k let me add my "mustard"...
The Fostex FP203 (totally uncomparable to all other Fostex) is one hell of a fullranger. Dispersion like an 3", smooth on axis without filter, finest highend motor features, great look, true bandwidth to 20k.
Not built anymore, but sold sometimes on ebay in good condition.
For a reason I own/store 16 pairs in the basement
(never ever for sale)
Close follower but only when EQed the Fostex FE208 Sigma - 90s version (!)
Second best to me was AER.
Third Visaton B200.
Fourth Lowther PM6A.
Fifth the Philips 9710 (super beamy)
Sixth all other Lowther.
Then, only after that, I see the modern Fostex, Saba, Voxativ, nice but not for me.
Certainly interesting, the 10" Fostex FP253 with uncompareable punch in lower mids (no lows neither highs though).
cheers
Josh
PS: this only considers plain unfiltered plug n play driving. With EQ / horns / whatever, list could be mixed up of course.
The Fostex FP203 (totally uncomparable to all other Fostex) is one hell of a fullranger. Dispersion like an 3", smooth on axis without filter, finest highend motor features, great look, true bandwidth to 20k.
Not built anymore, but sold sometimes on ebay in good condition.
For a reason I own/store 16 pairs in the basement
(never ever for sale)Close follower but only when EQed the Fostex FE208 Sigma - 90s version (!)
Second best to me was AER.
Third Visaton B200.
Fourth Lowther PM6A.
Fifth the Philips 9710 (super beamy)
Sixth all other Lowther.
Then, only after that, I see the modern Fostex, Saba, Voxativ, nice but not for me.
Certainly interesting, the 10" Fostex FP253 with uncompareable punch in lower mids (no lows neither highs though).
cheers
Josh
PS: this only considers plain unfiltered plug n play driving. With EQ / horns / whatever, list could be mixed up of course.
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I am in the process of breaking in a pair of AN 8 Classics. After around 30+ hours, they are sounding pretty good. Very good. I probably don't hear above 12khz but can detect the presence or absence of HF.
Not sure about bass in an AN 8 Classic. I'm focused on the mids and highs. Cone breakup, ragged response, irritating characteristics. It's easy to supplement the bass but if the mids and highs are wrong, the driver is not usable. So far, I'm not finding warts with the AN driver. But it is early in the breakin process.
More later including the eventual design that uses the Classic 8's (assuming no issues).
Tang Band w8-1772 is what I use. Excellent, really, but I must qualify that I use them horn loaded, such that I can't really comment on their sound, on a conventional baffle.
Attachments
One of the problems of Lowther is simply that they put a reverse fold on the front of the whizzer. If you cut into that so that you can flip it forward, Lowther A and DX/EX series are excellent and in my opinion AER offers no advantage.
My experience with the standard Fostex units is that their treble isn't as prominent as it might be and is very much beamed on axis. But like a commentator above I was lucky enough to get a pair of FP203 units and these are treasured.
However, whilst I like the Lowther or AER sound because it presents music as if the instrumentalists are in front of you, testing the renowned vintage Philips units, Audio Nirvana Neodymium, Lowther DX2 there's a competitor that's completely flat and outdoes the Fostex FP203. It's the 97dB unit marketed on Ebay by seller Anitaydavid "HiEND 8inch fullrange speaker 97db PK lowther KO fostex"
pair 2 unit HiEND 8inch fullrange speaker 97db PK lowther KO fostex | eBay
Best wishes
David P
My experience with the standard Fostex units is that their treble isn't as prominent as it might be and is very much beamed on axis. But like a commentator above I was lucky enough to get a pair of FP203 units and these are treasured.
However, whilst I like the Lowther or AER sound because it presents music as if the instrumentalists are in front of you, testing the renowned vintage Philips units, Audio Nirvana Neodymium, Lowther DX2 there's a competitor that's completely flat and outdoes the Fostex FP203. It's the 97dB unit marketed on Ebay by seller Anitaydavid "HiEND 8inch fullrange speaker 97db PK lowther KO fostex"
pair 2 unit HiEND 8inch fullrange speaker 97db PK lowther KO fostex | eBay
Best wishes
David P
I am sort of past nominal driver size. One unit of a given diameter might require a shoebox sized box, another a refridgerator sized box. And one might beam like crazy and another much less so.
I need powerhandling and bass extension (movies, philharmonic orchestras, reggae), rather more than less directivity (live room) and restricted budget. There are different ways to achieve this, with different driver sizes.
I had Lowther, PM6C, in diy fronthorns with separate woofers in midbass horns, which worked. I had 2" drivers in line arrays and a subwoofer, which worked. Now I have 15" Fane fullrange drivers in backloaded pipe horns. Which works.
The Fanes in their pipehorns are the cheapest so far, no subs, just one amplifier. Widest range, high efficiency, no dynamic limitations in my use situation. The enclosures are not larger than a backloaded horn for an 8" driver.
My point: knowing what to look for and finding that in a driver will be more successful than limiting yourself to a driver size.
That said, regarding 8 inch drivers, straight out of the box I really liked the Omnes Audio L8 driver, not in production anymore. Whizzerless, very smooth response up past 10 kHz and a bit above, very dynamic and detailed sound, yet naturally warm-sounding. I still have them, should do something with them. My lowthers worked very well in the fronthorns, but after all that and with basshorns added sounded no better than the Fanes I have now in simple pipehorns. The fanes are that good.
I need powerhandling and bass extension (movies, philharmonic orchestras, reggae), rather more than less directivity (live room) and restricted budget. There are different ways to achieve this, with different driver sizes.
I had Lowther, PM6C, in diy fronthorns with separate woofers in midbass horns, which worked. I had 2" drivers in line arrays and a subwoofer, which worked. Now I have 15" Fane fullrange drivers in backloaded pipe horns. Which works.
The Fanes in their pipehorns are the cheapest so far, no subs, just one amplifier. Widest range, high efficiency, no dynamic limitations in my use situation. The enclosures are not larger than a backloaded horn for an 8" driver.
My point: knowing what to look for and finding that in a driver will be more successful than limiting yourself to a driver size.
That said, regarding 8 inch drivers, straight out of the box I really liked the Omnes Audio L8 driver, not in production anymore. Whizzerless, very smooth response up past 10 kHz and a bit above, very dynamic and detailed sound, yet naturally warm-sounding. I still have them, should do something with them. My lowthers worked very well in the fronthorns, but after all that and with basshorns added sounded no better than the Fanes I have now in simple pipehorns. The fanes are that good.
... I completely agree, that the cheapest total build cost in relation to best 8" single FR driver must be the Fane 15-300TC
8" is sort of a tricky size for FR's not big enough to make bass, not big enough to work well with wizzers, too big to work well without wizzers.
My favoured FR units are smaller than 6" or bigger than 12". But there's alot of other people here with more experience, not many that have bigger than 6.5" FR's on their top 5 list.
8" is sort of a tricky size for FR's not big enough to make bass, not big enough to work well with wizzers, too big to work well without wizzers.
My favoured FR units are smaller than 6" or bigger than 12". But there's alot of other people here with more experience, not many that have bigger than 6.5" FR's on their top 5 list.
Ivo, maybe I missed it, but, could you plase post a pic of these horns? I was thinking about Fane 15's in the future, possibly in big sealed cabinets, but was then wondering whether they will go low enogh. But, Fane 15s in BLH's..something even better.
Just wondering if a giant BIB with Fane 15s could fit into an average living room (2.8 m ceiling height)...
Ivo, maybe I missed it, but, could you plase post a pic of these horns? I was thinking about Fane 15's in the future, possibly in big sealed cabinets, but was then wondering whether they will go low enogh. But, Fane 15s in BLH's..something even better.
Just wondering if a giant BIB with Fane 15s could fit into an average living room (2.8 m ceiling height)...
Oof! 2600 liters, so footprint would be... About 1 m^2? ;-)
https://www.diyaudio.com/forums/full-range/308652-15-range-fane-43.html#post5577256
This is a picture of my backloaded horns.
This is a picture of my backloaded horns.
Ok, so back to option 1 Didn't want to go off-topic, but right now I am using Visaton B200 in OB, which is not bad, but there's always a feeling that something is missing and not quite right.
Fostex FE206e were even worse, they are now in boxes (cardboard ones)
On the other hand, some 15 years ago I had tried some Bulgarian 12" wide rangers. With a tweter on top, crossed high with just a cap, they sounded very nice. Unfortunately, I sold them...
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https://www.diyaudio.com/forums/full-range/66173-terry-cains-bib-fostex-craft-handbooks-572.html#post5421394
Here are drawings and simulations. On the next page are measurements. It's my favourite loudspeaker yet. No urge to improve.
Here are drawings and simulations. On the next page are measurements. It's my favourite loudspeaker yet. No urge to improve.
with the proper 0 feedback 845 tube they are imaging like crazy, however they are far from being high-fidelity.
1. They have a crazy dip around 1khz, no XO can solve that. it is phase related and suspension i suspect.
2. they are very power limited! I XO mine at 500hz to 2 or 3 khz.
3. they are fragile, at the present 50 years old, the voilce coil should be put on a new former, (paper), the glue is dust now...
4. I wish I knew how the seas alnico sounds compare to it.
As it is my prefered full range is only available in built speakers, unfortunately for DIYs, it is the 5 inch from the harbeth p3esr, I prefer it to the 8 inches, because the top end is awesome, but maybe in a closed box like the m40, (never heard yet), the 8 inches could beat the p3esr, but not in its present design with ports, the M30 has awesome vocals but the bass is way off, the shl5 is very nice but again not the resolution in the high of the m30 or the p3esr. You already know I don't like the 7 model, bass delay and too warm.
My answer to the question: the noresco (canadian speakers made in germany) 5 inch german made alnico driver in full range is the best, but it cannot do bass, otherwise it is the most musical, involving, emotional, honestly.
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fritz carrera
do you own fritz carreras speakers ? can you give me some though ?EODevan,
From memory, the Alpair 12P in small BR boxes did give a nice, smooth sound. The Alpair 10P also. Btw, IMHO the both the Alpairs pair well with single ended tube amps - probably the higher output impedance and lower damping factor of these amps gel with the drivers. Having said that, they also work fine with solid state amps too. And just to make it clear, these drivers in BR boxes will not dig in deep as the Carreras.
No experience with the Fostex FF225WK.
Atl4love,
These are the speakers I have - they are a DIY design by Paul Carmody:
Carrera - undefinition
These are the speakers I have - they are a DIY design by Paul Carmody:
Carrera - undefinition
