Don't get offended.
I started this thread to get peoples experiences, not someones opinion based on 100% maths, which rely on a manufactures biased imperial measurements.
You can't say what you have said without saying that the guy is full of ****, in which case you are entitled to your opinion.
Can you show me at least 3 examples of true scientific testing of capacitors in this forum that have been peer reviewed in scientific journals.
I started this thread to get peoples experiences, not someones opinion based on 100% maths, which rely on a manufactures biased imperial measurements.
You can't say what you have said without saying that the guy is full of ****, in which case you are entitled to your opinion.
Can you show me at least 3 examples of true scientific testing of capacitors in this forum that have been peer reviewed in scientific journals.
thanh1973 said:
I didn't say, and I don't want to say, that anybody is full of it. I did say that the report is a personal anecdotal story and has no validity beyond that.
I don't know of any scientific test of caps in this forum, but there are a lot of references to such tests which have been published for instance by Cyril Bateman and others. It's all there just for looking it up. That is, if you mean testing the parameters of caps. As for controlled listening tests of caps, I don't know any.
Jan Didden
naive question
If you are making a CRC or CRCRC for a power supply (for an amp let's say) should the first cap in the series be selected for high ripple current and the last in the series for low ESR/ESL and tan-delta. In other words, are there differenent criteria for who makes the best 10,000 uF capacitor depending on where it is used in a CRC? (in keeping with the question posed in this thread)
Thanks
JimS
If you are making a CRC or CRCRC for a power supply (for an amp let's say) should the first cap in the series be selected for high ripple current and the last in the series for low ESR/ESL and tan-delta. In other words, are there differenent criteria for who makes the best 10,000 uF capacitor depending on where it is used in a CRC? (in keeping with the question posed in this thread)
Thanks
JimS
the location of the C in a CRC will very much determine the desirable characteristics.
I agree the first C must have a high ripple capacity.
I think the sound quality is determined by the final C, but whether esr or esl or some other is desirable, I haven't a clue.
I have said this before, but probably worth mentioning again.
I use the cheapest of the Conrad Johnson Pre-amps (FET) and it has zero electrolytics capacitors. That tells me something about CJ's view on desirable characteristics.
I agree the first C must have a high ripple capacity.
I think the sound quality is determined by the final C, but whether esr or esl or some other is desirable, I haven't a clue.
I have said this before, but probably worth mentioning again.
I use the cheapest of the Conrad Johnson Pre-amps (FET) and it has zero electrolytics capacitors. That tells me something about CJ's view on desirable characteristics.
Thanks Andrew,
That is what I hoped you would say. I always try to select a good capacitor with high ripple capacity for my first C in a CRC after the diodes, and use my limited supply of BG capacitors, or similar quality, for the last cap in the series. It seems intuitive, but I have never been really sure how much influence the first vs last has on the music.
JimS
That is what I hoped you would say. I always try to select a good capacitor with high ripple capacity for my first C in a CRC after the diodes, and use my limited supply of BG capacitors, or similar quality, for the last cap in the series. It seems intuitive, but I have never been really sure how much influence the first vs last has on the music.
JimS
I use 4 x 27,000 uf Panasonic THA 63VDC 105C caps followed by a 1mh low DC R choke and then 2 x 10,000 Blackgate FK with a 2200uf /100V BG N series VDC in parallel for local decoupling on the output stage is 220/160 BG N caps with 0.47/50 NX in E cancelling pairs at each output device. That's for each polarity of each channel.
The total is 16 x 27 000 uf then chokes + 8 x 10,000 Blackgate FK + 4 x 2200uf 100V Blackgate N. IR Hexfet seperate positive and negative RC snubbed bridges . The power amp is dual mono Borbely Millenium biased at 2 amps class A with teflon boards, Vishay bulk foil resistors, teflon bias bypass and teflon output R/C network, MIT RTX for servo caps all in a Krell KSA 100 chassis - Now I have no money to buy vinyl or CD's, but I'm sure they would sound nice if I did.
The total is 16 x 27 000 uf then chokes + 8 x 10,000 Blackgate FK + 4 x 2200uf 100V Blackgate N. IR Hexfet seperate positive and negative RC snubbed bridges . The power amp is dual mono Borbely Millenium biased at 2 amps class A with teflon boards, Vishay bulk foil resistors, teflon bias bypass and teflon output R/C network, MIT RTX for servo caps all in a Krell KSA 100 chassis - Now I have no money to buy vinyl or CD's, but I'm sure they would sound nice if I did.
It meant to illustrate the use of better caps after raw filtering. I did hear improvements in low end control and increased clarity as I increased the value of the first stage caps from 27,000 to 104,000 uf per rail- I experimented listening to the different values I used in both the first and second stage caps. Either set of caps on their own didn't sound as good as the 2 of them with chokes in between (also the efffect of the reduced HF and ripple of the chokes). A soft start circuit is mandatory with this much capacitance and diode heatsinking must be looked at as well.
I had dismissed the BG caps for decades without listening based on cost and claims which seems to defy logic like the 10,000 uf of BG FK could displace larger caps - in the end the parrallel 2 x 10,000 with the 2200 uf N was even better sounding. Martin Collum's article finally convinced me to give them a try two years ago while I was replacing the amp's power original supply caps and decided to listen to different values and types and CRC and CLC filtering based on the DIY power supply discussions. It's too bad their cost inhibited their wider use and are now gone Yes an over the top example, ( why build mediocrity ? it's been done before )
I had dismissed the BG caps for decades without listening based on cost and claims which seems to defy logic like the 10,000 uf of BG FK could displace larger caps - in the end the parrallel 2 x 10,000 with the 2200 uf N was even better sounding. Martin Collum's article finally convinced me to give them a try two years ago while I was replacing the amp's power original supply caps and decided to listen to different values and types and CRC and CLC filtering based on the DIY power supply discussions. It's too bad their cost inhibited their wider use and are now gone Yes an over the top example, ( why build mediocrity ? it's been done before )
You know, if you have the headroom, a smallish filmcap after the reftifier and before a regulator isn't so bad. The ripple voltage will be higher, but mostly 100 and 200Hz because of the relatively low and 'round' charging pulses. And at those frequencies the PSRR of the reg is probably astronomical.
Jan Didden
Jan Didden
It's a Conrad Johnson PF 1 that I have not tried to reverse engineer.h_a said:you don't want to draw a nice schematic of your pre and post it here? Would be interesting for sure
I can't use it at my current location due to the enormous pulse it sends through the system if power fails. But I'm working on that.
leads directly to
Epcos/Sikorel 41550's..............................
I have been looking for the Epcos/Sikorel 41550 series caps for a while now and ....IF.........they can be purchased in the US through a supplier in the UK they will cost about:
4700uf = $60 USD
10,000uf = $100 USD
Does any one know where to get them at a better price?
Cheers
I have been looking for the Epcos/Sikorel 41550 series caps for a while now and ....IF.........they can be purchased in the US through a supplier in the UK they will cost about:
4700uf = $60 USD
10,000uf = $100 USD
Does any one know where to get them at a better price?
Cheers
What voltage...?
RS Components sells 10000uf 63V at ZAR391 which is about $50 + 14% VAT over here.
http://za.rs-online.com/web/search/searchBrowseAction.html?method=getProduct&R=1908955
RS Components sells 10000uf 63V at ZAR391 which is about $50 + 14% VAT over here.
http://za.rs-online.com/web/search/searchBrowseAction.html?method=getProduct&R=1908955