One nice thing about my job is I now work from home most of the time.
In the past I might work form home on snowy days when I know I might not make it in for market open.
The fun part is when your wife overhears you at work quietly singing one special song on a bad morning. The I'm sorry song.
In the past I might work form home on snowy days when I know I might not make it in for market open.
The fun part is when your wife overhears you at work quietly singing one special song on a bad morning. The I'm sorry song.
This has probably already been said by someone, but this is a bad idea for at least the following two reasons:
1) You may be criminally charged (possibly, a fine, and/or jail time) with misuse of government funds, or even fraud.
2) You may not have recovered your investment at the time the loan is due to be repaid (the loan principle + interest) causing you to possibly default. Every investment caries with it the risk of losing some, or all, of that investment. You may dismiss that possibility as low risk, but the risk is not zero. Gains are not guaranteed, and even when positives, are typically time cyclic.
1) You may be criminally charged (possibly, a fine, and/or jail time) with misuse of government funds, or even fraud.
2) You may not have recovered your investment at the time the loan is due to be repaid (the loan principle + interest) causing you to possibly default. Every investment caries with it the risk of losing some, or all, of that investment. You may dismiss that possibility as low risk, but the risk is not zero. Gains are not guaranteed, and even when positives, are typically time cyclic.
If the college fees are negligible, why do they even offer a loan?
For living expenses, text books and so on?
One friend of mine worked for two years here after his BS in Computers, then went to Texas for his Masters.
He worked at gas stations at night, as it was triple time, no cash transactions (no stick ups possible), and did his studies sitting in the office.
Food, all you can eat places.
Now, he is a very rich man, got to work as Asia Pacific head of IT for a Swiss bank out of Singapore, now back in India.
If you need a higher standard of living, find more work, and invest your profits wisely.
But taking a loan to speculate is most foolish.
As for the European market, wait till winter sets in, what will you do without energy?
If you think the market is down now, tell me then.
For living expenses, text books and so on?
One friend of mine worked for two years here after his BS in Computers, then went to Texas for his Masters.
He worked at gas stations at night, as it was triple time, no cash transactions (no stick ups possible), and did his studies sitting in the office.
Food, all you can eat places.
Now, he is a very rich man, got to work as Asia Pacific head of IT for a Swiss bank out of Singapore, now back in India.
If you need a higher standard of living, find more work, and invest your profits wisely.
But taking a loan to speculate is most foolish.
As for the European market, wait till winter sets in, what will you do without energy?
If you think the market is down now, tell me then.
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The safest course is to use the low interest loan to buy government bonds that pay a higher interest rate than your loan. Actually an available option around here! Downside is buying bonds in a different currency, then even with higher interest rates, the other currency value can drop.
In mutual funds most people do not realize the full benefits. They tend to buy the fund that has just performed among the best and then sell it when it is not doing as well. So they are buying high and selling low. So if buying a mutual fund look at the long term return, not just the current numbers.
Most funds that have done well long term are reasonably safe and will yield more returns than bonds at slightly greater risk.
My best returns have come from buying and improving real estate. One property I bought for 40 ish, improved by 20 or so of repairs and improvements, 20 years later is worth 350-450. However annual taxes and insurance run up to 6 a year now. (Covered by rent!) Started much lower of course, but as property values climb so do taxes and insurance. Real estate does require that you have the ability to maintain it.
Currently my passive investment income is twice my cost of living.
My grandfather bought stock in a company run by a friend. He gave a bit of it to all his grandchildren. It was fun reading the annual reports as the company never made money and finally went bust.
As a child I received a bit of money and wanted to invest it in the #2 computer company. My parents stock broker suggest I put the money into a larger consumer products company that also made computers. That produced returns barely above average. The stock I wanted did eventually “fail” and was acquired for what was the $180 cash per original share and stock in the acquiring company. I would have held 500+ shares after a few stock splits had my parents not been persuaded to only allow me to buy another stock.
My policy is only buy stock in companies you do business with. When the company starts doing stupid things to raise the stock price wait one year then sell. Most investors will only have access to profit and loss numbers and not a feel for customers responses. So the stupid stuff usually creates a short term profit bubble.
In mutual funds most people do not realize the full benefits. They tend to buy the fund that has just performed among the best and then sell it when it is not doing as well. So they are buying high and selling low. So if buying a mutual fund look at the long term return, not just the current numbers.
Most funds that have done well long term are reasonably safe and will yield more returns than bonds at slightly greater risk.
My best returns have come from buying and improving real estate. One property I bought for 40 ish, improved by 20 or so of repairs and improvements, 20 years later is worth 350-450. However annual taxes and insurance run up to 6 a year now. (Covered by rent!) Started much lower of course, but as property values climb so do taxes and insurance. Real estate does require that you have the ability to maintain it.
Currently my passive investment income is twice my cost of living.
My grandfather bought stock in a company run by a friend. He gave a bit of it to all his grandchildren. It was fun reading the annual reports as the company never made money and finally went bust.
As a child I received a bit of money and wanted to invest it in the #2 computer company. My parents stock broker suggest I put the money into a larger consumer products company that also made computers. That produced returns barely above average. The stock I wanted did eventually “fail” and was acquired for what was the $180 cash per original share and stock in the acquiring company. I would have held 500+ shares after a few stock splits had my parents not been persuaded to only allow me to buy another stock.
My policy is only buy stock in companies you do business with. When the company starts doing stupid things to raise the stock price wait one year then sell. Most investors will only have access to profit and loss numbers and not a feel for customers responses. So the stupid stuff usually creates a short term profit bubble.
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I'm not saying yes or no to anything at all until I've decided to actually do an investment.
Right now the best investment may seem to be reduced energy footprint, but I foresaw the coming turbulence last year and I have already installed solar panels on my roof and a bedrock based geothermal heatpump. So it's not as bad as many others have it.
In time I may consider getting a large battery system to reduce our grid dependence instead of selling the extra power like we are doing now. Electric power is the oil of the future, and I drive an EV so ...
Thank you @Medisinmannen for your very informative posts 10 and 12.
Thank you @multisync will definitely read up some there.
Thanks to all you other guys as well, not discarding any of this information as it really seems like you have the best intentions at heart.
While I do not have any experience to speak of, I am very reluctant to invest in funds because I did a real life comparison between several different funds a while back ended up with me being not overly impressed with the performance.
Stocks seem like a much better investment to me, I did spend time reading and did some carefully selected minor trades a few years ago and was able to turn 300$ into 2000$ which I sold at their peak in January this year. The stocks I ended up trading for have more or less retained their value and not really dropped that much, and even though it's not much I got some dividend so... Slightly more positive towards stocks than funds with some caveats.
We will see what the world looks like in a couple of months and I will carefully consider what to do when I have the funds in hand.
Meanwhile I am grateful for any information posted.
Oil and gas is around 28% of norways GDP (2022) - rising (energy) prices will cause it to grow higher. Winter will be hard non the less - cost of electricity and gas demand from rest of europe will drive it even higher. Another story is the refineries and lack of fuel as the US is seeing. It may hit Norway at some point.
For those whom give the student loans a hard time, read more about it here: https://lanekassen.no/en-US/gjeld-og-betaling/what-are-student-loans/
Notice "
- interest-free while you are studying fulltime
- includes debt insurance which covers you in the event of disability or death
- If you become disabled, sick, or end up in other situations that cause you to have a low income, you can have some of your loan deleted, or your interest can be deleted.
The student loans may be disposed as one pleases. It is ment to support during studies. It does not come with any obligation to be used for education.
While I'm unaware of the specifics of the loan program which you are referencing, I think it extremely unlikely that it means what you wrote above. It's called a student loan, for a reason. That reason being, to fund directly education related expenses. Not for financial market investment. I very much doubt (almost to a certainty) that they do not intend for taxpayer backed, low-interest rate funds to be utilized toward an recipient's financial investment plan. The possibility seems very likely that you would have committed fraud. Consider yourself warned.
But it IS what people do all the time. They taking out home equity loans so they can play the market and try to make 20%. Until 2008 happens. When interest rates were high (anybody remember 10+ %?) it sort of discouraged the practice.
Business loans are the same way. Borrow hundreds of thousands, invest it in your business, in the HOPES of generating a profit later. And most small businesses fail. The ones that survive, and survive things like Covid, are the ones that don’t owe their soul to the bank so they can ride out lean times.
Business loans are the same way. Borrow hundreds of thousands, invest it in your business, in the HOPES of generating a profit later. And most small businesses fail. The ones that survive, and survive things like Covid, are the ones that don’t owe their soul to the bank so they can ride out lean times.
Historically, the market always goes up over the long term. Well established governments are stable and reliable. Measures have been put in place to avoid ever having another depression. WWII was the last major conflict and nothing like that will happen again. We become used to these things and think they will never change. I hope I'm wrong, but I think these are very precarious times and, even though the market is down, it seems like a risky time to invest.
This isn’t primarily a question of the wisdom of debt financed investing, which, as said above, is common. It’s primarily a question of the legality of using funds from a student loan program to do so. The solution is simple, ask the loan source directly what the funds may, and may not be used for. If you don’t want to ask, that shows your suspicion that what you plan is not permitted.
Exactly what they said after WWI.
Remeber Fukuyama's 'The end of history'. Boy how wrong he was!
Jan
The object of the current dispute is erosion of the dollar as a world currency.
A new economic order is forming.
In such a situation, the old ways and goalposts may shift.
In short, too risky.
Play with your own money, if you wish, prudently.
But diverting funds without clearance to play the market in such a situation is beyond insane.
A new economic order is forming.
In such a situation, the old ways and goalposts may shift.
In short, too risky.
Play with your own money, if you wish, prudently.
But diverting funds without clearance to play the market in such a situation is beyond insane.
Here Barclays gave out loans without proper verification at 14% flat (26% reducing) to people with bad credit records, the staff and agents made 10% as fees.
Barclays started in India in 2004, funds were from UK at 4%...initially big profits.
Then 2008 happened, and by 2010 they had vanished, sudden office closures and so on.
They lost so much money that they could not pay the rent on their offices, and staff use up the collection as salary.
Moral: The market is unpredictable, and unless you are prudent, and long term, say 10 years, don't.
Your course will last 4 years, and then repayment will start, in 2026.
By that time the US would have gone belly up, Mad Max scenario.
Then what will you do?
Barclays started in India in 2004, funds were from UK at 4%...initially big profits.
Then 2008 happened, and by 2010 they had vanished, sudden office closures and so on.
They lost so much money that they could not pay the rent on their offices, and staff use up the collection as salary.
Moral: The market is unpredictable, and unless you are prudent, and long term, say 10 years, don't.
Your course will last 4 years, and then repayment will start, in 2026.
By that time the US would have gone belly up, Mad Max scenario.
Then what will you do?
While I do understand what most of you guys are saying, this thread was meant to be about "Investments/Stocks/Funds", and not about insanity or doomsday scenarios.
Even though it just happens to be that I chanced upon a possibly great opportunity that will very likely never present itself again, I really have not decided about anything at all.
If you do not have anything to bring to the table except doomsday prophecies, I would kindly ask you, please, use that to start a a separate thread.
I am well onboard with the fact that this limited opportunity carries risk, but even though I should lose a part of the money the risk is very manageable.
I wish to thank everyone that have posted proper information up to this point, the rest of you: I understand your concern, I am not doing anything that could possibly be construed as illegal, I have not decided to gamble blindly, merely seeking information, if you do not have any relevant information to bring to the table please move along and let this thread be.
If you are still concerned about me and this very beneficial government funded loan, if I eventually decide that the risk is too great I am just as likely to invest in my house and property or even just pay a bit extra on my mortgage since I will never get the same interest rate on that.
Even though it just happens to be that I chanced upon a possibly great opportunity that will very likely never present itself again, I really have not decided about anything at all.
If you do not have anything to bring to the table except doomsday prophecies, I would kindly ask you, please, use that to start a a separate thread.
Breathing air also carries risk. Merely existing carries risk. There is varying degrees of risk involved in just about everything that happens in life.
I am well onboard with the fact that this limited opportunity carries risk, but even though I should lose a part of the money the risk is very manageable.
I wish to thank everyone that have posted proper information up to this point, the rest of you: I understand your concern, I am not doing anything that could possibly be construed as illegal, I have not decided to gamble blindly, merely seeking information, if you do not have any relevant information to bring to the table please move along and let this thread be.
If you are still concerned about me and this very beneficial government funded loan, if I eventually decide that the risk is too great I am just as likely to invest in my house and property or even just pay a bit extra on my mortgage since I will never get the same interest rate on that.
Don't be upset. If seasoned members here see a clear danger of another member about to throw away his life, you should appreciate the warning. And then, of course make your own desicion.
Jan
I urge you to schedule a meeting with your local bank some financial advice. They will see your current financial status and whats most benefical for you.
Many people seem to have doubt about the special student loan we have in Norway, which is understandable. Your bank will confirm and specify the arrangements of student loans.
I reiterate my advice to take the student loan no matter what. Put the money in "BSU"(another protected arrangement in Norway aimed towards housing) or invest it.
Some norwegian articles suggesting the same - one from the biggest bank in norway, the other from a clickbait site:
https://pengeverkstedet.no/blogg/sok-maks-studielan-uansett/
https://www.dnb.no/dnbnyheter/no/din-okonomi/dette-bor-du-vite-om-studiegjeld
Many people seem to have doubt about the special student loan we have in Norway, which is understandable. Your bank will confirm and specify the arrangements of student loans.
I reiterate my advice to take the student loan no matter what. Put the money in "BSU"(another protected arrangement in Norway aimed towards housing) or invest it.
Some norwegian articles suggesting the same - one from the biggest bank in norway, the other from a clickbait site:
https://pengeverkstedet.no/blogg/sok-maks-studielan-uansett/
https://www.dnb.no/dnbnyheter/no/din-okonomi/dette-bor-du-vite-om-studiegjeld
I think he just wants supporting confirmation about a decision already taken, a subliminal thing.
Sort of mental comfort, about a decision which now looks not so wise.
Anyway, if it is legal in his country, it is their money, and their laws which will punish him for default.
Here some doctors are allowed a period between finishing studies and repayment of student loans, so as to establish themselves.
Those details are not known in this case.
Sort of mental comfort, about a decision which now looks not so wise.
Anyway, if it is legal in his country, it is their money, and their laws which will punish him for default.
Here some doctors are allowed a period between finishing studies and repayment of student loans, so as to establish themselves.
Those details are not known in this case.
No need for doomsday to call your idea a naive/noob one, in the most polite way.
Simply said: if they are kept minimally safe, your investments will offer meager profit, if at all.
But hey, not your Dad or your caretaker, please go ahead and do what you please, who cares?
You did not come here to ask, but for confirmation.
Simply said: if they are kept minimally safe, your investments will offer meager profit, if at all.
But hey, not your Dad or your caretaker, please go ahead and do what you please, who cares?
You did not come here to ask, but for confirmation.
First you need to become aware of just what 'fiat currencies' are. They are pieces of paper, nothing more. You are lucky and happen to live in a country where those who hold power actually care about their country and people and made sure that the oil and gas wealth was'nt looted by the 'Seven Sisters' - the big oil companies of the US and the UK principally - look at what they did to Iran. No, Noway kept control of it's hydro carbons and made sure that it's own citizens were trained to run the whole operation and created what has come to be the biggest sovereign wealth fund in the world, because one day this bonanza will come to and end. So your currency has real value 'at the moment'.
Before you even think of investing you must stand back and take a good long view of the world and how it actually is, the direction it's going in and this is only possible if you have a 'view point' and not a 'point of view'.
Research,research and yes even more research. Do not ever believe that what is in a company report is even remotely like the reality of a company. A lot of companies that were big in 2000 do not even exist today. Markets used to take months even years to exit a bear market - think 1929 - it took 4 years to play out and only really came to an end with WW11. Then it became weeks and now markets can change within hours.
There is very a good finance programme on CNBC that has a truly worldwide perspective, if you can get it in Norway do, it is required viewing. You should'nt begin to think about actual investing until you have done some serious research. You need to be honest in what kind of person you are, if you invest outside of your actual character you will regret it. The best person to look after your money is you, anyone who tells you different is a conman and there are lots and lots of them.
You may think that 'day trading' is exciting it is but that requires a lots of balls and total concentration and all of your time , if your going to be studying it's a no-no and the stress on your health can do serious harm.
It's very easy to get sucked in to trends and lose all rational thinking. If you think you are going to make lots of money quickly then you are more than likely going to end up potless.
I have a cousin who worked his whole life in the oil business, he was a geologist, controlled some big projects in different parts of the world. He could have made a fortune with his knowledge and contacts but is ultra ultra conservative about money, which is just as bad as being over confident.
If you have family or friends who have real, not imagined knowledge about any particular field or industry seek them out. Never be afraid to take a profit or to accept that you made a mistake - ego has no value, only reality does.
Try and concentrate on just a few areas and stocks and set up a ghost portfolio and see how you do over say a year. If you get impatient you will pay a price. At your age I would not think about index funds or EFTs. All markets at this time have become distorted by insane amounts of Q/E over too many years - this is a very good time to study and take in what is happening - invest in haste, repent at leisure. Ego may make you think you can find the top and the bottom of a market, as any experienced investor will tell you - only sky pixies can do that - bon chance.
Before you even think of investing you must stand back and take a good long view of the world and how it actually is, the direction it's going in and this is only possible if you have a 'view point' and not a 'point of view'.
Research,research and yes even more research. Do not ever believe that what is in a company report is even remotely like the reality of a company. A lot of companies that were big in 2000 do not even exist today. Markets used to take months even years to exit a bear market - think 1929 - it took 4 years to play out and only really came to an end with WW11. Then it became weeks and now markets can change within hours.
There is very a good finance programme on CNBC that has a truly worldwide perspective, if you can get it in Norway do, it is required viewing. You should'nt begin to think about actual investing until you have done some serious research. You need to be honest in what kind of person you are, if you invest outside of your actual character you will regret it. The best person to look after your money is you, anyone who tells you different is a conman and there are lots and lots of them.
You may think that 'day trading' is exciting it is but that requires a lots of balls and total concentration and all of your time , if your going to be studying it's a no-no and the stress on your health can do serious harm.
It's very easy to get sucked in to trends and lose all rational thinking. If you think you are going to make lots of money quickly then you are more than likely going to end up potless.
I have a cousin who worked his whole life in the oil business, he was a geologist, controlled some big projects in different parts of the world. He could have made a fortune with his knowledge and contacts but is ultra ultra conservative about money, which is just as bad as being over confident.
If you have family or friends who have real, not imagined knowledge about any particular field or industry seek them out. Never be afraid to take a profit or to accept that you made a mistake - ego has no value, only reality does.
Try and concentrate on just a few areas and stocks and set up a ghost portfolio and see how you do over say a year. If you get impatient you will pay a price. At your age I would not think about index funds or EFTs. All markets at this time have become distorted by insane amounts of Q/E over too many years - this is a very good time to study and take in what is happening - invest in haste, repent at leisure. Ego may make you think you can find the top and the bottom of a market, as any experienced investor will tell you - only sky pixies can do that - bon chance.
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