Hi, so was about to buy a pair of DB technology Ingenia IG3Ts until someone suggested the RCF HDL 10 and it got me thinking... in a one top and one sub situation to start with ( will add more later ) witch will give me the most output and coverage/ throw. I understand the vertical coverage of the RCF is much much less, and that doesn’t bother me, I need horizontal coverage and projection. They cost roughly the same and are of a similar weight and have similar frequency range. There’s only a 10 degree difference between the too in horizontal coverage. 110 vs 100. Witch out of the 2 will throw the sound over a greater distance, indoors and outdoors.
When I eventually add a second box per side, will there suddenly be a clear winner out of the 2, if that makes sense. One top box per side for now thought.
Biggest differences I can see are:
IG3T: 900w RMS , 2x10”LF, HF 1.4”, crossover 1100Hz
RCF: 700w RMS , 2x8”LF , HF 2” , crossover 800Hz
Thought it might be useful to get others thoughts on this pairing
Thanks Luke
When I eventually add a second box per side, will there suddenly be a clear winner out of the 2, if that makes sense. One top box per side for now thought.
Biggest differences I can see are:
IG3T: 900w RMS , 2x10”LF, HF 1.4”, crossover 1100Hz
RCF: 700w RMS , 2x8”LF , HF 2” , crossover 800Hz
Thought it might be useful to get others thoughts on this pairing
Thanks Luke
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Don't fall into the trap of using a single line array box. You need 5+ per side to get any mileage from them.
Since it's diyAudio, why not build some?
I highly recommend the Faital Pro 10FH520. They've served as the midbass drivers in my PA system for the past few years, and sound great even when you're dropping over a kilowatt into each driver.
Chris
Since it's diyAudio, why not build some?
I highly recommend the Faital Pro 10FH520. They've served as the midbass drivers in my PA system for the past few years, and sound great even when you're dropping over a kilowatt into each driver.
Chris
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Well I’m already going to be building my subs, 15” tapped horns, so I don’t want to be building the top as well, I don’t have the time to start with...
With proper aiming, I can’t see why a single or 2 line array boxes can’t work, I know a lot of people and venues doing it with great results.. obviously your not getting the advantage of line array, but that wouldn’t happen until 6+ boxes a side anyway.
With proper aiming, I can’t see why a single or 2 line array boxes can’t work, I know a lot of people and venues doing it with great results.. obviously your not getting the advantage of line array, but that wouldn’t happen until 6+ boxes a side anyway.
Generally, line array boxes are designed to be used in multiples, and will be processed accordingly. When you're using small numbers, you'll need to apply additional processing, and you've still got exceptionally narrow vertical dispersion.
Given that, I'd go with the IG3T of your choices above.
Chris
Given that, I'd go with the IG3T of your choices above.
Chris
Chris already said it, just one element won't work. RCF lists 4 units per side as a minimal configuration (12 is the listed maximum).
The dB Technologies Ingenia IG3T will have the better low mids, the RCF have to be crossed over much higher if you want the max spl. You can stack 2 of the IG3T per side head-to-head, which gives you more range and spl with much less rigging, the IG3T weighs 22,24kg per speaker, the RCF 25,4 kg per unit. That means, in the minimal configuration of the RCF you're already at over 100kg per side and need some kind of lift.
With the IG3T you'll be much more flexible and save truckspace and weight. They can be used even in very small venues. The RCF is at the minimum stack size 4 always dependent on solid rigging because of the high weight and needed height.
You will not get really long throw from either of these. The Ingenia IG3T will reach further in the small stack, a big stack of the RCF will get a bit further though. If you need really long throw without a delay line, you have to go for horn tops with narrower dispersion and nearfills. That's still less rigging than for the LA.
Which THs will you get? Horns change properties with stack size but it depends on the horn construction if or how much they gain extended low frequency. A lot of THs are not working in larger stacks because the frequency extension of the horn function cancels the direct radiated sound because of the shifted phase.
Open air you'll need ~4 subs per IG3T.
I'd strongly suggest to go for the IG3T.
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looking at the user manuals reveals that the IG3t is designed with a vertical topology (i.e. one on top of the other with the long dimension vertical) whereas the RCF is horizontal and keeps high frequency elements closer together.
and for me the difference between the 1.4'' hf of the Ig and the 2'' hf of the RCF i would go with the RCF.
and for me the difference between the 1.4'' hf of the Ig and the 2'' hf of the RCF i would go with the RCF.
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The RCF got a height of 29,4cm and with the few mm air between the elements it's a distance of 30cm from compression driver to compression driver. The tweeter-to-tweeter cluster of the dB INGENIA IG3T are actually only 25cm apart because of the asymmetrical horn.
That's plain shortsightedly wrong. The 2" driver flange RFC got a voice coil of 65mm while the 'just 1,4" driver' of the dB got a 72mm VC. Flange size is not equal voice coil size. It would be nice if you'd at least look up what you're talking about.
But as I already wrote, these are completely different concepts and not for the same use at all. If you can/will always bring the rigging and ballast for the RCF line array, go for that. You can't downscale the LA though. If you want to be more flexible and want to be able to do small gigs too, the dB are the much better choice.
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just trying to highlight differences no need to be condescending about inaccuracy of details i'll differ to your wisdom ICG.
You've recommended someone to spend several thousand $$$ founded on two wrong 'facts'. I'm sorry to hurt your feelings but I think Lukey123 deserves that these mistakes got straightened out very clearly than your feelings getting pampered. How would YOU feel if you've spent 13000 bucks on speakers and 3000+ on rigging (yes, that's how much the minimum usable configuration is!) because someone like you recommendet something without knowing the things and rather founding that recommendation on two things that are actually exactly the opposite? I suppose that would hurt a bit more than just your feelings. 😡
yeah it is important to research things so one knows what one is speaking of....DB is made by AEB Industriale s.r.l, founded in 1974 in Bologna, Italy and is part of the RCF group of companies so you can go to the "offshoot" or go to the "well source"...if you want budget to dominate a performance discussion ok.
no feelings have been hurt by or from any posts...
no feelings have been hurt by or from any posts...
No, it's never a performace discussion. It's in the end always performance per buck, even if they say 'costs are no issue'. Luke wrote:
..and there it is.. -^^
I'm glad to hear that because that wasn't my intention.
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