Or where is the life ?
Or even what is the life? And what is the consciousness? Anyone who has had a general anaesthetic will have asked this I think. And what's more, you won't get any answers. Banishing consciousness: the mystery of anaesthesia | New Scientist
All of that ignores the fact that we are human and a possibly unique human trait of our ability to put ourselves in other's shoes and feel their possible fears and terror.
To be empathetic enough as to change the way you live - especially in a way that goes against mainstream society and attracts so much opposition - is evolution. People with more of that empathy act more human IMHO. We are animals, yes but we are human animals and there is no comparison to any other animal.
IMHO that is to be celebrated. I say, celebrate being human by being more empathic.
What you seemed to express is "they don't care about us, so why should we care about them?" .
I've heard people say that kind of thing, then they discover they've an underlying health problem, told to change the way they live their lives by a doctor and they refuse... whilst their loved ones painfully watch them get worse and worse. Maybe something will convince you, but it will be too late?
You're right, being vegan or vegetarian is a part solution to the problem. It's not the reason you decide to try to solve the problem, it IS a (part) solution. Have to realise (and many don't) how much food is produced for feeding animals in order to make money. It's not efficient in any way shape or form to do that. Much much more efficient to feed humans directly with crops. But I guess until the day money is less important than human survival, nothing will change much.
Being empathetic has nothing to do with being vegan. I can be empathetic still being omnivorous. Then from my perspective one has to define a line with being empathetic because Nature is not empathetic at all. It only is occasionally. I didn't mean at all that I don't care about animals. Because I live, appreciate and respect Nature I don't like to be out of it in a "new" world. I have grown up this way and I have no reason to change my mind. I don't see anything wrong about it. I don't care if this is what most people think or I am only part of a minority.
Free range animals don't need artificial food, only need some natural food and naturally grown food that is way cheaper to produce because it doesn't have all the restrictions of the food for humans. Wild game don't need anything artificial. I actually made the example of the hens that can feed mostly on the family organic waste! That's also eco-friendly (big saving!) and one gets eggs and chickens. I see no reason not to eat chicken. Same with the pig. The fact is that All edible animals are vegan, vegetarian and some omnivorous. So food cost it is not a problem for them. On top of that what you save on feeding animals you have to eat it because the vegan diet is less efficient. Intensive farming is business and is not the same thing. As you say the problem is just business and I am sure that even if we all go vegan there will be business. So it is not a solution. Nothing will change, vegan or not, until money will be less important....but money gives power so that's not going to happen.
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And where would those crops come from?Much much more efficient to feed humans directly with crops.
Do unto others as you would have them do unto you. If there's anything else of importance I must have missed itPostmodern wisdom from 1500 years ago.
It's an old idea rebranded. Like the others it will fail in it's ultimate aim because it's exclusive. Individuals pick 'n' mix from it regardless of what the Vegan Society or PETA excetera would like. The ideology creates unnecessary problems, as an example, there is a discussion about whether having a guide dog is ethical. It's positive that it's discussed, most things that are not in the explicit stated philosophy of the Vegan Society are shut down within the organisations.
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Just on the subject of plants having feelings.
I found this :
21 Stupid Things People Say To Vegans
Excerpt:
7. But vegetables feel pain too. I saw this on a vegan forum once, a response so brilliant, I wish I could take credit… “I tell you what, I will jab you in the eye with this carrot – let’s see who feels more pain, you or the carrot”. If plants could feel pain, they would have evolved a mechanism for avoid it. And meat eaters are still eating plants, it is just processed through the bodies of animals, so if they really cared about plant-rights they would give up meat.
I found this :
21 Stupid Things People Say To Vegans
Excerpt:
7. But vegetables feel pain too. I saw this on a vegan forum once, a response so brilliant, I wish I could take credit… “I tell you what, I will jab you in the eye with this carrot – let’s see who feels more pain, you or the carrot”. If plants could feel pain, they would have evolved a mechanism for avoid it. And meat eaters are still eating plants, it is just processed through the bodies of animals, so if they really cared about plant-rights they would give up meat.
Given that listeners commonly refer to vinyl sound as "organic" and using it for one's audio craving may be considered as sacrifice of it (grooves wear out). This would make CDs Buddhists or possibly vegans.Are cds and vinyl vegan?
Sorry SJ, you are far too thoughtful.So, the argument is, it's ok because they don't scream (in a way you can hear) and run away?
The arguments interest me on both sides. When omnivores are challenged on the ethics of eating meat they often seem to come up with ridiculous excuses and counter arguments. I wonder whether those who do that do actually feel guilty, I think many must do, otherwise why do they feel so strongly that they have to defend their position?Sorry SJ, you are far too thoughtful.
Must be the "natural urge".otherwise why do they feel so strongly that they have to defend their position?
What's that? Not all have it and it's the end of discussion? Oh, OK.
So, the argument is, it's ok because they don't scream (in a way you can hear) and run away?
It's because they don't have brain, nerves etc.
What's the etc? Plants have the abilities to perceive, move, learn, communicate without the brain and nervous systems of animals. There are some animals that don't have a brainIt's because they don't have brain, nerves etc.
I didn't believe that until I started reading internet forums.There are some animals that don't have a brain
I'm not one, but they certainly exist, yes. Obviously, the environment in which military service is performed varies a lot (some people in the military are basically working office jobs) and with it, one imagines, the difficulty of following any particular set of dietary preferences.Are there any Vegans in military service?
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