Hi,
I would like to ask you for advice what tools will be most useful for my needs.
I want to build several speakers cabinets. Side walls will have approx. between 2' to 4' in length (more types of speakers). I would like to cut the walls under 45° angle. Will I be able to make up to 4' length cut with miter table saw or I will have to use circular table saw, do the right angle cut and then 'fix' the edges to desired 45° angle with milling cuter/router (I am not sure how precise that would be)?
What kind of saw and (if needed) router, grinder/sander would you recommend me? I want to build several speakers so I would like the tools to be precise but at the same time some reasonably priced hobby level equipment. Thank you for help.
I would like to ask you for advice what tools will be most useful for my needs.
I want to build several speakers cabinets. Side walls will have approx. between 2' to 4' in length (more types of speakers). I would like to cut the walls under 45° angle. Will I be able to make up to 4' length cut with miter table saw or I will have to use circular table saw, do the right angle cut and then 'fix' the edges to desired 45° angle with milling cuter/router (I am not sure how precise that would be)?
What kind of saw and (if needed) router, grinder/sander would you recommend me? I want to build several speakers so I would like the tools to be precise but at the same time some reasonably priced hobby level equipment. Thank you for help.
I would say that accurate 45 degree mitres are some of the most difficult things to cut over long lengths (4 feet) with hand tools only. Have you considered the final finish of your speakers? (Paint, veneer, cloth etc), could you use simple 90 degree cuts backed up with glued internal battens for extra strength? I would suggest you read and watch a few project histories, and use a process to your liking. You may get fuller replies if you’re able to post a picture/sketch or two showing your form of cabinet required. All the best.
below is for mostly typical 'box' speakers:
any router will do for do cutting in drivers - just make sure it can fit the jasper circle jig. plunge router is generally better for. ALWAYS flush mount tweeters and small mids.
sander - any 1/3 sheet sander will do most of your panel prepping
not sure if many attempt to miter the panels together with 45's , instead opting for butt joining and sanding to tidy? thats how I do it anyway
If you're planning on making multiple speakers, table saw is a must. Circular saw is way slower and way more prone to error.
if you doing big roundovers (larger than 1/2in) you'll need a router table, and any bevel cuts require somewhat complicated jigs on the table saw
any router will do for do cutting in drivers - just make sure it can fit the jasper circle jig. plunge router is generally better for. ALWAYS flush mount tweeters and small mids.
sander - any 1/3 sheet sander will do most of your panel prepping
not sure if many attempt to miter the panels together with 45's , instead opting for butt joining and sanding to tidy? thats how I do it anyway
If you're planning on making multiple speakers, table saw is a must. Circular saw is way slower and way more prone to error.
if you doing big roundovers (larger than 1/2in) you'll need a router table, and any bevel cuts require somewhat complicated jigs on the table saw
I will probably use butt joint or rabbet joint eventually.
Do you sand cutted edges ot is it better to let them 'raw'. I am asking because I am not sure if the sander can't round the edge?
Is it possible to use just hand router for rabbet 60' cuts for tower speaker box. I have little space so with table saw I won't probably have enough space for router table.
Also can you give me advice what kind of table saw to get? I will need to move with the table regularly so it should not be heavy much, but I understand the lighter models won't be so precise. So what do you think would be compact and usable table saw?
Here are few examples of table saws I was looking at:
DeWalt DWE7492
ZIPPER ZI-FKS315
Record Power TS250C
Do you sand cutted edges ot is it better to let them 'raw'. I am asking because I am not sure if the sander can't round the edge?
Is it possible to use just hand router for rabbet 60' cuts for tower speaker box. I have little space so with table saw I won't probably have enough space for router table.
Also can you give me advice what kind of table saw to get? I will need to move with the table regularly so it should not be heavy much, but I understand the lighter models won't be so precise. So what do you think would be compact and usable table saw?
Here are few examples of table saws I was looking at:
DeWalt DWE7492
ZIPPER ZI-FKS315
Record Power TS250C
I am working on some DIY speaker and instrument tools at the moment. A table saw, table router, bandsaw, and a micro table saw too. For about 1m max panel lengths. This rout offers good value and a way to customise to your needs
Something that high-end cabinetmakers don't like sharing, but boaties openly help each other with, is how to attain high grade wood grain seams. The trick with a 90-degree corner is the 45 degree cut off course, but ply or veneered boards will only have the grain running in one direction, so the edges will be different to how the grains meet the cut
This is the main problem with cutting at 45 and usually most folks use overcutting and sanding back to get that fine edge, this can work but can also make things worse with fitting and just plain annoying
The trick is to use a real veil. What I managed to figure out and use to a greater effect was that the pros were using a veil of very fine woven glass and epoxy to fix the checking in the face grain. After cure, the epoxy and veil fills out and structurally tapes all the checking across the grains and locks the ends and disappears. The whole panel is then run through the saws for 45 and results in razor sharp edges
A awesome by product is that the veil and epoxy also, after being sanded for water break free, provides the best surface for a poly clear or solid for that very expensive look
Something that high-end cabinetmakers don't like sharing, but boaties openly help each other with, is how to attain high grade wood grain seams. The trick with a 90-degree corner is the 45 degree cut off course, but ply or veneered boards will only have the grain running in one direction, so the edges will be different to how the grains meet the cut
This is the main problem with cutting at 45 and usually most folks use overcutting and sanding back to get that fine edge, this can work but can also make things worse with fitting and just plain annoying
The trick is to use a real veil. What I managed to figure out and use to a greater effect was that the pros were using a veil of very fine woven glass and epoxy to fix the checking in the face grain. After cure, the epoxy and veil fills out and structurally tapes all the checking across the grains and locks the ends and disappears. The whole panel is then run through the saws for 45 and results in razor sharp edges
A awesome by product is that the veil and epoxy also, after being sanded for water break free, provides the best surface for a poly clear or solid for that very expensive look
Sorry to ask all these questions, but have you got an idea of the speakers that you wish to build? You may find using an electric circular saw (such as this) https://www.makitauk.com/product/hs6601.html and a straight edge or tracks/rails a better option. A couple of cheap workmates https://www.screwfix.com/p/black-decker-workmate-workbench-610mm/63272 will also mean that you're not working on the floor all the time. I say these things because manipulating a sheet of MDF or Plywood on a small sawbench is not the easiest of things, and requires a lot of room to swing around. A small note (others may disagree) I find that the expanding foam type adhesive next to useless, so use a good quality PVA based glue.
All the best.
All the best.
Some of us are and can, but most cannot. An exquisite finish does not make any audio equipment sound better, and I will even stick my neck out and say that any loudspeaker will possess a subjectively better sound/illusion if out of sight behind a visually opaque curtain, where a bare, unsanded plywood/mdf box will sound exactly the same as one with oiled walnut veneer or one with ten coats of hand-sanded and polished acrylic lacquer! A culture of 'image' as you put it will not make up for poor design or construction, where the real time should be spent! A nice looking box is simply the icing on the acoustic cake.
If I were buying tools for making speakers, and I was not interested in other types of furniture or cabinet construction, I would skip the table saw. It is true that a full size table saw makes the job easier
But this kind of saw is quite expensive. $2000 - $5000 USD for a new saw. It is only worth it if you plan to make wordworking a lifelong hobby.
A small portable table saw is not really the right tool to cut large panels of plywood or mdf. It is difficult to accurately cut a 44" x 18" panel from a full size sheet with a small table saw, with the sheet overhanging the saw table by large amounts.
Better than a small table saw, I would invest in a panel saw and a good flat work table. A panel saw is slower than a full size table saw, but it is just as accurate. It will cut a very straight line, and it will cut as accurately as you can pencil the line... the downside is that each cut must be set up, whereas with a large full size table saw, once the saw is set up, multiple cuts can be made. If you are only making one pair of speakers every 6 months or so, the slowness of setting up each cut is not very important. Only if you are making many cabinets a year would this be important.
But this kind of saw is quite expensive. $2000 - $5000 USD for a new saw. It is only worth it if you plan to make wordworking a lifelong hobby.
A small portable table saw is not really the right tool to cut large panels of plywood or mdf. It is difficult to accurately cut a 44" x 18" panel from a full size sheet with a small table saw, with the sheet overhanging the saw table by large amounts.
Better than a small table saw, I would invest in a panel saw and a good flat work table. A panel saw is slower than a full size table saw, but it is just as accurate. It will cut a very straight line, and it will cut as accurately as you can pencil the line... the downside is that each cut must be set up, whereas with a large full size table saw, once the saw is set up, multiple cuts can be made. If you are only making one pair of speakers every 6 months or so, the slowness of setting up each cut is not very important. Only if you are making many cabinets a year would this be important.
English is not my first language, please take the above to mean, "you have put so much effort in getting the audio right, now dress her exquisitely too, she deserves it. You had what it takes to go the whole mile to get the audio right, I am confident that you have what it takes to go the whole mile in the dressing too"
Guys, achieving a super finish is really easy and a great thing to aim for. There is much personal fulfilment there too, and the joy of seeing your creation shining while singing is worth it. I can only speak for myself when I say that as a kid, going through the latest AU hi-fi mag and looking in wonder at all the amazing finishes. At 16, walking into Quality Hi-Fi in York St, Sydney and gazing upon Monitor Audio super gloss speakers and such and the thinking that I will do that
Help is here on the forum from many including myself on achieving such finishes and detail
By panel saw you mean circular hand saw on the second picture you posted, right (or saw with stand similar to table saw)? I am considering the hand held circular saw because of the limited space and possibility to work outside.
What working table is good enough? I would like some I can easily fold and carry. Do you think if I find some foldable 50-60lbs table. It is gonna be stable enough?
Also I am looking at plunge routers and I am considering this one:
Festool 1010 REQ F PLUS
Do you think 1000W is good enough if I won't use it as pro everyday? Is there some difference in precision cut in comparison with more powerful routers 1500-2000W?
Additionally @mainframe99 mentioned 'jasper circle jig' it is some kind of router's template to make driver flush mount? How do I now the router fits with it? E.g. can I use the circle jig with the router I mentioned?
Finally I would like to ask once more about the type of joint to use. So right angle joints should be good enough right? Is there somebody using 45° cuts? The miter cut itself should be doable with hand held saw and miter trail, but not sure I manage to duplicate the precise opposite panel dimensions.
@Randy Bassinga so you are using the 45 cut, right? Is hand held saw good enough for miter cut? Also I read again your post about the cure the cut with epoxy and woven glass. But I am not sure I understood everything correctly. So I should cure the edge before miter cutting? Is there maybe so article or more information to read about it? The woven glass + epoxy...it is some product to buy for this purpose of keeping the edges sharp?
Thank you again
Track saw + router bosch don't need festool + jasper jig + sander. Learn how to veneer its really not hard venner supply has guides and all the tools. You will also need a trim cut bit and a upspiral carbide bit 1/4. You can Get away with a circular + circular saw clamp. If you don't want to dick around with finishes you can buy a hardwax finish osmo Rubio there's quite a few now it will make your wood look like wood not plastic.
When I said "panel saw" I should have said "track saw"... panel saw is the old name for this.
A track saw has a long extruded aluminum track which is clamped to the sheet material. The saw runs along the track. It is a very specialized kind of hand held circular saw.
Regarding joints. I use butt joints, even though I have the capability of making miter, spline-miter, rabbet joints, dado joints... The simple butt joint is the most versatile joint. With modern glues and sheet materials, it is strong enough... especially when it is combined with internal bracing, which is always the case with speakers. Remember, this is not a chair or barstool, where joint strength is paramount. This is a fully closed rectangular box. It has high stability and strength just due to its shape.
j.
A track saw has a long extruded aluminum track which is clamped to the sheet material. The saw runs along the track. It is a very specialized kind of hand held circular saw.
Regarding joints. I use butt joints, even though I have the capability of making miter, spline-miter, rabbet joints, dado joints... The simple butt joint is the most versatile joint. With modern glues and sheet materials, it is strong enough... especially when it is combined with internal bracing, which is always the case with speakers. Remember, this is not a chair or barstool, where joint strength is paramount. This is a fully closed rectangular box. It has high stability and strength just due to its shape.
j.
I have ts75 and that festool router it's kinda weird to hold sometime 90 percent of time i grab a bosch 1617EVSPK. Forgot you also need a shopvac. If you can afford it get a hepa one. Do you mean a score cut ? Shouldn't need one on a track saw first time you use the saw its going to cut into a bit if plastic hanging off the side of the rail and that will keep any blow outs or chips from happening. I would never try doing a 45 degree joint on a track saw even on my $15k sliding table saw the slightest thing can throw off the miter. But with speakers your going to want butt joints.
Space limits in mind, one can absolutely and relatively efficiently make airtight and visually presentable boxes with a track/plunge saw as has been suggested, and a hand-full of clamps. After the festool patent ran out a few years ago, prices of these have dropped. Routers are affordable too and are fun to use for small tasks.
This is great advice. A good flat work table might just be the #1 tool. "English" style joiner benches are pretty easy and cheap to make if you have the space.
I haven't made a cabinet in years but long ago I used a radial arm saw and it was really unsuited to the task. I sold it and bought a Powermatic contractors saw. That had a nice fence and work very well. IMHO, the fence is all-important. The panel saw above also looks like an excellent choice. +1 on butt joints. Not sure if people do biscuit joints, but that might be worth investigating. I always bought the latest and greatest Titebond glue, but there's a reason they still sell three types. If you don't need all-weather performance, the earlier versions might be better.