You wanted Inspiration, high sensitivity and ”home” theater? Oh Yes! 🙂👍
https://jblpro.com/en-US/products/5742
https://jblpro.com/en-US/products/5742
That method will determine the volume of the material in the horn, not its displacement in the enclosure. Measuring an extant horn's displacement volume requires sealing the throat and submerging it up to the mounting flange, then continuing with the calculations as stated. When designing an enclosure one does not always have the luxury of having already bought the horn though...
Actually one could just seal it with your hand and fill the flare itself. Pour it back to a tank of known parameters and voila.
Agreed, but it just gets my goat not having the figure to hand from the manufacturers!
The drivers mentioned so far in the thread, like the D220 Ti or similar. Not so much the woofers, but the compression drivers.
Very best,
I don't see the point of putting the horn in its own enclosure. I'm going to do it, but it is because I can't lift the 72 lb SP2(2004) onto the poles 2 m in the air. Leaving out the CD horn & passive crossover from the bass reflex box saves >10 lb. Distance from horn to woofer has to be managed, also the forwards/backwards plane distances.
Voice is easy. My SP2(2004) are fine on voice although people whine about any titanium diaphragm. The $3 used speakers I bought at the charity resale shop for my TV room do voice okay. Before the burglar stole them, in the TV room I used 6.5" coax drivers from a mitsubishi projection TV I found on the curb. In a cardboard box for bass reflex, that did voice & all midrange fine. What cheap speakers won't do is piano, cymbals, tinkly bells. Highs & lows are expensive. Piano & bass drum have huge volume peaks at the beginning of the note, that cause my cheap speakers to distort.
Since male voice will go below 800 hz, the compression driver won't do all of it. A smooth well tested crossover is necessary to get smooth voice. The fear of titanium diaphragm CD is pervasive on this forum, but I hear no problem at 1/8 to 50w (CD gets 1/7 of the wattage in the SP2(2004). If the box is driven to 500 w , 70 w on the CD, maybe the titanium CD will "quack". I don't have enough room or parking lot to hear that high wattage.
Note, people always warn about beaming (narrow dispersion) on 12" and 15" drivers. Just in a parallelpiped box, it can be a problem. The -3 db point of +-22.5 deg off axis of the SP2-XT shows that the problem can be overcome by enclosure design. The SP2(2004) has a box narrower at the back from the front, a 14' wide horn, plus other tricks, to keep the -6 db horiz dispersion to +-85 deg.
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Thanks; yea, I wouldn't mind spending more to get something that has better natural sound in dialog and instruments. Overall for dispersion, it's really just for the center channel and its horizontal dispersion that I care the most about since its where 100% of dialog comes from.
Very best,
I picked up the RX22 with 7x14" horns off ebay for $140 the pair, shipping included. Lots of Peavey woofers get blown, leaving the CD+horn for salvage.
If I wanted to try some other CD, I would be tempted by the Eminence N314X-8. Plastic diaphragm, 1.4" throat, 100 w rating. Takes a bolt on horn though, nearest thing I see to 14" wide in bolt on is one for $49 at simply speakers in Florida.
Note RX22 and most 1.4" CD won't do 17-20 khz. I can't hear that anyway. 1.4" goes a little lower than the 1" CD that Pi speaker use. His performance charts are worth a look.
A compression tweeter does not need a separate cabinet. My only reason for suggesting an enclosure behind that plastic Dayton horn I linked was more due to the woofer. But realistically you're not going to get a huge amount of boom out of that woofer so possibly you won't notice the difference between putting that horn in a separate enclosure vs just putting inside the woofer cabinet. You could try it first and see.
FWIW, when I used that Selenium D220 I did end up with a fairly large xover on the tweeter, IIRC I used 2 notch filters because it had a large dip around 4khz, so I padded above and below that dip with the notch filters, then made my high pass filter. I was crossed to that Beta 12 at around 1.6khz. This was the final, in-room response of that D220/Beta 12/Dayton 15 build with no EQ added, but it was active crossed to that Dayton sub around 200Hz.
FWIW, when I used that Selenium D220 I did end up with a fairly large xover on the tweeter, IIRC I used 2 notch filters because it had a large dip around 4khz, so I padded above and below that dip with the notch filters, then made my high pass filter. I was crossed to that Beta 12 at around 1.6khz. This was the final, in-room response of that D220/Beta 12/Dayton 15 build with no EQ added, but it was active crossed to that Dayton sub around 200Hz.
Show me the measured difference with that flare in a separate vs the same enclosure as the LF driver at even fairly loud domestic levels. CSDs would be nice.
Correct. Probably nitpicking but... sounds like he has the real-estate so my thought was, might as well. But I agree, while I've never measured that I doubt it'll be a noticeable difference either way.
If you wanted to substantially bump your budget. Still pretty efficient...
Satori TW29RN-B
Eminence Alpha 8A
Dayton RSS460HO-4
Satori TW29RN-B
Eminence Alpha 8A
Dayton RSS460HO-4
The eminence Alpha8a in 2021 had 94 db 1w1m. By contrast the eminence Kappalite 12HO has 100.5 db and the eminence Deltapro 15a has 101.6 db. I bought the deltapro-15a. The Peavey 1505-8kadt I own are 99 db.
You can look up the others elsewhere.
I accidentally posted too soon, I edited it with the rest. 100 db wouldn't work with that tweeter, was looking for options outside compression tweeters
Depends on the horn's construction with a sterile sand or Portland cement filled box the best option.
No experience, but the WG/horn design generally sets its 'color' in its pass band with Dr. Geddes' OS WG technically best (ditto the few reviews I've read from savvy 'hornies'), then round CD (constant directivity) conical, square CD conical, CD rectangular conical (best compromise), expo, tractrix or vice versa depend on who you ask and whether or not comparing 'apples to apples'
.There's other flare designs for strictly prosound, so not relevant for typical HIFI/HT apps. Somewhere in all this is the Karlson concepts, though don't know where they fit since there's so little consensus on the various type's performance(s).
Once above the horn's gain BW the driver's diaphragm material begins 'coloring' its response and IME Altec's super rare (and no doubt long time work hardened by now) 1" 'ultralite' developed for one of the 604 series duplex/coaxials next best.
If using a 1" compression driver with an internal short horn by itself it's historically strictly for > ~2 kHz w/o any attached WG IME depending on how big a round over termination is used and how much peak SPL desired.
FWIW/YMMV, of the CDs I've experience with and ignoring phenolic; Alum. Altec (ne GPA) 1.4" drivers for best vocals, music within its 300 - ~12.5 kHz BW, with 500 Hz the most used, though of course requires a huge to humongous WG depending on desired HF BW for best performance.
For 1", Altec/GPA 'Tangerine' CDs w/GPA Alum, though in discussions with a few folks around the world using vintage Altec horns claimed that TAD's beryllium diaphragm was best for critical listening at low power, so no good for typical HT apps.
Late to the party - this is how I solved this task:
8"/1" with very long search for the right drivers. But when you need to cross over at 60-80Hz I would suggest to switch to 10" for low frequencies. The best candidate for this would be the PHL 10" "studio" driver (forgot the name but you should find it easy).
To get a fitting cross over the volume should be sealed (read at THX norm about that, forms a hp 2nd order) and high passed 2nd order and woofer low passed 4th order - this simply works, gives an ACOUSTICAL filter 4th order.
The best horn manufacturer I know is Limmer Horns from Germany. They also have great 6"/1" Horn flares to build big 3-way speakers:
https://www.limmerhorns.de/
I combine these speakers with 6 closed 10" woofers behind the screen (only 3 on theis picture) to form a single bass array ... looking forward to hopefully receive my screen next week 😍
8"/1" with very long search for the right drivers. But when you need to cross over at 60-80Hz I would suggest to switch to 10" for low frequencies. The best candidate for this would be the PHL 10" "studio" driver (forgot the name but you should find it easy).
To get a fitting cross over the volume should be sealed (read at THX norm about that, forms a hp 2nd order) and high passed 2nd order and woofer low passed 4th order - this simply works, gives an ACOUSTICAL filter 4th order.
The best horn manufacturer I know is Limmer Horns from Germany. They also have great 6"/1" Horn flares to build big 3-way speakers:
https://www.limmerhorns.de/
I combine these speakers with 6 closed 10" woofers behind the screen (only 3 on theis picture) to form a single bass array ... looking forward to hopefully receive my screen next week 😍