Just Got to Here
Now I have to go to my next job, but I made it to here for now. This thread reads like a novel. I wish all audio communities were like this!
Now I have to go to my next job, but I made it to here for now. This thread reads like a novel. I wish all audio communities were like this!
Only a few years late and couldn't find any glue on Tesa's site to compare, but this works great on drivers, books, etc., though no clue whether it would keep oil in a diaphragm: White Neutral pH Adhesive | Lineco
GM
I am planning to copy what Godzilla has done with a single driver sitting a top of an H-frame containing an Eminence Alpha 15. I have a few dumb questions (always) and just looking for suggestions from those who have done this, before I make sawdust. No rush however, as it wil be after my daughter's quinceanera in a few weeks. I need to keep the cost low, but don't want to wish I had spent a little bit more on something later.
I have never used a sub or bass amp before, but plan to purchase one Dayton Audio SA 100. I have never gotten into taking measurements, but I guess I can play with the gain and crossover controls on the Dayton until it sounds best to me? I guess I can try both the low and high inputs, but will probably start with the high ones. Please advise if I should spend a little more for any different sub amp?
I plan to use Godzilla's 19" x 19" baffle on top with the Eminence 12LTA. I need an efficient single driver, as I plan to power it and tweeter with my 45 tupe flea power.
I now have access to a place that can order appleply for about half the price I paid when I built by BIB's. I really like it, but am thinking painted MDF also looks nice and don't know if it the ply would make any significant sonic difference in the h-frame, since being open front and back should eliminate most any pressures? Does the material or thickness of the material for the open baffle make any sonic difference?
Here come my dumb questions. All I really need to do is connect the 12LTA and ADS 1001 in parallel with appropriate cap in series with the tweeter? I guess that gives me about 4 ohms. I have a Fostex attenuator rated for 8 ohms that I used for my 208 sigma/T90A BIB's (before I removed the tweeters). I assume connecting the attenuator increased the impedance that the amplifier sees? I have read that tube amps like a higher impedance. And, connecting the Dayton sup amp's high input from the outputs of my 45 tube amp will not affect the impedance that my 45 amp sees? I still have my Fostex T90A supertweeters. I was never that fond of them. They certainly are more expensive than the Eminence ADS 1001's! If you guys think the ADS 1001's would work best in this set up, I could try selling them to help fund the project?
I apologize in advance for lots of dumb questions. I am excited to do this, having played around with some drivers from a couple old consoles in quick and dirty OB experiments. I mean for this to be a low budget project, but I don't want it to be as quick and dirty as my last OB experiments. I have read in the thread that there are some peaks to be expected. Comments on how to deal with them are welcome. However, I think all of us in this thread are more inclined to not go with unnecessary circuitry in front of the drivers.
Godzilla, that you for your encouragement! I decided to be brave (despite my obvious lack of knowledge) and post my questions on the forum, since everyone here is very nice to each other.
Sincerely,
Benjamin
I have never used a sub or bass amp before, but plan to purchase one Dayton Audio SA 100. I have never gotten into taking measurements, but I guess I can play with the gain and crossover controls on the Dayton until it sounds best to me? I guess I can try both the low and high inputs, but will probably start with the high ones. Please advise if I should spend a little more for any different sub amp?
I plan to use Godzilla's 19" x 19" baffle on top with the Eminence 12LTA. I need an efficient single driver, as I plan to power it and tweeter with my 45 tupe flea power.
I now have access to a place that can order appleply for about half the price I paid when I built by BIB's. I really like it, but am thinking painted MDF also looks nice and don't know if it the ply would make any significant sonic difference in the h-frame, since being open front and back should eliminate most any pressures? Does the material or thickness of the material for the open baffle make any sonic difference?
Here come my dumb questions. All I really need to do is connect the 12LTA and ADS 1001 in parallel with appropriate cap in series with the tweeter? I guess that gives me about 4 ohms. I have a Fostex attenuator rated for 8 ohms that I used for my 208 sigma/T90A BIB's (before I removed the tweeters). I assume connecting the attenuator increased the impedance that the amplifier sees? I have read that tube amps like a higher impedance. And, connecting the Dayton sup amp's high input from the outputs of my 45 tube amp will not affect the impedance that my 45 amp sees? I still have my Fostex T90A supertweeters. I was never that fond of them. They certainly are more expensive than the Eminence ADS 1001's! If you guys think the ADS 1001's would work best in this set up, I could try selling them to help fund the project?
I apologize in advance for lots of dumb questions. I am excited to do this, having played around with some drivers from a couple old consoles in quick and dirty OB experiments. I mean for this to be a low budget project, but I don't want it to be as quick and dirty as my last OB experiments. I have read in the thread that there are some peaks to be expected. Comments on how to deal with them are welcome. However, I think all of us in this thread are more inclined to not go with unnecessary circuitry in front of the drivers.
Godzilla, that you for your encouragement! I decided to be brave (despite my obvious lack of knowledge) and post my questions on the forum, since everyone here is very nice to each other.
Sincerely,
Benjamin
BenjaminWebber, if your room isn’t too big the Dayton SA100 should be fine. If you feel your room is big, get the next model up. My room is about 12’ x 25’ and the SA100 works just great. These subwoofer amps have two dials on them, one for volume (gain) and frequency. Just dial them in as needed to blend the woofers into the 12LTA. Start by setting them both in the middle and work your way up and down. It’s easy.
I let the 12LTA play full and do not connect them into the subwoofer amp. They go directly to the main amp. So both the subwoofer and the 12LTAs are connected to the same amp terminals.
I did not hear any difference between MDF and plywood in my open baffle setup but prefer plywood. For boxed speakers I can hear the sound of the MDF (as a dulling of the sound) compared to the plywood. I find particle board perfectly fine for boxed speakers and often build boxes this way with plywood on the front.
You can use the existing T90A super tweeter but I don’t know how you would attach it to the baffle with the 12LTA.
I like the Eminence ASD1001 but wish they were a little bit brighter at the tippy top of their range. Overall, they have more impact in the treble than the other tweeters I’ve heard.
You have the 4 ohm wiring wrong. Just connect the 12LTA and let it play full. The tweeter just gets a capacitor. I think I have a 1.33uf on mine - that’s it. Place this on top of the H-frame and dial in the subwoofer to taste.
https://speakerprojects.wordpress.com/2016/08/29/eminence-beta-12lta-on-open-baffle/
I let the 12LTA play full and do not connect them into the subwoofer amp. They go directly to the main amp. So both the subwoofer and the 12LTAs are connected to the same amp terminals.
I did not hear any difference between MDF and plywood in my open baffle setup but prefer plywood. For boxed speakers I can hear the sound of the MDF (as a dulling of the sound) compared to the plywood. I find particle board perfectly fine for boxed speakers and often build boxes this way with plywood on the front.
You can use the existing T90A super tweeter but I don’t know how you would attach it to the baffle with the 12LTA.
I like the Eminence ASD1001 but wish they were a little bit brighter at the tippy top of their range. Overall, they have more impact in the treble than the other tweeters I’ve heard.
You have the 4 ohm wiring wrong. Just connect the 12LTA and let it play full. The tweeter just gets a capacitor. I think I have a 1.33uf on mine - that’s it. Place this on top of the H-frame and dial in the subwoofer to taste.
https://speakerprojects.wordpress.com/2016/08/29/eminence-beta-12lta-on-open-baffle/
Attachments
Thank you Jeff!,
I guess I am still a little fuzzy on the impedance. So, let's say I start at the plus out of my 45 amp. One wire goes to the high input plus of the Dayton SA100, and from the Dayton amp out to the plus of the Alpha 15 speaker terminal. Repeat for the minus of each. Then, another wire goes from the same plus out terminal of the 45 amp to the plus terminals of both the 12LTA & tweeter (except the cap before the plus of the tweeter). Repeat for the minus connections (except no cap needed anywhere). I could either use jumper wires or biwire 12 LTA & tweeter. What impedance would my 45 amp see? If I add the 8 ohm attenuator to the tweeter circuit what impedance would my 45 amp then see? I see the ADS1001 tweeter is spec'd more efficient than the 12LTA. I know I was happiest (in my BIB) with my T90A tweeter attenuated a lot (and I could still hear it). But, if I go with the ADS1001 tweeter I only need the cap?
Sincerely,
Benjamin
I guess I am still a little fuzzy on the impedance. So, let's say I start at the plus out of my 45 amp. One wire goes to the high input plus of the Dayton SA100, and from the Dayton amp out to the plus of the Alpha 15 speaker terminal. Repeat for the minus of each. Then, another wire goes from the same plus out terminal of the 45 amp to the plus terminals of both the 12LTA & tweeter (except the cap before the plus of the tweeter). Repeat for the minus connections (except no cap needed anywhere). I could either use jumper wires or biwire 12 LTA & tweeter. What impedance would my 45 amp see? If I add the 8 ohm attenuator to the tweeter circuit what impedance would my 45 amp then see? I see the ADS1001 tweeter is spec'd more efficient than the 12LTA. I know I was happiest (in my BIB) with my T90A tweeter attenuated a lot (and I could still hear it). But, if I go with the ADS1001 tweeter I only need the cap?
Sincerely,
Benjamin
Ugh! Been there, done that too many times and next thing you know, you're old.
Regardless, hope you do better than average and maybe wear a motorcycle racer's protector, etc., if you're going to ride in traffic.
GM
hey Benjamin - what kind of waveguide/horn are you intending to use with ASD1001? (you could use the bolt on version without any waveguide - just mount to a thin baffle plate) - - with a single cap highpass for it as helper, it may have some interaction with its impedance.
Zilla - there's a hellva lot of ringing at the top with ASD1001 - its "bright" in that regard - look at it constrained by the directivity of Beta10cx's crude waveguide - an 11dB peak around 19KHz is pretty bright to me - but I can't hear it as limited to ~12K5 tops in old age - hahaha
I do like ASD1001
Zilla - there's a hellva lot of ringing at the top with ASD1001 - its "bright" in that regard - look at it constrained by the directivity of Beta10cx's crude waveguide - an 11dB peak around 19KHz is pretty bright to me - but I can't hear it as limited to ~12K5 tops in old age - hahaha
I do like ASD1001
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Feel better sippy. Must have been a bad accident.
BenjaminWebber, you are correct in your wiring. As for the ohms, you will have an 8 ohm load. The ASD1001 is rated at about 103db. All I think all you will need is the right cap to blend it with the 97db 12LTA. I don't think an L-pad is necessary.
Maybe the L-pad is better? I just haven't tried it.
I used this waveguide but you can try something else. Just keep it small. http://www.daytonaudio.com/index.ph...-5-x-4-5-elliptical-waveguide-1-threaded.html
freddi, I don't think I can hear above 16kHz. I'm 50. My 18 year old son says the ASD1001 sometimes bothers him when the music is on all day. But he loves the 12LTA + ASD1001 overall. As you know from another thread about compression drivers I'm somewhat bothered by excessive frequencies around 7kHz.
BenjaminWebber, you are correct in your wiring. As for the ohms, you will have an 8 ohm load. The ASD1001 is rated at about 103db. All I think all you will need is the right cap to blend it with the 97db 12LTA. I don't think an L-pad is necessary.
Maybe the L-pad is better? I just haven't tried it.
I used this waveguide but you can try something else. Just keep it small. http://www.daytonaudio.com/index.ph...-5-x-4-5-elliptical-waveguide-1-threaded.html
freddi, I don't think I can hear above 16kHz. I'm 50. My 18 year old son says the ASD1001 sometimes bothers him when the music is on all day. But he loves the 12LTA + ASD1001 overall. As you know from another thread about compression drivers I'm somewhat bothered by excessive frequencies around 7kHz.
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hey Benjamin - what kind of waveguide/horn are you intending to use with ASD1001? (you could use the bolt on version without any waveguide - just mount to a thin baffle plate) - - with a single cap highpass for it as helper, it may have some interaction with its impedance.
Zilla - there's a hellva lot of ringing at the top with ASD1001 - its "bright" in that regard - look at it constrained by the directivity of Beta10cx's crude waveguide - an 11dB peak around 19KHz is pretty bright to me - but I can't hear it as limited to ~12K5 tops in old age - hahaha
I do like ASD1001
Hi freddi,
I am still inclined to use the same one Godzilla used, but any suggestions are of course welcome. I don't claim in any way to know what I am doing! I just hope to benefit from the knowledge others have gained by doing what has worked for them. Another option might be for me to use my T90A's, but thinking I will be better off with the ASD1001 with waveguide? If I did use my T90A's I could keep them close to the 12LTA (something I think I should do?) by the following: I would mount the 12LTA very near the top edge of the baffle. I could put a "ledge" at the top of the back side of the baffle for the T90A to sit on.
Benjamin,
Don't forget to remove the dustcap
I was on a pedal powered cycle GM - these days I only go out on a motorbike when it's really quiet and Never near traffic.
Hardest bit was not being able to surf... next year maybe.
Don't forget to remove the dustcap
Ugh! Been there, done that too many times and next thing you know, you're old.
Regardless, hope you do better than average and maybe wear a motorcycle racer's protector, etc., if you're going to ride in traffic.
GM
I was on a pedal powered cycle GM - these days I only go out on a motorbike when it's really quiet and Never near traffic.
Hardest bit was not being able to surf... next year maybe.
>>> Zilla - there's a hellva lot of ringing at the top with ASD1001 - its "bright" in that regard - look at it constrained by the directivity of Beta10cx's crude waveguide - an 11dB peak around 19KHz is pretty bright to me - but I can't hear it as limited to ~12K5 tops in old age - hahaha
freddi, LOL, funny how we are building speakers and we can't even hear all of the frequencies.
freddi, LOL, funny how we are building speakers and we can't even hear all of the frequencies.
Good to know, thanks, as his previous drivers [CSS] I've auditioned in the 40-1354 MLTLs were all too sibilant for me and their older owner.
GM
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