Hi, this is my first post but I have read a lot of info from this forum...
I would like to build a subwoofer, sealed (small box size it's a must).
I want to use it mostly for music but also for movies from time to time (maybe twice/month).
My system is built from:
- PC with an Asus Essence Xonar ST audio card
- Stereo Integrated Amplifier NAD C 326BEE
- One pair of Monitor Audio BX2
The subwoofer will have a plate amplifier. I'm thinking to:
1. Wyntek WAM300-DSP
2. BASH300 (with a power transformer from 220V to 110V)
3. Hypex DS2.0
4. RCM Detonation DT 150
5. Dayton Audio SPA250
The drivers which I considered OK for this system were:
1. Dayton Audio RSS265HF-4
2. SB Acoustics SB29NRX75-6
3. CSS SDX10
4. ScanSpeak 26w/4558T00
5. SEAS L26ROY
6. Peerless XXLS P835016
I'm also open for other proposals in the price range up to 250EURO.
What I expect from the system is good quality (to go as low as possible and precision), not very loud music (because I have neighbors...)
Starting from these inputs I have used WinISD to do some modeling.
Used parameters are:
Qtc=0.707
Ql=15
Qa=20
As filters I used (the frequencies are from Wyntek amplifier, I don't know the type and order from this amplifier so I considered Butterworth Order 2):
- Highpass Butterworth Order 2 with 16 Hz Cutoff
- Lowpass Butterworth Order 2 with 160 Hz Cutoff
As you can see in the attachments the drivers with lowest F3 are:
1. SB Acoustics with 44.28 Hz
2. Dayton with 44.34 Hz
3. CSS with 46.10 Hz
As Group delay al 6 drivers are very close.
As SPL:
1. SEAS with 109.7 dB
2. CSS with 109.6 dB
3. Dayton with 108.1 dB
At Cone excursion I have used the power which will lead to maximum cone excursion where this power was smaller than rated power (Dayton and SB Acoustics) or the rated power in case that the power needed for Xmax was bigger than rated power. If I use the power for Xmax for some drives I will need more than 400W which is way beyond rated power and my price range and needs…
As box dimension what I could maximum afford is 35l net volume.
Now the questions:
1. Which driver should I use?
2. Which plate amplifier should I use?
3. It’s OK to use Qtc=0.707 or I should use other value?
4. It’s OK how I thought about power input (depending on which one is bigger rated or the one which gives Xmax)?
5. What is the difference between SPL and Maximum SPL in WinISD?
6. The used filters and parameters are OK?
Thanks.
I would like to build a subwoofer, sealed (small box size it's a must).
I want to use it mostly for music but also for movies from time to time (maybe twice/month).
My system is built from:
- PC with an Asus Essence Xonar ST audio card
- Stereo Integrated Amplifier NAD C 326BEE
- One pair of Monitor Audio BX2
The subwoofer will have a plate amplifier. I'm thinking to:
1. Wyntek WAM300-DSP
2. BASH300 (with a power transformer from 220V to 110V)
3. Hypex DS2.0
4. RCM Detonation DT 150
5. Dayton Audio SPA250
The drivers which I considered OK for this system were:
1. Dayton Audio RSS265HF-4
2. SB Acoustics SB29NRX75-6
3. CSS SDX10
4. ScanSpeak 26w/4558T00
5. SEAS L26ROY
6. Peerless XXLS P835016
I'm also open for other proposals in the price range up to 250EURO.
What I expect from the system is good quality (to go as low as possible and precision), not very loud music (because I have neighbors...)
Starting from these inputs I have used WinISD to do some modeling.
Used parameters are:
Qtc=0.707
Ql=15
Qa=20
As filters I used (the frequencies are from Wyntek amplifier, I don't know the type and order from this amplifier so I considered Butterworth Order 2):
- Highpass Butterworth Order 2 with 16 Hz Cutoff
- Lowpass Butterworth Order 2 with 160 Hz Cutoff
As you can see in the attachments the drivers with lowest F3 are:
1. SB Acoustics with 44.28 Hz
2. Dayton with 44.34 Hz
3. CSS with 46.10 Hz
As Group delay al 6 drivers are very close.
As SPL:
1. SEAS with 109.7 dB
2. CSS with 109.6 dB
3. Dayton with 108.1 dB
At Cone excursion I have used the power which will lead to maximum cone excursion where this power was smaller than rated power (Dayton and SB Acoustics) or the rated power in case that the power needed for Xmax was bigger than rated power. If I use the power for Xmax for some drives I will need more than 400W which is way beyond rated power and my price range and needs…
As box dimension what I could maximum afford is 35l net volume.
Now the questions:
1. Which driver should I use?
2. Which plate amplifier should I use?
3. It’s OK to use Qtc=0.707 or I should use other value?
4. It’s OK how I thought about power input (depending on which one is bigger rated or the one which gives Xmax)?
5. What is the difference between SPL and Maximum SPL in WinISD?
6. The used filters and parameters are OK?
Thanks.
Attachments
Last edited:
Seems to me that you have all under control. Small details/definition you can look in the tutorials. Power is usually RMS power (standard). Qtc being close to .7 gives you a good Q for the speaker close to optimal, not high not low meaning a good balance between extension, roll-off and output amplitude. Sensitivity is used for 1W or 2.83v output and max. SPL is used for max. output at max. power. The amp you use depends of the woofer you choose usually 4 or 8 ohms and adequate power (RMS).
http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/subwoofers/148729-how-correctly-use-winisd.html
http://www.speech.kth.se/prod/publications/files/qpsr/1966/1966_7_3_007-022.pdf
http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/subwoofers/148729-how-correctly-use-winisd.html
http://www.speech.kth.se/prod/publications/files/qpsr/1966/1966_7_3_007-022.pdf
Attachments
26W/8534G00 from Scan-Speak's Discovery series might be suitable for use in a sealed box, although it does not have the excursion capabilities of the aforementioned drivers.
http://scan-speak.dk/datasheet/pdf/26w-8534g00.pdf
This vented/Alu cone woofer you mention (SCANSPEAK 26W/8534G00 v2011, Sensitivity (2.83V/1m) 89 dB) is nuts, very good LF extension and very flexible working well from a minimal 55/65L (QTC = 0.8/0.76, F3/41 Hz) enclosure to a 80L sealed (QTC = 0.7, F3/42 Hz), or 120L/127L BR with infrasound response in this case. It only needs an amp for sealed of Pmin 12 W/8 Ohms (@max excursion) .
You are right that this Scan Speak 26W/8534G00 is good (it can go at very low frequencys), but unfortunately I do not have so much space for it... Also the SPL is very low because of the very small power needed for Xmax.
Using the same conditions like for the previous speakers it seems that I need a 66.5l enclouser for a Qtc=0.707 and a much smaller amplifier (18 W for Xmax). The price is also very good (under 100 EURO).
I think I will go with Dayton Audio RSS265HF-4 or CSS SDX10... and I believe it will be Wyntek plate amplifier...
Using the same conditions like for the previous speakers it seems that I need a 66.5l enclouser for a Qtc=0.707 and a much smaller amplifier (18 W for Xmax). The price is also very good (under 100 EURO).
I think I will go with Dayton Audio RSS265HF-4 or CSS SDX10... and I believe it will be Wyntek plate amplifier...
Attachments
Beyma Studio 10BR60-V2 needs almost 79l for a Qtc=0.707... It’s not OK for my space requirements.
My problem with CSS SDX10 is why does it need more than 500 W to get to Xmax when it is rated to 300 W? 😕
Someone in the industry can give you a better answer, but it's my understanding that using more power for Xmax or parameters like voice coil length, air gap, top plate distance are more forgiving in the case of a pro use like Xlim or extreme limit to that the cone can travel (mechanically) before getting destroyed or being stuck.
Thermal might be related to thickness of the wire and components (glue) melting points, and former materials (paper in the old drivers).
And what you do if the max excursion (@Xmax or approximate 1/2 Xmech) is achieved at 12W (with a well-sized box) and the driver mentions in it's specs 80/150W like the driver from post #3?!
Linear excursion ± 6 mm
Max mech. excursion ± 12 mm
And what you do if the max excursion (@Xmax or approximate 1/2 Xmech) is achieved at 12W (with a well-sized box) and the driver mentions in it's specs 80/150W like the driver from post #3?!
Linear excursion ± 6 mm
Max mech. excursion ± 12 mm
Hi!
I have bought a SEAS L26ROY and are going to build a 60L sealed sub powered with a Behringer EP2000.
If I like it I will make another one. Both will be in my living room mostly for music and some tv...
Did you decide on which sub to use and if so are you satisfied!?
I have bought a SEAS L26ROY and are going to build a 60L sealed sub powered with a Behringer EP2000.
If I like it I will make another one. Both will be in my living room mostly for music and some tv...
Did you decide on which sub to use and if so are you satisfied!?
I'd recommend Peerless drivers. Many are just as good as the very expensive ones (Seas, Dynaudio, Scan Speak, etc.). If you build a woofer tower, you'll get more even bass in any given location in the room, and therefore less boomy. Personally I'd put four 8 inch Peerless Nomex cone drivers in a tower on each side, and actively EQ them to be acoustically flat to 30HZ. Also a 4 pole crossover.
Yea, but it's worth it. Good low bass is intoxicating. Drums and sound effects in movies sound much better.
Hi, after a lot of research I finally chose the driver and the amplifier: DAYTON RSS265HF-4 with Wintek WAM300-Dsp.
For a while I also considered DAYTON RSS315HF-4 together with Hypex DS4.0 The graph is looking very good for the 12" driver but I had 2 major problems:
- the volume of the box (52l for 12" versus 28.7l for 10")
- the bigger price (600 including shipping for 12" driver and amp versus 450 euro including shipping for 10" driver and amp). Additional to this I needed a box which cost I estimated at 120 euro (wood + execution + sound absorbing material + different other materials) so in the end it's 570 euro 10" versus 720 euro 12" => 150 euro difference.
Searching on the market I found a sub-woofer which has a lot of good reviews: SVS SB-12 NSD at 549 euro and free shipping.
Unfortunately I decided to gave up to the DYI project because of lack of time, smaller price and less effort to get it.
Probably the sound quality of the 10" DIY sub-woofer is better than the SVS product but I will never know... 🙁
I will never give up to the DIY sub-woofer but this was not the moment for it.
For a while I also considered DAYTON RSS315HF-4 together with Hypex DS4.0 The graph is looking very good for the 12" driver but I had 2 major problems:
- the volume of the box (52l for 12" versus 28.7l for 10")
- the bigger price (600 including shipping for 12" driver and amp versus 450 euro including shipping for 10" driver and amp). Additional to this I needed a box which cost I estimated at 120 euro (wood + execution + sound absorbing material + different other materials) so in the end it's 570 euro 10" versus 720 euro 12" => 150 euro difference.
Searching on the market I found a sub-woofer which has a lot of good reviews: SVS SB-12 NSD at 549 euro and free shipping.
Unfortunately I decided to gave up to the DYI project because of lack of time, smaller price and less effort to get it.
Probably the sound quality of the 10" DIY sub-woofer is better than the SVS product but I will never know... 🙁
I will never give up to the DIY sub-woofer but this was not the moment for it.
Attachments
SVS subwoofer
Hello people, now I have used the SVS subwoofer for the last week and all I can say is that this subwoofer is UNREAL!!!!
I use to listen at low volumes music in the evening and this product is surprising me each day. It's like when I was a small child and I had a new toy... Each day I want to arrive home earlier for a new portion of vibrations into my pants, yes this is right vibrations in may pants!
You already know the system is the one from post 1. I have placed the subwoofer under my desk, somehow in front and between my legs. I have turned the gain button to 75% and the low pass at 50 Hz and everything it's INSANE! 😱 When I listen to some music I feel the vibrations in my legs (I don't know what moves... maybe my pants, maybe my hair from the legs but something moves 🙂 )
I have run a few bass test the result was that my furniture and windows started to vibrate... UNBELIEVABLE!!! I never thought that this can happen...
All what I can say is that I totally love to listen music or watch movies with this monster under my desk. Everything is changed!
As a small advise for those who want to build or buy a subwoofer: do it as fast as possible, you will never regret it! 😉
Hello people, now I have used the SVS subwoofer for the last week and all I can say is that this subwoofer is UNREAL!!!!
I use to listen at low volumes music in the evening and this product is surprising me each day. It's like when I was a small child and I had a new toy... Each day I want to arrive home earlier for a new portion of vibrations into my pants, yes this is right vibrations in may pants!
You already know the system is the one from post 1. I have placed the subwoofer under my desk, somehow in front and between my legs. I have turned the gain button to 75% and the low pass at 50 Hz and everything it's INSANE! 😱 When I listen to some music I feel the vibrations in my legs (I don't know what moves... maybe my pants, maybe my hair from the legs but something moves 🙂 )
I have run a few bass test the result was that my furniture and windows started to vibrate... UNBELIEVABLE!!! I never thought that this can happen...
All what I can say is that I totally love to listen music or watch movies with this monster under my desk. Everything is changed!
As a small advise for those who want to build or buy a subwoofer: do it as fast as possible, you will never regret it! 😉
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