And the power supply board that is coming, right?
I guess my question would be, are the existing reviewers going to get to hear the whole package that makes Katana sound it's best? If not, I would be disappointed.
There is no power supply board. Isolator is the only board that we offer to upgrade for those that wish so. Katana sounds great without it .
We will send reviewers isolators once they become available so you can compare.
My apologies. I must have been thinking of something else.
Regarding some things being audible but not showing up as THD, Martin Mallinson of ESS has some youtube videos that have been mentioned in other threads where he explains about how dac modulators work in state space and that state space variable settling can affect audibility yet not show up for continuous input tone test signals. He also says that although the effects are extremely tiny, some people can hear them. In addition to youtube, one of the videos and a paper describing some of the same things in print have been available on the downloads page at ESS for a long time.
Moreover, having done some work with ESS dacs, although they can sound extremely good, they are sensitive to all sorts of little things in the implementation. Based on my listening experience so far, chances are I will probably hear some difference with the isolator board.
Beyond that, I am still interested in the on and off discussion that goes on here about Kali. Presumably it is to reclock I2S from RPi?
Nirvana is a PSU
Once isolator is available , it will be sent to all reviewers. Will be interesting to compare
Once isolator is available , it will be sent to all reviewers. Will be interesting to compare
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Excellent review congrats,
but Michelangelo reported:
"Both wifi and wired (wifi was slower than usual, I guess the Katana does a faraday cage around the PI 3B+)"
Would it be possible to disconnect the RPi from the Katana stack and to provide a wired connection to it to get rid of the Faraday cage?
Thanks
Matt
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Just a thought, if one buys the player how easy is it to get at the jumpers to try different power configurations?
I would say affect on network speed is inconclusive. Perhaps some other network interference.
- Tests running piCorePlayer with a 4.14.56-rt34 kernel.
- Nothing was streaming at the time of the test.
- Server is a Intel NUC with an intel i7 processor.
- The no Katana test is just the raw rpi3b+ board, no other cards added, no case.
iperf3 results, default options.
- Tests running piCorePlayer with a 4.14.56-rt34 kernel.
- Nothing was streaming at the time of the test.
- Server is a Intel NUC with an intel i7 processor.
- The no Katana test is just the raw rpi3b+ board, no other cards added, no case.
iperf3 results, default options.
Code:
rpi3b+ ethernet - no Katana
[ ID] Interval Transfer Bandwidth Retr Cwnd
[ 4] 0.00-1.00 sec 34.8 MBytes 292 Mbits/sec 0 339 KBytes
[ 4] 1.00-2.00 sec 34.5 MBytes 289 Mbits/sec 0 339 KBytes
[ 4] 2.00-3.00 sec 34.4 MBytes 289 Mbits/sec 0 359 KBytes
[ 4] 3.00-4.00 sec 34.2 MBytes 287 Mbits/sec 0 359 KBytes
[ 4] 4.00-5.00 sec 31.5 MBytes 264 Mbits/sec 0 469 KBytes
[ 4] 5.00-6.00 sec 31.5 MBytes 264 Mbits/sec 0 469 KBytes
[ 4] 6.00-7.00 sec 31.3 MBytes 263 Mbits/sec 0 469 KBytes
[ 4] 7.00-8.00 sec 31.1 MBytes 261 Mbits/sec 0 469 KBytes
[ 4] 8.00-9.00 sec 31.6 MBytes 265 Mbits/sec 0 523 KBytes
[ 4] 9.00-10.00 sec 31.3 MBytes 263 Mbits/sec 0 523 KBytes
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
[ ID] Interval Transfer Bandwidth Retr
[ 4] 0.00-10.00 sec 326 MBytes 274 Mbits/sec 0 sender
[ 4] 0.00-10.00 sec 325 MBytes 273 Mbits/sec receiver
rpi3b+ ethernet - Katana
[ ID] Interval Transfer Bandwidth Retr Cwnd
[ 4] 0.00-1.00 sec 34.7 MBytes 291 Mbits/sec 0 305 KBytes
[ 4] 1.00-2.00 sec 34.2 MBytes 287 Mbits/sec 0 318 KBytes
[ 4] 2.00-3.00 sec 34.3 MBytes 288 Mbits/sec 0 318 KBytes
[ 4] 3.00-4.00 sec 33.9 MBytes 285 Mbits/sec 0 318 KBytes
[ 4] 4.00-5.00 sec 34.4 MBytes 289 Mbits/sec 0 334 KBytes
[ 4] 5.00-6.00 sec 34.0 MBytes 285 Mbits/sec 0 334 KBytes
[ 4] 6.00-7.00 sec 34.1 MBytes 286 Mbits/sec 0 334 KBytes
[ 4] 7.00-8.00 sec 34.1 MBytes 286 Mbits/sec 0 334 KBytes
[ 4] 8.00-9.00 sec 34.3 MBytes 288 Mbits/sec 0 334 KBytes
[ 4] 9.00-10.00 sec 33.9 MBytes 285 Mbits/sec 0 334 KBytes
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
[ ID] Interval Transfer Bandwidth Retr
[ 4] 0.00-10.00 sec 342 MBytes 287 Mbits/sec 0 sender
[ 4] 0.00-10.00 sec 342 MBytes 287 Mbits/sec receiver
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------
rpi3b+ wifi - 2.4GHz - no Katana
[ ID] Interval Transfer Bandwidth Retr Cwnd
[ 4] 0.00-1.00 sec 5.29 MBytes 44.4 Mbits/sec 0 279 KBytes
[ 4] 1.00-2.00 sec 6.84 MBytes 57.4 Mbits/sec 0 402 KBytes
[ 4] 2.00-3.00 sec 6.86 MBytes 57.5 Mbits/sec 0 450 KBytes
[ 4] 3.00-4.00 sec 7.00 MBytes 58.7 Mbits/sec 0 475 KBytes
[ 4] 4.00-5.00 sec 6.50 MBytes 54.5 Mbits/sec 0 525 KBytes
[ 4] 5.00-6.00 sec 7.12 MBytes 59.7 Mbits/sec 0 609 KBytes
[ 4] 6.00-7.00 sec 6.75 MBytes 56.6 Mbits/sec 0 639 KBytes
[ 4] 7.00-8.00 sec 6.46 MBytes 54.2 Mbits/sec 0 639 KBytes
[ 4] 8.00-9.00 sec 7.06 MBytes 59.3 Mbits/sec 0 639 KBytes
[ 4] 9.00-10.00 sec 7.48 MBytes 62.6 Mbits/sec 0 639 KBytes
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
[ ID] Interval Transfer Bandwidth Retr
[ 4] 0.00-10.00 sec 67.4 MBytes 56.5 Mbits/sec 0 sender
[ 4] 0.00-10.00 sec 66.3 MBytes 55.6 Mbits/sec receiver
rpi3b+ wifi - 2.4Ghz - Katana
[ ID] Interval Transfer Bandwidth Retr Cwnd
[ 4] 0.00-1.00 sec 6.76 MBytes 56.7 Mbits/sec 0 370 KBytes
[ 4] 1.00-2.00 sec 7.16 MBytes 60.1 Mbits/sec 0 437 KBytes
[ 4] 2.00-3.00 sec 7.05 MBytes 59.1 Mbits/sec 0 486 KBytes
[ 4] 3.00-4.00 sec 6.78 MBytes 56.9 Mbits/sec 0 510 KBytes
[ 4] 4.00-5.00 sec 7.34 MBytes 61.6 Mbits/sec 0 536 KBytes
[ 4] 5.00-6.00 sec 6.28 MBytes 52.7 Mbits/sec 0 564 KBytes
[ 4] 6.00-7.00 sec 6.83 MBytes 57.3 Mbits/sec 0 659 KBytes
[ 4] 7.00-8.00 sec 6.91 MBytes 58.0 Mbits/sec 0 659 KBytes
[ 4] 8.00-9.00 sec 6.98 MBytes 58.5 Mbits/sec 0 659 KBytes
[ 4] 9.00-10.00 sec 6.76 MBytes 56.7 Mbits/sec 0 691 KBytes
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
[ ID] Interval Transfer Bandwidth Retr
[ 4] 0.00-10.00 sec 68.9 MBytes 57.8 Mbits/sec 0 sender
[ 4] 0.00-10.00 sec 68.0 MBytes 57.0 Mbits/sec receiver
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------
rpi3b+ wifi - 5GHz - no Katana
[ ID] Interval Transfer Bandwidth Retr Cwnd
[ 4] 0.00-1.00 sec 11.4 MBytes 95.3 Mbits/sec 0 206 KBytes
[ 4] 1.00-2.00 sec 11.7 MBytes 98.0 Mbits/sec 0 216 KBytes
[ 4] 2.00-3.00 sec 11.6 MBytes 97.7 Mbits/sec 0 228 KBytes
[ 4] 3.00-4.00 sec 11.8 MBytes 98.7 Mbits/sec 0 228 KBytes
[ 4] 4.00-5.00 sec 11.8 MBytes 98.6 Mbits/sec 0 239 KBytes
[ 4] 5.00-6.00 sec 12.0 MBytes 100 Mbits/sec 0 239 KBytes
[ 4] 6.00-7.00 sec 11.6 MBytes 97.5 Mbits/sec 0 239 KBytes
[ 4] 7.00-8.00 sec 11.9 MBytes 99.7 Mbits/sec 0 252 KBytes
[ 4] 8.00-9.00 sec 12.2 MBytes 102 Mbits/sec 0 354 KBytes
[ 4] 9.00-10.00 sec 12.1 MBytes 102 Mbits/sec 0 533 KBytes
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
[ ID] Interval Transfer Bandwidth Retr
[ 4] 0.00-10.00 sec 118 MBytes 99.0 Mbits/sec 0 sender
[ 4] 0.00-10.00 sec 117 MBytes 98.2 Mbits/sec receiver
rpi3b+ wifi - 5GHz - Katana
[ ID] Interval Transfer Bandwidth Retr Cwnd
[ 4] 0.00-1.00 sec 14.3 MBytes 120 Mbits/sec 0 253 KBytes
[ 4] 1.00-2.00 sec 15.3 MBytes 128 Mbits/sec 0 280 KBytes
[ 4] 2.00-3.00 sec 15.6 MBytes 130 Mbits/sec 0 280 KBytes
[ 4] 3.00-4.00 sec 15.0 MBytes 125 Mbits/sec 0 301 KBytes
[ 4] 4.00-5.00 sec 15.5 MBytes 130 Mbits/sec 0 301 KBytes
[ 4] 5.00-6.00 sec 15.4 MBytes 129 Mbits/sec 0 301 KBytes
[ 4] 6.00-7.00 sec 15.2 MBytes 128 Mbits/sec 0 301 KBytes
[ 4] 7.00-8.00 sec 15.5 MBytes 130 Mbits/sec 0 317 KBytes
[ 4] 8.00-9.00 sec 15.4 MBytes 129 Mbits/sec 0 317 KBytes
[ 4] 9.00-10.00 sec 15.8 MBytes 133 Mbits/sec 0 478 KBytes
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
[ ID] Interval Transfer Bandwidth Retr
[ 4] 0.00-10.00 sec 153 MBytes 128 Mbits/sec 0 sender
[ 4] 0.00-10.00 sec 152 MBytes 128 Mbits/sec receiverJumpers are just moved from one location to another. Except the rpi power isolation, which the jumper comes installed, and you just pull it to isolate it.
"I can’t sustain a listening session of more than an hour without wanting to stop the music and take a rest."
Ouch!
Ping stats from Katana running on Pi3B w/integrated WiFi adapter (2.4G) to my Router don't show anything suspicious and there are no audio glitches whatsoever. The NDK's have EMI shielding which may help explain the clean 2.4G ping stats.
Code:
pi@rp3:~ $ ping rt-n66u
PING rt-n66u.home (192.168.1.1) 56(84) bytes of data.
pi@rp3:~ $ ping rt-n66u
PING rt-n66u.home (192.168.1.1) 56(84) bytes of data.
64 bytes from rt-n66u (192.168.1.1): icmp_seq=1 ttl=64 time=1.77 ms
64 bytes from rt-n66u (192.168.1.1): icmp_seq=2 ttl=64 time=2.01 ms
64 bytes from rt-n66u (192.168.1.1): icmp_seq=3 ttl=64 time=1.22 ms
64 bytes from rt-n66u (192.168.1.1): icmp_seq=4 ttl=64 time=4.71 ms
64 bytes from rt-n66u (192.168.1.1): icmp_seq=5 ttl=64 time=5.53 ms
64 bytes from rt-n66u (192.168.1.1): icmp_seq=6 ttl=64 time=4.76 ms
64 bytes from rt-n66u (192.168.1.1): icmp_seq=7 ttl=64 time=4.74 ms
.
.
.
64 bytes from rt-n66u (192.168.1.1): icmp_seq=984 ttl=64 time=4.66 ms
64 bytes from rt-n66u (192.168.1.1): icmp_seq=985 ttl=64 time=4.71 ms
64 bytes from rt-n66u (192.168.1.1): icmp_seq=986 ttl=64 time=1.40 ms
64 bytes from rt-n66u (192.168.1.1): icmp_seq=987 ttl=64 time=1.44 ms
64 bytes from rt-n66u (192.168.1.1): icmp_seq=988 ttl=64 time=4.81 ms
64 bytes from rt-n66u (192.168.1.1): icmp_seq=989 ttl=64 time=4.43 ms
64 bytes from rt-n66u (192.168.1.1): icmp_seq=990 ttl=64 time=4.37 ms
64 bytes from rt-n66u (192.168.1.1): icmp_seq=991 ttl=64 time=1.56 ms
64 bytes from rt-n66u (192.168.1.1): icmp_seq=992 ttl=64 time=5.07 ms
64 bytes from rt-n66u (192.168.1.1): icmp_seq=993 ttl=64 time=4.76 ms
64 bytes from rt-n66u (192.168.1.1): icmp_seq=994 ttl=64 time=4.75 ms
64 bytes from rt-n66u (192.168.1.1): icmp_seq=995 ttl=64 time=4.57 ms
64 bytes from rt-n66u (192.168.1.1): icmp_seq=996 ttl=64 time=4.90 ms
64 bytes from rt-n66u (192.168.1.1): icmp_seq=997 ttl=64 time=5.72 ms
64 bytes from rt-n66u (192.168.1.1): icmp_seq=998 ttl=64 time=1.81 ms
64 bytes from rt-n66u (192.168.1.1): icmp_seq=999 ttl=64 time=4.34 ms
64 bytes from rt-n66u (192.168.1.1): icmp_seq=1000 ttl=64 time=1.51 ms
^C
--- rt-n66u.home ping statistics ---
1000 packets transmitted, 1000 received, 0% packet loss, time 1000655ms
rtt min/avg/max/mdev = 1.203/4.372/29.799/2.366 ms
pi@rp3:~ $
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Yes I know that 🙂. The review mentioned it was no easy job to assemble and recommended buying the player which comes preassembled in the case. What I am getting at is do you have to disassemble it to remove/move the jumpers in which could be a pain if you want to play around with the 3 different ways of powering it.
The jumpers can be moved without any disassembly. There is a battery connector and leads plugged into the power connector on the Katana board. If the Katana external power jumper is removed then 5v power can be connected to the wire leads. Otherwise, just don't let the wire leads short out to anything. To remove the leads and plug from the jack on the Katana board, some disassembly would be required. Actually, taking the boards apart from each other and putting them back together is pretty easy for someone with any mechanical skills. It's just 4 threaded standoffs to unscrew and some pin headers to unplug.
That could be from the quality of recordings as much as anything else. A good dac will reveal whatever is there. Best way to deal with recordings with sound quality defects may be to mp3 encode them. The worse they are to begin with the lower mp3 bitrate may be needed to make them sound as good as possible. It works the way it does because mp3 is a lossy encoder that tries to reduce file size by throwing away information that doesn't contribute all that much to musical enjoyment. It tries to keep the essence of what is important.
Of course, for very well recorded music, my preference is to hear it in full glorious hi-res detail.
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