-Angeles/Population#figure/county
For population density in the Western US you got to look at the City of San Francisco... ( 6300 people per sq mile) due to its geography it's really crowded but it only has 875K people. I believe neither Portlandia and Seattle are as crowded.
Even the likes of tiny Lahaina, with 12K people was 1632 per sq mile. But its location, on a narrow coastal shelf, with a single highway, makes it difficult to "defend".
So, size doesn't really matter.
Example, my sister and brother in law live in a PNW county with 275K people, yet they got 5 1/2 acres and literally live in the middle of the woods. When he goes around he woods he "carries" to protect himself from the bears. So, do his neighbors. Is that rural enough for ya?
(*) It's not a city. It's spread out over four counties and likely 100 cities. In general we call it "SoCal".
Check these numbers, you can see how uneven it is...
https://statisticalatlas.com/metro-area/California/Los-Angeles/Population#figure/county
For population density in the Western US you got to look at the City of San Francisco... ( 6300 people per sq mile) due to its geography it's really crowded but it only has 875K people. I believe neither Portlandia and Seattle are as crowded.
Even the likes of tiny Lahaina, with 12K people was 1632 per sq mile. But its location, on a narrow coastal shelf, with a single highway, makes it difficult to "defend".
So, size doesn't really matter.
Example, my sister and brother in law live in a PNW county with 275K people, yet they got 5 1/2 acres and literally live in the middle of the woods. When he goes around he woods he "carries" to protect himself from the bears. So, do his neighbors. Is that rural enough for ya?
(*) It's not a city. It's spread out over four counties and likely 100 cities. In general we call it "SoCal".
You can hike from my place to Buchart Gardens. Been here since 1976 haven’t gone yet.
dave
The entire 6 weeks i was in Fort Norman (now with a much less colonial name, Tutlta), the red spot on SoundChaser’s map, was burning to the west. Just enuff smoke to keep the mosqitos way down.
dave
“…Just enuff smoke to keep the mosqitos way down.”
That can be very handy up there. For the black flies too!
That can be very handy up there. For the black flies too!
Beautiful place.
Two things I've really appreciated about Victoria... Butchart Gardens and the high quality of the beer throughout town.
Now I guess I'll have to add speakers.
There was an interview of a Lahaina resident on the long-wave yesterday -- he mentioned that the area where the fire started used to be a grove for pineapple and other fruit. That business died down a few decades ago and the area cultivated had reverted to native and invasive non-native grasses. These were largely un-tended unlike their occupation as cash crops a few decades ago.
That is exactly right. On Maui, we know then as Tsunami sirens. They are tested every Friday at noon. If I had heard them I would have headed for the hills - completely the wrong direction. Obviously that will now change and some other system will need to be put in place.
Indeed, the last pineapple fields above Lahaina disappeared some time ago. That was big news at the time.
Only four times I can remember it went off in earnest and my parents were there but not me. Two for storm warnings and two for tsunami watches. The storm warnings took them to the top of their property but the tsunami watches took them up to the local school. Thankfully, nothing really came from any of them Except some temporary loss of beach.
To those with current or near recent knowledge, are there cell phone push text notifications for disasters in Hawaii or is it just the sirens?
Was the fire at night? I've seen brush fires at night, I still have trouble believing people would head into a fire no matter how they've been trained.
I also heard on the news the guy who stood by the decision to not sound the alarm has resigned. Think it was supposedly for medical reasons.
I also heard on the news the guy who stood by the decision to not sound the alarm has resigned. Think it was supposedly for medical reasons.
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