Hey guys,
I've been curious about this phenomenon for quite some time - I've developed something of a fetish for dome midranges (Aren't they just the sexiest things?), however.....as I've come to learn about them, I've realized that they probably aren't as luscious as I had previously thought they were due to the difficulty of being able to properly implement them with success. While I understand that they have the benefit of behaving like a domed tweeter - providing better dispersion and such - but then I think....."Isn't that what we have waveguides for?" (For better dispersion), as well as the issue of having lower bandwidth than a traditional cone would generally have has really swayed me away from them
(Also, I find it ironic that what is considered to be an illustrious mid is the ATC dome, which is really where my fascination began with them)
But I digress, like my title states....why should one bother considering a dome midrange? (I'm really just looking for a good excuse to use one - like I said, they're hella sexy)
I've been curious about this phenomenon for quite some time - I've developed something of a fetish for dome midranges (Aren't they just the sexiest things?), however.....as I've come to learn about them, I've realized that they probably aren't as luscious as I had previously thought they were due to the difficulty of being able to properly implement them with success. While I understand that they have the benefit of behaving like a domed tweeter - providing better dispersion and such - but then I think....."Isn't that what we have waveguides for?" (For better dispersion), as well as the issue of having lower bandwidth than a traditional cone would generally have has really swayed me away from them
(Also, I find it ironic that what is considered to be an illustrious mid is the ATC dome, which is really where my fascination began with them)
But I digress, like my title states....why should one bother considering a dome midrange? (I'm really just looking for a good excuse to use one - like I said, they're hella sexy)
I have 3 pair of Dynaudio M560 dome mids D'appolilitto configuration in my home theatre front channels. MIT Film and foil crossover caps. Can't say I'm suffering. Replacements are about $1k each if you can find them.................
http://gattiweb.com/images/dynaudio/esotar_m560d_data.pdf
Martin Colloms frowns on midrange domes and prefers a good 6 or 7 inch driver which gets to 3khz without beaming too much and goes low enough to crossover out of the critical mid band.
( my main 2 channel rig is Martin Logan CLX with 2 JL audio F212s so I do have a reference to compare them with)
http://gattiweb.com/images/dynaudio/esotar_m560d_data.pdf
Martin Colloms frowns on midrange domes and prefers a good 6 or 7 inch driver which gets to 3khz without beaming too much and goes low enough to crossover out of the critical mid band.
( my main 2 channel rig is Martin Logan CLX with 2 JL audio F212s so I do have a reference to compare them with)
Small diameter dome mids paired with small tweeters give very wide and smooth directivity, and reasonably smooth power response. The problem is that as most of us put speakers in acoustically small rooms, then this is not a good feature! Sound may be clean and uncolored, but spatial imaging suffers. Alas if placed near side walls, sound changes too easily because of loud reflections.
That kind of speakers a good for acoustically treated and rather large rooms, that is one reason why we see these in studio monitors (like ATC) and in extremely expensive large consumer speakers (like Vivid Audio).
Tweeter wave guides give "better dispersion" only in sense of getting more directivity and better power response match to more conventional 4-6" midbasses in 2/3-way speakers.
One special feature of dome mids is their curved frequency response, which makes crossover design easy, 1st order electric funtions are widely used, leading to 2nd order acoustic. This however might lead to problems in power handling and the woofer must not have a cone resonance around 1,5-2kHz. More about this in the Zaph 3.5 case that was linked above by sreten.
That kind of speakers a good for acoustically treated and rather large rooms, that is one reason why we see these in studio monitors (like ATC) and in extremely expensive large consumer speakers (like Vivid Audio).
Tweeter wave guides give "better dispersion" only in sense of getting more directivity and better power response match to more conventional 4-6" midbasses in 2/3-way speakers.
One special feature of dome mids is their curved frequency response, which makes crossover design easy, 1st order electric funtions are widely used, leading to 2nd order acoustic. This however might lead to problems in power handling and the woofer must not have a cone resonance around 1,5-2kHz. More about this in the Zaph 3.5 case that was linked above by sreten.
Last edited:
They mate well with ribbon style tweeters.
They can be HP'd below 1k, so they are great for the W-T/M-W center channel arrangement.
Sealed chamber typically inherent.
Typically more sensitive than average cone mids.
I really like the ones I've used, and especially the Usher 9845 (NLA).
Later,
Wolf
They can be HP'd below 1k, so they are great for the W-T/M-W center channel arrangement.
Sealed chamber typically inherent.
Typically more sensitive than average cone mids.
I really like the ones I've used, and especially the Usher 9845 (NLA).
Later,
Wolf
Dome midrange and waveguide don't exclude each other. In fact they harmonize very well. The linked speakers has less distortion in midrange than any other with a single midrange driver I've seen so far. Just take a look at the measurements.
And midrange domes are usually "true" midrange drivers with. Their bandwidth is optimized for midrange and therefore their sensitivity. Most of the cone drivers are bass-midranges with lower sensitivity. Good for 2-way speakers, but not optimal for 3-ways or higher.
Compression Midranges vs Dome Midranges
Perhaps to add a little fire to this discussion, I was curious, as well, as to what your guys' thoughts were on the comparison between a compression driver dedicated to the midrange, vs. a dome midrange - both of which would be horn loaded.
Any comments/thoughts on that idea would greatly appreciated (Currently, I'm torn between a compression midrange, compared to a dome midrange, which is why I bring it up)
Perhaps to add a little fire to this discussion, I was curious, as well, as to what your guys' thoughts were on the comparison between a compression driver dedicated to the midrange, vs. a dome midrange - both of which would be horn loaded.
Any comments/thoughts on that idea would greatly appreciated (Currently, I'm torn between a compression midrange, compared to a dome midrange, which is why I bring it up)
Obviously, you have to expand on this topic/opinion?
There's a German brand that use dome's in horn loading?
And in my opinion sounds ok? But of course, subjective......
When you say horn loaded I'd assume you meant waveguided, as this probably better suits the band in question, in which case your main concern is the mechanical continuity at the throat.
I daresay you won't achieve that c-c with the dome mids readily available on the market.
A dome is heavier than the diaphragm of a compression driver, while the motor is weaker. This means that the efficiency bandwidth product is low. Having no phase plug and no compression complicates the practical aspect.
Furthermore, I have heard that soft domes are not strong enough to withstand the extra pressure from horn loading.
Last edited:
I don't completely buy that argument about weight and motor strength is so crucial as long it's within reasonable values.
I presume that Avant Garde's speakers are more a wave guide as Allenb mentioned earlier.
Just curious about this as I was listening to a pair of Duo's this week. I liked the sound at least.
Peter
Sent from my D5803 using Tapatalk
I presume that Avant Garde's speakers are more a wave guide as Allenb mentioned earlier.
Just curious about this as I was listening to a pair of Duo's this week. I liked the sound at least.
Peter
Sent from my D5803 using Tapatalk
They use spherical horns. These act more like a waveguide and can be similar to a LeCleach T>1, which are relatively short and start almost conical before rounding.
This usually means low/moderate loading. In my understanding using a driver under compression only serves to extend the highs in this kind of horn. A strong motor might be under-utilised.
I tried a spherical once. It sounded fairly open and clean.
This usually means low/moderate loading. In my understanding using a driver under compression only serves to extend the highs in this kind of horn. A strong motor might be under-utilised.
I tried a spherical once. It sounded fairly open and clean.
Hi there A: A major manufacturer of live sound equipment is using a conical horn with a quadratic throat. Could this be effectively utilized for a DIY dome mid driver application? I'm not sure if the manufacturer has released this horn for purchase separate from their diver. They have published a white paper on this horn, available through google it. regards, Michael
Last edited:
I don't think there's any specific reason to use a dome mid range, much the same as there's no real reason why you'd have to use a cone driver. Some dome mids perform excellently, as do some cone drivers and each come with their own set of limitations.
The 3" TB dome mid (Tangband-75-1558SE) is an example of a dome mid that you would want to use. Nice sensitivity, very low harmonic distortion and a frequency response that is workable. It would still need to be crossed over fairly low to maintain a good vertical response due to C2C spacing and I'd much rather pair it with a wave guide loaded tweeter, a DXT at the minimum I think.
The 3" TB dome mid (Tangband-75-1558SE) is an example of a dome mid that you would want to use. Nice sensitivity, very low harmonic distortion and a frequency response that is workable. It would still need to be crossed over fairly low to maintain a good vertical response due to C2C spacing and I'd much rather pair it with a wave guide loaded tweeter, a DXT at the minimum I think.
Seen this:https://www.facebook.com/PellegreneAcoustics?
His regular site seems to be off-line so I had to use Dave's FB page.
His regular site seems to be off-line so I had to use Dave's FB page.
Many use dome tweeters on waveguides like this. The Elsinore thread is just one example. The quadratic throat/os waveguide and conical have some similarities. By the way, it could be Peavey.
- Status
- This old topic is closed. If you want to reopen this topic, contact a moderator using the "Report Post" button.