I am looking to build a new pair of speakers and have a $1,000 max budget (would like to stay closer to $750 if possible). My room size is 15' x 20'. I am looking for clarity more than volume as I live in a duplex and have neighbors on the other side of the wall (if I want LOUD, I have to use headphones.) I have a Carver 250 watt per channel amp to power them with but will never use all of the power it has due to volume restrictions.
I currently have a set of Carver Amazing Silver series ribbon speakers which I am not too happy with. I love the high range clarity but they lack the "boomy" bass of some of my other speakers. I could probably just add a sub to the system, but dont really want to. I would rather build a new pair that will have the complete sound I am looking for.
I mostly listen to reggae and danchall music so the bass is of utmost importance. I can fabricate new cabinets if needed. But I have a set of recycled empty cabinets that I could use that would save time and money if I could reuse them. They are 3/4" thick and have internal dimensions of 36" high x 9" wide x 10" deep. The current speaker cutouts are not an issue as I am refacing the front with a new board so I can use any size / speaker combination.
I have a hard time determining which drivers are best to use when looking at manufacturer's description from Parts Express and other sources since they all of course say that they are the best. I realize that better drivers generally cost more than lesser quality ones, but it is hard to tell exactly how good they sound from the description.
Any one out there have any ideas of what I should build within this criteria? Anyone else have the Carver speakers who built a better sounding pair?
Thanks for any input, Brian
I currently have a set of Carver Amazing Silver series ribbon speakers which I am not too happy with. I love the high range clarity but they lack the "boomy" bass of some of my other speakers. I could probably just add a sub to the system, but dont really want to. I would rather build a new pair that will have the complete sound I am looking for.
I mostly listen to reggae and danchall music so the bass is of utmost importance. I can fabricate new cabinets if needed. But I have a set of recycled empty cabinets that I could use that would save time and money if I could reuse them. They are 3/4" thick and have internal dimensions of 36" high x 9" wide x 10" deep. The current speaker cutouts are not an issue as I am refacing the front with a new board so I can use any size / speaker combination.
I have a hard time determining which drivers are best to use when looking at manufacturer's description from Parts Express and other sources since they all of course say that they are the best. I realize that better drivers generally cost more than lesser quality ones, but it is hard to tell exactly how good they sound from the description.
Any one out there have any ideas of what I should build within this criteria? Anyone else have the Carver speakers who built a better sounding pair?
Thanks for any input, Brian
given the caveat that any system that can reproduce reggae & dance hall well is going to annoy your neighbours no matter what, I'd suggest as a starting point a good 8" woofer such as the SEAS CA22RNX in your 52 L cabinets (bi-amped of course...😀 - actually bi-amping will give you more control over the bass level)
Interesting write-up on the Amazings here:
Stereophile: Carver Amazing Loudspeaker (Platinum Edition)
Stereophile: Carver Amazing Loudspeaker (Platinum Edition)
I'd consider building Mark K's RS225/RS28A design.
Dayton Reference RS225
This will fit almost perfectly into the cabinet you've already got, the RS225 working very well into a ~50 litre cabinet, ported and tuned to around 27Hz.
Dayton Reference RS225
This will fit almost perfectly into the cabinet you've already got, the RS225 working very well into a ~50 litre cabinet, ported and tuned to around 27Hz.
Exactly! So...what is it exactly that you don't like about the sound of the Carvers?
IF IF IF you could isolate your chair/couch from the floor, I would seriously recommend some Aura Bass Shakers or the like. You can get that bass sensation without annoying the neighbors. It's not hi-fi, but if you set the level not too exaggerated it works really well. I'd recommend this regardless of what you do with speakers, because in your situation you simply can't have significant bass SPL in the air without annoying the neighbors, no matter what the heck speaker you design.
Definitely get a complete kit for the speaker, where someone has already designed the crossover. That is very hard to do without special tools. 8" seems about right. 3/4" is OK, but coat it and stuff the insides. Vance Dickason's Loudspeaker Cookbook
http://www.amazon.com/Loudspeaker-Design-Cookbook-Vance-Dickason/dp/1882580478
Loudspeaker Design Cookbook 7th Edition Book 500-035
will give you specifics for that, and a great general education about speakers.
You can look at Madisound and Zalytron for some additional kits.
Actually that's what I'd recommend.. though more specifically *build* a sub that's designed to be placed right behind your listening position (requiring *fully* variable phase). Also, its use should extend higher in freq. than a "real" sub - say 100+Hz low-pass crossover.
That would add the impact you are craving without seriously compromising the Carver's. Plus: because it's a "near-field" placement the sound levels will be lower than normal (placement), and effect your neighbors a bit less.
Rythmik Audio • GR servo driver
Rythmik Audio • Subwoofer plate amplifiers
http://www.rythmikaudio.com/images/A300SE.jpg
consider Bob's Cornscala style D. sound amazing. above 100db/w/m of efficiency will able you to use wide range of low power amplifiers. 😉
Like Scott said - subwoofer behind your head. There was a thread a few years back about this either here or on AudioCircle where a guy did exactly that. Seems like a great idea. Couple that with the bass shakers and you can Reggae out and not bother the neighbors.
If you are in attached housing, no sub. 60 Hz max. Unfortunately, full range music without headphones it a luxury for those whose living accommodations can tolerate it. Low frequencies just plain carry too well.
Maybe you can consider the nomex164 project from Troels Gravesen :
PEERLESS-NOMEX-164
Dimension cabinets are near from your one. I'm actually building this project in order to evaluate the drivers before building the Elsinore speaker (based on the same drivers) :
Construction d'enceintes "Nomex 164" - Le blog de pguerin
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I very much agree with Cal & would build the sub portion of this. Cheap, simple & it works.
Jordan JX92S OB with a Goldwood GW-1858 Woofer in an H Frame Project
Build the subwoofers , very unlikely you will better the carver without experience...
Best way my yute ..... 🙂
Best way my yute ..... 🙂
Have you checked the surrounds on the woofers? They may be rotted.
I used to have a pair in a room about the size of yours,and there was no shortage of bass.
I used to have a pair in a room about the size of yours,and there was no shortage of bass.
Here is the thread over on AudioCircle. A very cool idea.
Neighbor friendly dipole sub
I'm going to do something like this for a guy at work who likes to watch TV until midnight, but his neighbors go to bed at 9PM and are right on the other side of the wall from the TV.
Neighbor friendly dipole sub
I'm going to do something like this for a guy at work who likes to watch TV until midnight, but his neighbors go to bed at 9PM and are right on the other side of the wall from the TV.
Another view on this is perhaps that the low level listening isn't acceptable simply because of the way our ears frequency response changes at low levels. Even though my loudspeakers sound fine at low levels with driving bass music it does sound better louder. Maybe what you could do with is simply a circuit that provides a subtle loudness effect.
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Some good suggestions so far, please keep them coming.
Let me add a bit more to my specifications.
--My basement is also my workshop, not a "listening room." Putting a sub-woofer behind may work, but I don't have a dedicated chair to listen from. I would like speakers that sound well all around the room, not just a sweet spot in the center as I have 2 workbenches and a desk that I move around to.
--I am planning on building a tube amp of modest size, maybe 30 watts per channel. I would like to use the same speakers for it as well as my solid state, so higher efficiency speakers would be preferred.
Anyone know of any speakers that meet these as well as the previous criteria?
Thanks, Brian
Some good suggestions so far, please keep them coming.
Let me add a bit more to my specifications.
--My basement is also my workshop, not a "listening room." Putting a sub-woofer behind may work, but I don't have a dedicated chair to listen from. I would like speakers that sound well all around the room, not just a sweet spot in the center as I have 2 workbenches and a desk that I move around to.
--I am planning on building a tube amp of modest size, maybe 30 watts per channel. I would like to use the same speakers for it as well as my solid state, so higher efficiency speakers would be preferred.
Anyone know of any speakers that meet these as well as the previous criteria?
Thanks, Brian
Given that extra information... 30 watts is plenty to go loud enough that your neighbours would complain even on inefficient loudspeakers, but if you want to make the most of what you've got I'd recommend you ending up with...
A pair of main loudspeakers that have an extended bass response, driven by the valve amp.
A pair of small subs that also go deep, driven from the Carver.
Having multiple bass sources in the room is the best way you can approach trying to have even bass throughout the room. For the subs as loud isn't needed you can thus go deep with small and inefficient loudspeakers, but this tends to require some EQ to work the best and doesn't have to be expensive either.
I still think you should try using a simple loudness circuit and see if that helps solve the problem.
A pair of main loudspeakers that have an extended bass response, driven by the valve amp.
A pair of small subs that also go deep, driven from the Carver.
Having multiple bass sources in the room is the best way you can approach trying to have even bass throughout the room. For the subs as loud isn't needed you can thus go deep with small and inefficient loudspeakers, but this tends to require some EQ to work the best and doesn't have to be expensive either.
I still think you should try using a simple loudness circuit and see if that helps solve the problem.
Completely in agreement with more subs. Two a minimum. I prefer them on one wall. The next biggest thing you can do for stronger, cleaner bass is bass traps. Real ones. Not silly little foam blocks. Go buy 4 rolls of 24 inch R36 unfaced insulation and stack them in the opposing corner. Don't unwrap them. You may be very surprised. I tried to get a thread going about sound control, but got very little traction. Not as sexy and talking about a new tweeter I guess. It took me years, but I finally came to the conclusion you should spend as much on absorbers as on speakers. Great DIY too.
Tone controls are your friend. I miss my loudness knob. If I ever build another preamp, I'll put one on. The modern way would be to do it all with DSP.
Tone controls are your friend. I miss my loudness knob. If I ever build another preamp, I'll put one on. The modern way would be to do it all with DSP.
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