I have measured the drivers again in the cabinet of post 363.
Putting the data into the simulator and playing around with the crossover values i can already see that the response is even better and i can get a steeper null.
That does not require any more components and no change in topology.
I am very close now to play the prototypes in my system.
Putting the data into the simulator and playing around with the crossover values i can already see that the response is even better and i can get a steeper null.
That does not require any more components and no change in topology.
I am very close now to play the prototypes in my system.
So, the Satori woofer is kind of a mix up oft the Scan Speak Revelator und the Illuminator series? Similar motordesign und bass capabilities as the Illuminators and most as resonance free as the Revelators? Also the retailprice is in between... it's not cheap!
As for the tweeter i would go for scan speak...
As for the tweeter i would go for scan speak...
In General: It's kind of an unusal design process. Normally you got a concept and then you choose the drivers and components that fit the best. Here the drivers are set and something has to be developed...
As we all know, the problem with those 2-way 1"/6,5" combos is the off-axis behavior. Either way, you have to cross very deep/sharp (<1,5 KHz) or you have to use some kind of waveguide to match the drivers.
I dont't believe in time correction for 2-way, at least i can't hear any effects. In 3- oder more way systems, with deeper and sharper crossing that's another story... in those cases i would go full digital/FIR anyway.
As we all know, the problem with those 2-way 1"/6,5" combos is the off-axis behavior. Either way, you have to cross very deep/sharp (<1,5 KHz) or you have to use some kind of waveguide to match the drivers.
I dont't believe in time correction for 2-way, at least i can't hear any effects. In 3- oder more way systems, with deeper and sharper crossing that's another story... in those cases i would go full digital/FIR anyway.
Yes, the drivers are set. This is a thread about designing a kit for SB.
That is the reason i put it into Vendors Basar.
The time alignment of the drivers also helps to design a non phase linear crossover like an
L/R 4.
A passive L/R crossover with a flat baffle can be designed too but then we need all pass
elements to delay the tweeter. That makes the crossover more complex and also introduces additional phase distortion.
I did experiments on how much phase distortion is audible in the 90th with the University of Essex. We designed an active 2 way with DSP.
We made a 4th order L/R crossover and we could switch the phase distortion in or out.
With artificial pulses a small difference could be heard. With music it was much harder to differentiate.
In general i agree that a L/R 4 is a good compromise. I use an L/R2 here because the drivers are so wide band. I chose an L/R2 not only because it has less phase distortion then an L/R4 but also because the crossover topology is much simpler.
I think reducing losses by using less passive components in the crossover is a good idea.
When the speakers are ready i will also measure off axis to see how much problems i get there.
That is the reason i put it into Vendors Basar.
The time alignment of the drivers also helps to design a non phase linear crossover like an
L/R 4.
A passive L/R crossover with a flat baffle can be designed too but then we need all pass
elements to delay the tweeter. That makes the crossover more complex and also introduces additional phase distortion.
I did experiments on how much phase distortion is audible in the 90th with the University of Essex. We designed an active 2 way with DSP.
We made a 4th order L/R crossover and we could switch the phase distortion in or out.
With artificial pulses a small difference could be heard. With music it was much harder to differentiate.
In general i agree that a L/R 4 is a good compromise. I use an L/R2 here because the drivers are so wide band. I chose an L/R2 not only because it has less phase distortion then an L/R4 but also because the crossover topology is much simpler.
I think reducing losses by using less passive components in the crossover is a good idea.
When the speakers are ready i will also measure off axis to see how much problems i get there.
Yes, ist pretty simple nowadays with a DSP to manipulate phase while switchting from IIR to FIR... i can't hear much difference in mids/high.
Mr Goertz (also german) also did some very early experiments with the so-called HUGO controller and proofed that the benefits of FIR/linear phase mostly apply to bass.
Therefore I think there are only small benefits for 2-Way Systems to be phase-linear.
I think what really matters is off-axis behavior and the interaction with your listening-room. Most of the studio monitors have come up with some interesting solutions to control radiation...
Mr Goertz (also german) also did some very early experiments with the so-called HUGO controller and proofed that the benefits of FIR/linear phase mostly apply to bass.
Therefore I think there are only small benefits for 2-Way Systems to be phase-linear.
I think what really matters is off-axis behavior and the interaction with your listening-room. Most of the studio monitors have come up with some interesting solutions to control radiation...
Do you know that SB's head designer Ulrich Schmidt is a former employee at Scan-Speak? He is responsible for most revelator drivers, also the metal-dome.
Personally i think he's extremely talented and also heard he've been writing a book 'bout how a perfect driver should be constructed.
Yes Ulrik and his team are designing the SB drivers. I also know him from his time at Scan Speak.
The factory made cabinets have arrived. They look really cool and are perfectly made.
I will publish some photos soon.
I also bought components from Mundorf so i can make the crossovers over the weekend.
The factory made cabinets have arrived. They look really cool and are perfectly made.
I will publish some photos soon.
I also bought components from Mundorf so i can make the crossovers over the weekend.
I have now put the drivers into the factory made cabinets and did some photos.
The cabinets are so shiny that they are quite hard to photograph, especially at night and with flash. I hope you enjoy them nevertheless. I decided to put in the 8 Ohm version of the Satori woofer because i think that will be used most of the time. So we will have two designs.
The cabinets are so shiny that they are quite hard to photograph, especially at night and with flash. I hope you enjoy them nevertheless. I decided to put in the 8 Ohm version of the Satori woofer because i think that will be used most of the time. So we will have two designs.
Attachments
Joachim,
If the speakers sound as good as they look you will have a winner on your hands there. I really like the enclosures and I am more than picky myself. I particularly like both the contrast of colors and also the shape and the port flaring. Very nice work from someone on the loudspeaker side.
If the speakers sound as good as they look you will have a winner on your hands there. I really like the enclosures and I am more than picky myself. I particularly like both the contrast of colors and also the shape and the port flaring. Very nice work from someone on the loudspeaker side.
Joachim,
It looks like you still know how to make lemonade out of lemons....... Is the piano black finish paint or a laminate, and if it is what is the cabinet constructed from? I have pulled my hair out getting this type of black finish on mdf far to many times, and I am a painter when I need to be. I have painted many custom car finishes and know paint coatings very well. I imagine that the wood veneer is finished with a catalyzed two component clear coat and hand finished. Excellent work.
It looks like you still know how to make lemonade out of lemons....... Is the piano black finish paint or a laminate, and if it is what is the cabinet constructed from? I have pulled my hair out getting this type of black finish on mdf far to many times, and I am a painter when I need to be. I have painted many custom car finishes and know paint coatings very well. I imagine that the wood veneer is finished with a catalyzed two component clear coat and hand finished. Excellent work.