Using the new 2012 Shigaclone to create a killer high end transport

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tonyptony

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Joined 2006
#1
Now that payments are being made and production is starting for the 2012 Shigaclone

http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/digi...affordable-cd-transport-shigaclone-story.html

I thought we should start a new thread with recommendations for how to turn this latest version into a giant killer of a transport. First of course, great thanks needs to go out to our friends in Poland, Peter Daniel, Tvicol, Jazz35, and anyone else I forgot to mention. None of this would have been possible without this team's collective work.

With Tibi's okay it seemed like a new thread would be a good place to start this phase of discussion for the 2012 Shiga. My proposal is that we work on creating a transport that can go up against the likes of the ML 31.5, CEC TL0, Linn CD12, Wadias etc. I know there is no one "best transport in the world", just as there is no single best of anything in high end audio, but the plan is to try and get to a level where a tweaked Shiga can stand on its own against the most highly regarded transports of the past and present.

I’m not suggesting the new Shiga won’t sound good at the start – I suspect it will sound pretty darn good. The hope is to take it to the best it can be.

I further propose the following as a baseline definition:

  • Use the 2012 Shiga design currently in production as the starting point
  • Post (or link) the latest production schematics, BOM, PCB drawings etc
  • Use this thread to identify from the original Shiga thread(s), and any others, the key posts made to date which discuss advancing the design. I know this sounds vague, but rather than everyone searching through 600+ pages of one thread, plus any other related threads, I'm hoping those who were part of some of those original tweak discussions can provide links here so we can have one place where this information has been filtered.
Once we start getting these units and have had a chance to understand what they can do, perhaps then we can identify the areas where tweaking may prove beneficial… areas like

  • Power supplies (parts swap, or going further like considering a Bobken)
  • Clocks (although Peter has some interesting things to say about this)
  • Output stage
  • Specific component changes
  • Chassis and mounting options
  • Ferrites and shielding
A lot of discussion has occurred in most of these areas. Many may be a good starting point for the 2012 Shigaclone. Those with test equipment who can help quantify any improvements would be a great asset. (I'm neither a complete subjectivist nor a card-carrying DBT'er. A combination of listening impressions and data would be a great thing to have.) Does this sound like a good plan?
 
#3
Okay, I'm still trying to figure out how to start this without everyone having to read through 6000+ messages. I think for those who haven't already done it, reading through the first several pages of the original thread (posted above) is a good thing to do. There's a lot more there, but read enough to get the stage set.

If you want to see then what Peter did from this thread, go here

http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/audio-sector/160373-cd-transport.html

It's only 21 pages 😉, but there's a lot of good info showing where Peter went after putting the foundation in place.

Then there's a bunch of good info from uncle_leon on caps

http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/digi...ansport-shigaclone-story-422.html#post2450682

http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/digi...ansport-shigaclone-story-483.html#post2571790

But keep in mind the cap numbers in the Shiga using the original PCB are not the same as the numbers in the 2012 version. C916 in the original appears to be C43 in "this year's model" 😀. Additionally, uncle_leon may be working on consolidating all of his upgrade experience from the original Shiga. Perhaps when it's posted he'll help us migrate the relevant parts here.

There's also a lot of great tweak information (again for the original) by Erik van Voorst in the original thread.

If interested in examining a Bobken regulator to see if it might be worth using in the 2012 Shiga, do a search in the original thread for posts by CeeVee.
 
#7
Puck discussion

tonyptony said:
Sean Henderson had a great suggestion here

http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/digi...ansport-shigaclone-story-615.html#post3115591

But Tibi has indicated they are also working on a remote and a puck as part of the new effort.
Click to expand...

Hi All
I am a little confuse regarding PUCK???
As I learn from tread "Finally, an affordable CD Transport: the Shigaclone story" the best puck is Light puck... from ebony, aluminium...
I also try magnetic original... heavy from brass... and light from nylon... And for all that i fine nylon a best solution see the picture.
Any explanations or confirmation ???
Regards
Cici
 

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#8
I see two possible approaches to the puck. (1) as light as possible to minimize imbalance. (2) heavy within the limits of loading the motor so as to stabilize imbalance due to eccentricity of the CD itself.

Considering the weight of the CD and the fact that it's weight extends much further out than the puck, I believe light is the best way to go.

In addition, a heavy puck will load the motor more, although it might help with minimizing rotational variation.
 
#10
Hi,
I like it that the Linn cd 12 is mentioned. It will certain not easy to equal
that quality. I still keep thinking why linn use a smps in that player.
Just people said don't use a smps in audio because the nois produced
by high frequency. But linn solve this problem.
And is it indeed that a lineair ps is not sufficient for high quality?
Is there anyone who can give a push in the right direction?
 
#11
A line powered SMPS has the advantage that it uses a small transformer and has low power dissipation.

Designing a quiet SMPS is a challenge, but not impossible. Both radiated and conducted noise are an issue.

Good layout with attention to grounding will alleviate most problems.

The remaining conducted noise (and ripple) issue can be addressed in part by using a SMPS whose output is 1V higher than the target voltage, and then use a low dropout low noise linear regulator as a post regulator. Although this is a bandaid. A good design will not have issues.

This addresses the differential mode noise, but not the common mode noise.

Common mode noise is best minimized in layout. A common mode filter can be used on the output, but is not a good solution as it imposes it's own voltage drop (I*R).
 
#19
As shipping started, I will try to add here information about our boards, soldering, mounting and testing.

Please do not expect from me to be very responsive. Beside my daily job, I need to prepare kit´s for shipping, mounting and also delivering.

What you don´t know is that we are already on the third version board. First and second have been test boards.
During the initial tests we have performed many major modifications and obvious we had to redesign entire board.

Regards,
Tibi
 

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#20
about soldering

This is a response on the messages I have received.
All Shiga mounted and tested are RoHS.
On all kits we use Cynel RoHS solder with 3%Ag.

For those who are looking for the best, IMHO Mundorf is one of the best solders available on market.

Also, an inexpensive and very good soldering station is Vellemann VTSSC50N.

Regards,
Tibi
 

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