I'm waiting on the delivery of a pair of Lii Audio's new Platinum 10 drivers, and reading and learning as much as possible in order to design the enclosures.
I've only built from pre-engineered, relatively safe plans before, so this is a swing into the unknown.
The first question is how closely the parameters listed are to reality, but for now let's just assume they're relatively close:
Impedance: 8 ohm
Power: 25 – 50 W
Frequency response: Fu – 20k Hz
Fs: 28.3 Hz
Sd: 373.25 cm²
Qms: 11.365
Qes: 0.108
Qts: 0.107
Sensitivity: 103.3 dB （2.83V/1m）
Vas: 552.18 litre
First two things that jump out at me are the huge volume, and the crazy low Qt. With those two numbers for starters but taking the other numbers into account, what type of box would you be looking to put these in? Steve Deckert has designed and built a folded horn for them, and says they sound incredible. No measurements so far though, understandable as most of us don't have an anechoic chamber in our basement. In another thread here and elsewhere, Matty has put them in very large bass reflex boxes and loves the sound. I was leaning toward TQWP, but really not sure which of these three (BR, TQWP, Folded horn) is most suited given the specs. On top of that, I'm at the mercy of the web and trying to find good calculation software, and the best I've come up with is a TQWP at about 13.5"w x 62"h x 20"d. Interestingly, these are pretty much the exact dimensions of Steve's horn. It's a bit under half the Vas. I'm still trying to understand the relationship between Vas and final volume.
If I knew of a really good designer, I'd probably job the design of this one out. I'm a woodworker and craftsman, but speaker design is an art and a science that isn't quickly learned I've come to see. I figure it would take about 5 years for me to even begin to have the knowledge I need, and a lot of mistakes and late nights. I just want to build something I know will work, and get on with the music!
Any input is appreciated.
I've only built from pre-engineered, relatively safe plans before, so this is a swing into the unknown.
The first question is how closely the parameters listed are to reality, but for now let's just assume they're relatively close:
Impedance: 8 ohm
Power: 25 – 50 W
Frequency response: Fu – 20k Hz
Fs: 28.3 Hz
Sd: 373.25 cm²
Qms: 11.365
Qes: 0.108
Qts: 0.107
Sensitivity: 103.3 dB （2.83V/1m）
Vas: 552.18 litre
First two things that jump out at me are the huge volume, and the crazy low Qt. With those two numbers for starters but taking the other numbers into account, what type of box would you be looking to put these in? Steve Deckert has designed and built a folded horn for them, and says they sound incredible. No measurements so far though, understandable as most of us don't have an anechoic chamber in our basement. In another thread here and elsewhere, Matty has put them in very large bass reflex boxes and loves the sound. I was leaning toward TQWP, but really not sure which of these three (BR, TQWP, Folded horn) is most suited given the specs. On top of that, I'm at the mercy of the web and trying to find good calculation software, and the best I've come up with is a TQWP at about 13.5"w x 62"h x 20"d. Interestingly, these are pretty much the exact dimensions of Steve's horn. It's a bit under half the Vas. I'm still trying to understand the relationship between Vas and final volume.
If I knew of a really good designer, I'd probably job the design of this one out. I'm a woodworker and craftsman, but speaker design is an art and a science that isn't quickly learned I've come to see. I figure it would take about 5 years for me to even begin to have the knowledge I need, and a lot of mistakes and late nights. I just want to build something I know will work, and get on with the music!
Any input is appreciated.
with those specs mms is extremely low at ~10.6g - very powerful motor and overdamped-Current drive might help keep enclosure size reasonable.
What's Re? - a double-bass reflex of 115l might have some punch. Dunno aobut blhj.
What's Re? - a double-bass reflex of 115l might have some punch. Dunno aobut blhj.
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Based on those numbers, looks like 10 litre sealed with woofers below. If passive XO you will likely need a couple 15s.
Gets to about 100 Hz in a vented box.
I doubt you will find an exotic enclosure that will get you any real bass without significant consequences. But as Freddi points out if you have a high Rout you may be able to get somethign to work,
dave
Thanks guys, I’ll have a closer look at what you’ve posted when I get home.
I’m not planning to use a woofer with this driver, no crossover. I have some 6.5” Satoris that get mid 40s in a small BR so I don’t see why I can’t get a 10” driver to get there although I understand the excursion is much smaller on the Lii driver. Steve Deckert’s folded horn is apparently working really well, somewhere in the 250l range
I’m not planning to use a woofer with this driver, no crossover. I have some 6.5” Satoris that get mid 40s in a small BR so I don’t see why I can’t get a 10” driver to get there although I understand the excursion is much smaller on the Lii driver. Steve Deckert’s folded horn is apparently working really well, somewhere in the 250l range
Because the Q has been pushed down soo much (to increase the midband efficiency) it has become a midTweeter.
dave
Ah, I think I understand what you're saying. Wow, might be time to cancel the order, this driver is not designed as a true full-ranger, needs a sub. I need to look elsewhere. Was going to buy a pair of Cube drivers, but the prices are crazy.
Assuming the specs are accurate at all, user in another thread reports 'huge' bass from platinums in 480L cabinet, no filters used from what I can gather.
Either the specs are wrong or the report is unreliable/untrustworthy for something as fundamental as the quantity of bass.
I really don't understand how people are confident to drop that amount of money on these drivers considering the iffy quality of data provided and general sketchiness of the brand.
At less than a quarter the price there are TangBand 8 inch drivers that tick a lot of same or more boxes (from what we can try to assume about the platinum's design) - Powerful neo magnets, underhung, low Mms but with better bass response.
TangBand have a pretty good and long track record as far I can tell.
Visually the platinums look a homemade, under-enginerred prototype compared to them, maybe that is partly the point but for it hardly inspires confidence.
Have you came across or considered the TangBands? What is the appeal of platinum 10?
Either the specs are wrong or the report is unreliable/untrustworthy for something as fundamental as the quantity of bass.
I really don't understand how people are confident to drop that amount of money on these drivers considering the iffy quality of data provided and general sketchiness of the brand.
At less than a quarter the price there are TangBand 8 inch drivers that tick a lot of same or more boxes (from what we can try to assume about the platinum's design) - Powerful neo magnets, underhung, low Mms but with better bass response.
TangBand have a pretty good and long track record as far I can tell.
Visually the platinums look a homemade, under-enginerred prototype compared to them, maybe that is partly the point but for it hardly inspires confidence.
Have you came across or considered the TangBands? What is the appeal of platinum 10?
I've been looking at Lii stuff for a while, and they seem to have a lot of very positive feedback, a lot of people rave about them, and even Nelson Pass uses them, I discovered when he answered a question I had on another thread somewhere (I was considering OBs at the time). I was going to buy the more reasonably priced Silver-10, but when a few people started gushing about the Platinum, and I saw they were using Neo magnets I figured they might be a winner compared to the cost of Cube's neo drivers, which are outrageously expensive. I honestly didn't know TangBand was such a player in this market, but I'm looking at the 8" drivers now. Amazing the specs and neo magnets for $350.
Neodymium prices go up and down, same as anything else. There are also various grades of each type of popular magnet material available -something often glossed over. Neodymium is of debatable value outside tweeters since it's not great at higher temperatures & tends to want additional cooling for best results -the main use is to keep physical mass / size down relative to alternatives. In itself, it's not a guide to quality, same as any other magnet material -there's more to motor design than that (alas 
).
).Thanks to everyone so far, as I stated in my original post I'm a hobbyist and trying to learn as quickly as possible. This stuff is vast, in every direction, all at once!
I thought the advantage to neodymium was the strength of the flux field, so the damoing is stronger, hence faster and more realistic. I wasn't aware of the grades, but that makes a lot of sense. I have more knowledge about steel, and that word means very little until you see what's in it, where it's from, how it's forged, etc so this makes perfect sense. Same with output transformers I"ve come to learn.
Those TangBands are really getting my attention, since this is an experiment in high sensitivity single drivers, I could save a bunch and give it a shot, build a couple cab versions and see what happens. The Cubes are gorgeous but overpriced, Voxativ same deal. I had no idea TangBand made such quality drivers, wish they had a 10".
I thought the advantage to neodymium was the strength of the flux field, so the damoing is stronger, hence faster and more realistic. I wasn't aware of the grades, but that makes a lot of sense. I have more knowledge about steel, and that word means very little until you see what's in it, where it's from, how it's forged, etc so this makes perfect sense. Same with output transformers I"ve come to learn.
Those TangBands are really getting my attention, since this is an experiment in high sensitivity single drivers, I could save a bunch and give it a shot, build a couple cab versions and see what happens. The Cubes are gorgeous but overpriced, Voxativ same deal. I had no idea TangBand made such quality drivers, wish they had a 10".
I may build a pair of Nelson's SLOB II's and throw some 15" in there with whatever driver I end up with just to hear them. Could build a crap version in a few hours. Trying to stay away from passive xovers this time round, and don't want to get into DIY actives or biamping, so there's always a tradeoff....
Its typical vented box size range is T/S max flat: Vb = 20*Vas*Qts'^3.3 = ~6.92 L net tuned to 0.42*Fs*Qts'^-0.96 = ~101.6 Hz to Vb = Vas, Fb = Fs where Qts' = 0.403 with a ~22 ohm series resistance like one would find in a vintage tube amp/receiver with variable DF tone controls or just a power sapping resistor per this calculator.
As is, it's basically a compression horn driver, so large BLH or tiny ~102 - 529 Hz sealed/vented box.
Re software, Hornresp freeware is what many of us here use for all manner of cab alignments and has an excellent searchable HELP File that can be turned into a Wordpad/whatever file to blow up for easy reading and for the beginner both a horn Wizard designer for customs and an Input Wizard that allows one to choose a wide variety of basic cab alignments to modify as required based on driver specs, performance goals.
