Maybe my words came out wrong. The point i I was tying to make is that close in phase noise issues have been known for a long time but were and maybe still are being discounted.
AFAIK Jocko was one of the first to test for it and hear a difference. He caught a lot of grief because of it. To be fair I consider Jocko a friend so maybe I'm biased.
AFAIK Jocko was one of the first to test for it and hear a difference. He caught a lot of grief because of it. To be fair I consider Jocko a friend so maybe I'm biased.
Thanks, John!
Been using Crysteks myself lately and to my ears they bring forth more of the details that are in a recording.
However, there are persistent claims in the forum that NDK SDA measure better in terms of phase noise and sound better than Crystek 951, and there does seem to be something to like about both types of clocks. If selected NDK SDA were available somewhere I would try them, always curious.
Building DACs on my kitchen table, I don't have the equipment to measure phase noise. However, it does seem that which clock sounds best for a particular DAC depends on lot on the state of other parts of the DAC. Same thing with regard to which reconstruction filter sound best. No wonder people have opinions that are all over the place.
The troll situation is unfortunate, nothing to be done about it though. No way for one side to convince the other. Minds are already made up, much as is the human condition for other areas of human belief we can't talk about here.
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Ah, yet another person with a hammer, an agenda, and no evidence. I guess not buying into your belief system makes me a troll.
I don't mean this to be an attack on you, and my previous post was not an attack on Jocko. I just don't think there's any evidence that this theory is widely accepted. I know that you're a capable designer but everyone here has an opinion and they frequently don't agree.
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Yeah, he was quite concerned with SPDIF input conditioning as well, I figured that just ended up in the jitter column. I'm not saying he's technically wrong, I just think that it's human nature to focus on our area of specialty when it comes to problem solving.
I see a lot of claims on close-in phase noise (mostly on this forum), but never any tests.
@JohnW:
Sorry, I missed the posts after your initial reply where you clarified, so the tone of my previous reply may have been a little harsh.
The Crysteks don't seem to perform better than the NDK parts as Mark mentioned. In fact, I was informed by a co-worker that the Crysteks sourced from Mouser performed similarly to a few cheap garden variety Epson and Kyocera XOs measured on an Agilent E5052 or similar. I didn't see the data, but they were being evaluated for a high speed SERDES clock application. Maybe those were good samples of the generic XOs, but still.
WRT trolls, just ignore them (him). He's just a speed hump in this forum, nothing more.
WRT clocks, attached below actual phase noise of selected NDK clocks I have
purchased form Mr 'J'. All things considered, very impressive and a real step above the Crystek.
TCD
It seems like you can get pretty good results out of any of these simple XOs with AT cut crystals if binned.
Benchmark appears to be using a generic part and also running it through logic before the converter unless I am interpreting the PCB pictures wrong, yet it does not hurt their measured results or their reviews.
My personal opinion is this is just a convenient scapegoat and way to differentiate your product. I am not saying anyone here is outright lying, but peeking for sure.
So what? Like the raved over and now unobtainum Pulsar clocks, its a fairy story of magic long lost from the world for most of us. We have to make do with what we can get now.
As who what?
Can someone tell me where I can get 10 each of 22/24Mhz dac clocks as good as shown on that graph?
Though I suppose you are well off.. Phew. 20 pieces like that.. Not joking, unfortunately, again..
What I have inserted there, is valid. There is something wrong with forum software. Did you try to copy/paste the link in a new browser window? And search for ar-t.co
Strange problem. Finally found it though, thank you. Doesn't look like the right kind of place to ask, but I'll try 🙂
Relaaaax Mark, you will achieve better results. 🙂
All of the clocks you mention above are available.
Jocko hasn't just measured NDK's, he's obviously measured and
characterized a lot of clocks including Crysteks and at various
frequencies. The selection process is involved, he's extremely knowledgeable,
when he talks, I listen.
TCD
I’m receptive to facts, not BS. As 5th element pointed out, this still does not achieve anything resembling full separation. I shouldn’t even waste my time reading your posts anyway since we all know your agenda.
Sorry that asking questions you can’t answer forces you to add me to your ignore list. If you’re looking for blind adulation based on your reputation you should probably stick to the Audio Asylum.
I won’t deny there could be advantages to this approach, but if it were so clearly superior then it will show itself in the measurements.
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