VTA
Yes, I can hear the difference between different settings of VTA. Eventually, I purchased a turntable that has VTA adjustment on the fly for those screw type tonearm like Rega. However, I switched to SME V that the turntable is not able to adjust its VTA on the fly and I have to learn to accept such difference.
Yes, I can hear the difference between different settings of VTA. Eventually, I purchased a turntable that has VTA adjustment on the fly for those screw type tonearm like Rega. However, I switched to SME V that the turntable is not able to adjust its VTA on the fly and I have to learn to accept such difference.
It shouldn't just be VTA that's a hot topic: 3D stylus alignment can matter in much the same way, depending on stylus profile. So azimuth and tracking offset angle alignment can be just as critical.
The methods commonly used for azimuth alignment are fine for setting coil azimuth, but that's not necessarily optimal for stylus attitude setting.
Tracking angle offset is normally carefully done with a protractor, which correctly sets minimal geometric error. But that's not necessarily optimal for stylus attitude, which can be the bigger fish to catch in terms of trackability and tracing performance.
Test tracks 400/4kHz 4:1 -10dB ref 5cm/s vertical (L-R=0), and 400/4kHz 4:1 +12dB lateral (L=R) should suffice, but still couldn't see them on the list ?
LD
I lost overview a bit. Does anyone have a list of topics to discuss with the mastering engineer? A list of requests and questions?
I will go through the thread and try to collect them if necessary, if it's not necessary because all that is collected somewhere please point me to it.
Thanks.
I have the feeling that the VTA road has already been designed, but we don't yet know whether the road has to be driven with a small town car, a lorry or a big tank since we don't have sufficient test material showing what can be expected.
Because of that we are missing the most important: what and how to aim for while tuning.
All we have is a patent that was never put into practice for one reason or another, without having the prove from an independent source that it really works.
The few test performed just recently cannot be used for general conclusions, but so far they did not show a diminishing amplitude of the demodulated FM signal while changing the VTA, in contradiction with the expectation from the Patent.
If more .wav files were made available with different VTA settings, I could analyse them and come back with the results.
On the other hand, some people in this thread have mentioned that they can adjust the VTA by listening to music.
So maybe a very revealing piece of music should be on the test LP also.
Hans
Because of that we are missing the most important: what and how to aim for while tuning.
All we have is a patent that was never put into practice for one reason or another, without having the prove from an independent source that it really works.
The few test performed just recently cannot be used for general conclusions, but so far they did not show a diminishing amplitude of the demodulated FM signal while changing the VTA, in contradiction with the expectation from the Patent.
If more .wav files were made available with different VTA settings, I could analyse them and come back with the results.
On the other hand, some people in this thread have mentioned that they can adjust the VTA by listening to music.
So maybe a very revealing piece of music should be on the test LP also.
Hans
That might get sticky, maybe some kind of multi-tone could simulate sibilance?
The BBC 7" test records all had a piece of music on the B side.
For me the VTA adjustment is a bit like these Tone knobs on car radios. For adjustment I use the first Wipers 12" and listen to the bass. Off in one direction it's thin, off in the other direction it's muddy and when right it's full and heavy and I can hear the striking of the strings and the overtones.
For me the VTA adjustment is a bit like these Tone knobs on car radios. For adjustment I use the first Wipers 12" and listen to the bass. Off in one direction it's thin, off in the other direction it's muddy and when right it's full and heavy and I can hear the striking of the strings and the overtones.
As already posted, stylus attitude alignment is not just a matter of VTA, but similar high sensitivity can apply to azimuth and tracking offset angle. It varies greatly from stylus to stylus depending on profile and how accurately a stylus is made and set.
Fortunately in terms of test tracks, two tracks can cover it:
400Hz/4KHz 4:1 @-10dB ref 5cm/s vertical (L+R=0)
400Hz/4kHz 4:1 @+12dB ref 5cm/s lateral (L-R=0)
This has to be better than an arbitrary music track, which most of have by the thousand, even though ultimately alignment can be set by just listening in principle.
LD
Fortunately in terms of test tracks, two tracks can cover it:
400Hz/4KHz 4:1 @-10dB ref 5cm/s vertical (L+R=0)
400Hz/4kHz 4:1 @+12dB ref 5cm/s lateral (L-R=0)
This has to be better than an arbitrary music track, which most of have by the thousand, even though ultimately alignment can be set by just listening in principle.
LD
My comment here was that we would need both the original source material and determine if we can stay under doctrine of fair use if we wanted to include a music track. I think it would be good to first determine if a suggested test track gives the same result. I've been a little stymied because apparently I have the only copy here of an existing one and a stylus that is not very sensitive to VTA.
RE: Shipping
There are cardboard mailers available that protect and are sized for LP records.
Unfortunately International shipping from the US has become prohibitively expensive. What was, 10 years ago, a $US 15 Priority International package (Tracked to recipient, $100 default insurance) is now $US 49.
The reason is political ... long story short, the USPS was showing a small profit, Congress saw a cash cow and came up with a demand that they prepay all current and future pension obligations (some $7 Billion) resulting in two price increases. The USPS decided to shield domestic shippers from the larger price increases necessary by placing the larger burden on International mail.
Of course, these payments don't actually go to the pension obligation but to general revenue, so these pension payments come out of current and future taxes just as before, and no other branch or federal corporation has had this burden placed upon them.
Regardless, shipping from the US has now become onerous.
It has forced me to change my buying habits ... what was, in 2007, about $10K annually in purchasing from US vendors has now shifted to UK, Australian, and European vendors for me.
By way of example, I had a bathroom scale shipped from the UK for $C 20. That's the scale AND the shipping in a carton that is very similar to an LP record size. Small packages of electronic components typically incur about $C6~8 postage.
Packages from the UK typically arrives in about 7 days, about two weeks faster than typical USPS Priority International delivery times. From Australia I generally get items in 10 days~2 weeks, from the EU in about a week-10 days.
When I cannot avoid buying from a US vendor I have it shipped USPS domestic to my customs broker (typically $US 14, sometimes free) who carries it physically across the border to Canada, clears the shipment, and re-ships it Purolator Next Day Air to me; cost is typically about $C 30 all in, about one third the cost of USPS International postage alone ($C 63, plus 5% GST, and Canada Post will charge an additional $C 8 brokerage fee on USPS deliveries).
The usual couriers (FedEx, UPS) are usually more expensive than the USPS, so that's not a solution. However as the value of this test LP is likely to be less than $C 20, it does not need to clear customs (regardless of carrier) and no GST is typically collected, so no brokerage fee, no COD fee (to collect the fees on delivery), no "loan fee" (because they claim they have prepaid duties and taxes on your behalf, even though they do not actually pay these until the 15th of the month following delivery), an no "mystery fee" that has no specific reason and is now in the courts via a Class Action Lawsuit, under appeal (UPS lost, twice so far).
(Both FedEx and UPS own the brokerage firm that clears their shipments, but at fees that are much higher than typical of customs brokers. If you complain they say they have no control over these costs as it's a separate company, neglecting to mention it's a subsidiary).
So, UPS might be a reasonable cost option to Canada, provided the value is under $C20 ($US 15.61 as of 24Nov17). Otherwise I will be buying from the EU stock. Sad, but true.
By the way the UK Post is perhaps the world's best, and very reasonable cost-wise for International mail. Perhaps a member there could agree to look into the International shipping chore. Although shipping from the CR may be just as reasonable or more so to Canada and elsewhere.
Another option is Purolator Courier from the US, which is quite reasonable to Canada. However it is not available everywhere, so you would have to check.
One final note ... it's often referred that shipments to Canada incur "Duties and Tariffs". Very few commonly purchased items by consumers have any duties or tariffs. All electronics, all software, or anything manufactured in the US, the EU, or one of about 40 other countries Canada has a FTA with are duty free. In more than 25 years the only imported item I ever paid a Duty or Tariff on was tires made in Japan.
There are cardboard mailers available that protect and are sized for LP records.
Unfortunately International shipping from the US has become prohibitively expensive. What was, 10 years ago, a $US 15 Priority International package (Tracked to recipient, $100 default insurance) is now $US 49.
The reason is political ... long story short, the USPS was showing a small profit, Congress saw a cash cow and came up with a demand that they prepay all current and future pension obligations (some $7 Billion) resulting in two price increases. The USPS decided to shield domestic shippers from the larger price increases necessary by placing the larger burden on International mail.
Of course, these payments don't actually go to the pension obligation but to general revenue, so these pension payments come out of current and future taxes just as before, and no other branch or federal corporation has had this burden placed upon them.
Regardless, shipping from the US has now become onerous.
It has forced me to change my buying habits ... what was, in 2007, about $10K annually in purchasing from US vendors has now shifted to UK, Australian, and European vendors for me.
By way of example, I had a bathroom scale shipped from the UK for $C 20. That's the scale AND the shipping in a carton that is very similar to an LP record size. Small packages of electronic components typically incur about $C6~8 postage.
Packages from the UK typically arrives in about 7 days, about two weeks faster than typical USPS Priority International delivery times. From Australia I generally get items in 10 days~2 weeks, from the EU in about a week-10 days.
When I cannot avoid buying from a US vendor I have it shipped USPS domestic to my customs broker (typically $US 14, sometimes free) who carries it physically across the border to Canada, clears the shipment, and re-ships it Purolator Next Day Air to me; cost is typically about $C 30 all in, about one third the cost of USPS International postage alone ($C 63, plus 5% GST, and Canada Post will charge an additional $C 8 brokerage fee on USPS deliveries).
The usual couriers (FedEx, UPS) are usually more expensive than the USPS, so that's not a solution. However as the value of this test LP is likely to be less than $C 20, it does not need to clear customs (regardless of carrier) and no GST is typically collected, so no brokerage fee, no COD fee (to collect the fees on delivery), no "loan fee" (because they claim they have prepaid duties and taxes on your behalf, even though they do not actually pay these until the 15th of the month following delivery), an no "mystery fee" that has no specific reason and is now in the courts via a Class Action Lawsuit, under appeal (UPS lost, twice so far).
(Both FedEx and UPS own the brokerage firm that clears their shipments, but at fees that are much higher than typical of customs brokers. If you complain they say they have no control over these costs as it's a separate company, neglecting to mention it's a subsidiary).
So, UPS might be a reasonable cost option to Canada, provided the value is under $C20 ($US 15.61 as of 24Nov17). Otherwise I will be buying from the EU stock. Sad, but true.
By the way the UK Post is perhaps the world's best, and very reasonable cost-wise for International mail. Perhaps a member there could agree to look into the International shipping chore. Although shipping from the CR may be just as reasonable or more so to Canada and elsewhere.
Another option is Purolator Courier from the US, which is quite reasonable to Canada. However it is not available everywhere, so you would have to check.
One final note ... it's often referred that shipments to Canada incur "Duties and Tariffs". Very few commonly purchased items by consumers have any duties or tariffs. All electronics, all software, or anything manufactured in the US, the EU, or one of about 40 other countries Canada has a FTA with are duty free. In more than 25 years the only imported item I ever paid a Duty or Tariff on was tires made in Japan.
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I support the idea to have the records made in different continents.
Lower shipping (etc) rates will probably generate more records beeing made.
Why only buy one test record when you can get two, or maybe three, for the same price.
Makes sense to me, your senses may wary
I understand that side of the argument, but I think without getting samples evaluated by someone that we will never know if they are all identical or not. Pressing in two locations gives rise to questions of consistency. I would suggest we get them all pressed in Europe, and designate two people, one there to handle worldwide including Canada and one here to handle U.S. distribution. Or just do it all from one place in Europe, I purchase vinyl from European vendors fairly regularly and shipping to the U.S. is not too bad.
Since the albums will be made in Canada, they should arrive without duties. However, the brokerage fees would remain as more than one album is being shipped. My solution for me would be to have them shipped to a US address I can use that will get them to me for the cost of internal US shipping. It's pretty sad when I can't get a Canadian product back into the country without paying silly "clearing" fees!
-Chris
-Chris
I support the idea to have the records made in different continents.
Lower shipping (etc) rates will probably generate more records beeing made.
Why only buy one test record when you can get two, or maybe three, for the same price.
Makes sense to me, your senses may wary
it would make the records more expensive. They would have two options to produce two separate batches in Europe and Canada:
A) do separate cutting and plating for both batches at each location
B) do cutting and plating once, then send metalwork from one continent to another
In both cases you will have twice the administrative, labor and material cost, press setup, test running etc....
bad idea.
I'm pretty sure the mastering and metalwork would be done in C.R., then sent to Canada for pressing. I'll ask again about that.