That might not be do able. The timeline of posts is fixed by the forum software.
The only way I can see to do it is to delete the thread and move all posts except post #1 to another new thread (deleting post #1 deletes the thread, I just tried it). I could copy and paste your post 15 message into the new post #1
Doing all that would remove the current post #1 entirely from the thread though.
The only way I can see to do it is to delete the thread and move all posts except post #1 to another new thread (deleting post #1 deletes the thread, I just tried it). I could copy and paste your post 15 message into the new post #1
Doing all that would remove the current post #1 entirely from the thread though.
If you mean it would delete the current post by Perceval, I don't think he would mind. I can copy and paste the info he has into the new thread as long as I have OP privileges to edit post 1 as usual. I think creating new thread with post 15 as the new thread post one is best. Sorry to make work complicated.
Thanks,
X
My first set of Folded TABAQ speakers are in test listening. I used Fountek FR88EX drivers that I already had collecting dust on the shelve. Boxes are made from 12mm birch ply and are still uggly as.... With some TLC with router, sander and filler they should be ready for white DC-Fix film.
They sound pretty darn good with female vocals and acoustic material and reasonable volume. Not so good with heavier material and at higher volume tough. I'm using old Harman Kardon AVR1550 amp and with volume set to -10 the cone excursion starts to look scary ;-)
Now I'm considering on ordering some cheap 2.1 class D amp board and ditching the whole surround amp. With some small sub these would be plenty loud for our appartment.
On the other hand I have also planned on building myself a FAST setup using parts I just so happen to have laying around. Dayton PS95-8, HAT L4SE, TB-1139SI and most importantly Mosconi D2 100.4 amp/ dsp combo. That amp is a small class D amp meant for car use and it has exellent 6 channel DSP built in. 4x100w.
Unfortunately I wouldn't be able to crank that thing up that often so it would be a waste of good gear.
They sound pretty darn good with female vocals and acoustic material and reasonable volume. Not so good with heavier material and at higher volume tough. I'm using old Harman Kardon AVR1550 amp and with volume set to -10 the cone excursion starts to look scary ;-)
Now I'm considering on ordering some cheap 2.1 class D amp board and ditching the whole surround amp. With some small sub these would be plenty loud for our appartment.
On the other hand I have also planned on building myself a FAST setup using parts I just so happen to have laying around. Dayton PS95-8, HAT L4SE, TB-1139SI and most importantly Mosconi D2 100.4 amp/ dsp combo. That amp is a small class D amp meant for car use and it has exellent 6 channel DSP built in. 4x100w.
Unfortunately I wouldn't be able to crank that thing up that often so it would be a waste of good gear.
Listening to the tabaq right now. One of my daughters has claimed them already and they are not even finished.
They are very listenable. I have 4m ceilings in a room that is roughly 50 sqm. Probably not the best setup but, they are quite impressive considering how small they are. Ideal for a small apartment.
I will play around with some other drivers that should drop straight in for comparitive purposes.
The nice thing is their are quite a few driver options to try and enough daughters to make use of the tests. Quick to make also and cheap.
Steve
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Listening to the tabaq right now. One of my daughters has claimed them already and they are not even finished.
They are very listenable. I have 4m ceilings in a room that is roughly 50 sqm. Probably not the best setup but, they are quite impressive considering how small they are. Ideal for a small apartment.
I will play around with some other drivers that should drop straight in for comparitive purposes.
The nice thing is their are quite a few driver options to try and enough daughters to make use of the tests. Quick to make also and cheap.
Steve
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Good to see the Vifa TC9FD work out in one. I don't think I have seen a photo of one in a Tabaq until now.
Listening to the tabaq right now. One of my daughters has claimed them already and they are not even finished.
They are very listenable. I have 4m ceilings in a room that is roughly 50 sqm. Probably not the best setup but, they are quite impressive considering how small they are. Ideal for a small apartment.
I will play around with some other drivers that should drop straight in for comparitive purposes.
The nice thing is their are quite a few driver options to try and enough daughters to make use of the tests. Quick to make also and cheap.
Steve
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thanks you. but it's to big for my room.
I think tabaq folded is better choice for my room
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I do wonder if a driver with a lower fs might give a little more bass. The site I bought them from had fs at 110, but the spec. sheet had them at 125hz. My understanding is that 125hz is a bit too high. I will try the Dayton Audio option for comparison.
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I replaced the TC9FD-18 with Dayton Audio RS100-8 and found the base I was looking for! Much much better basewise.
Steve
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The RS100 is a great driver. Same baffle cutout so drop in replacement. It has near ideal TS parameters for a MLTL plus a class leading 4mm xmax. Good to hear it works. It will not be as smooth on top and has a bit of metallic sibilance as it is aluminum cone.
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I have been listening to these drivers for a little while now. With the BSC correction they sound very smooth, open and easy to listen to. I am not noticing any sibilance due to the metallic cones, but I would suggest that my ears are not measurement grade.
I would try the Tang Band speakers suggested for comparison but have not found a supplier in Australia yet.
Steve
Dayton Audio class it as a woofer. Whilst my hearing isn't great I think I would miss the top end.
One of the great things with the Tabaq that I like is the simplicity of a single full range driver.
The other speaker you mention looks promising.
Have a listen to it (RS100P-4) relative to other drivers here:
http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/full...nd-comparison-3in-5in-full-range-drivers.html
It is driver "E" so download those sound clips. It has a slightly rolled of high end but is quite good as a full range in my book.
TABAQ Is a Quarter Wave design
TABAQ is a quarter wave design, a design also called Transmission Line.
Transmission Line is an old design, and the original idea was to attenaute the cabinet almost totally, leaving no contribution to the bass from the opening.
A moderne "Transmission Line" is a quarter wave where the contribution from the opening is an important property of the design. Today both terms are used for the same thing. I am not going to discuss whether a design is a true TL or not. Quarter wave design comes on all shapes and forms, often with an opening looking like a port. This "mass loading" by the resistance of the air helps to even the frequency response and will give you a shorter line for the same tuning frequency.
It is she shape of the cabinet that cause the tuning. The sound from the opening at quarter wave length is in phase with the driver, meaning the opening is playing along with the driver - not against it. The best possible position of the opening is close to the driver.
By stuffing part of the line (normally only in the upper part of the line) the non-wanted harmonics are dampend. The stuffing also even the impedance and reduce cone movement below the cabinet tuning frequency. Stuffing is an important tuning parameter, along with your ears.
Please note: Stuffing does not reduce the speed of sound and does not lower the tuning frequency or make the line appear to be longer.
I also have to add that the placement of the driver 1/5 og 1/3 from the top helps reducing the unwanted harmonics.
Martin J. King has done a lot of research of quarter wave / TL.
Quarter Wavelength Loudspeaker Design
Regards
Bjørn
TABAQ is a quarter wave design, a design also called Transmission Line.
Transmission Line is an old design, and the original idea was to attenaute the cabinet almost totally, leaving no contribution to the bass from the opening.
A moderne "Transmission Line" is a quarter wave where the contribution from the opening is an important property of the design. Today both terms are used for the same thing. I am not going to discuss whether a design is a true TL or not. Quarter wave design comes on all shapes and forms, often with an opening looking like a port. This "mass loading" by the resistance of the air helps to even the frequency response and will give you a shorter line for the same tuning frequency.
It is she shape of the cabinet that cause the tuning. The sound from the opening at quarter wave length is in phase with the driver, meaning the opening is playing along with the driver - not against it. The best possible position of the opening is close to the driver.
By stuffing part of the line (normally only in the upper part of the line) the non-wanted harmonics are dampend. The stuffing also even the impedance and reduce cone movement below the cabinet tuning frequency. Stuffing is an important tuning parameter, along with your ears.
Please note: Stuffing does not reduce the speed of sound and does not lower the tuning frequency or make the line appear to be longer.
I also have to add that the placement of the driver 1/5 og 1/3 from the top helps reducing the unwanted harmonics.
Martin J. King has done a lot of research of quarter wave / TL.
Quarter Wavelength Loudspeaker Design
Regards
Bjørn
Thanks for your reply Bjorn;
I am familiar with the TL design which originated with Benjamin Olney's Acoustical Labyrinth introduced into console radios in 1934. I have also read Kings and Augspurger's papers. I was with Admiral Corporation in 1969, when we developed the Tunnel Reflex System, which was a traditional labyrinth design using a 4 inch speaker.
What you seem to have done is added a duct to load the column's driver similar to what would be done in an aperiodic system. Did you factor the length of the duct into the length of the line also? You claim a tuning of 55 Hz which would be 61 inches, yet the line looks like it is only 37 inches long with the duct, which is 90Hz. I know King allows for less length, based on the closed end and port ratio, but you are showing a very larger reduction in line length. Can you supply the T/S specifications on the driver being used in your commercial model. Best Regards, Ken Bird
I am familiar with the TL design which originated with Benjamin Olney's Acoustical Labyrinth introduced into console radios in 1934. I have also read Kings and Augspurger's papers. I was with Admiral Corporation in 1969, when we developed the Tunnel Reflex System, which was a traditional labyrinth design using a 4 inch speaker.
What you seem to have done is added a duct to load the column's driver similar to what would be done in an aperiodic system. Did you factor the length of the duct into the length of the line also? You claim a tuning of 55 Hz which would be 61 inches, yet the line looks like it is only 37 inches long with the duct, which is 90Hz. I know King allows for less length, based on the closed end and port ratio, but you are showing a very larger reduction in line length. Can you supply the T/S specifications on the driver being used in your commercial model. Best Regards, Ken Bird
Oh, I think I could probably answer that question...
The TABAQ was modelled for the TB W3-926S and W3-315SC.
Asking which model and the T/S specs for his commercial version, after Bjorn was so nice to share this TABAQ design with us, is a little out of place, and has zero relevance in this discussion.