I was hoping you would give a little advise on this! I will take a look at separating the regulators. I had looked at that before. I plan to use shielded cable for all signal level and twist both AC and DC power feeds.
Thanks for the insight!!!!
When I built the first version of this most insanely awesome phono stage with the help of 6L6, I did the "normal" prescribed method of making a separate enclosure for the RAW PSU and transfo—after it was all built—one could literally listen to the hum come and go by bringing the PSU box into proximity with the amp enclosure. This was with headphones as a diagnostic tool. Physical distance is definitely a good thing—if not mandatory for most quietude.
For the SL-1200GR overkill. For the SL-1200G fair match. Even better suited for the SP-10 series on a better arm. TKR plays great at a friend's through my JFET or tube phono designs but it does so mounted on a Bauer Audio DPS 3 with Bauer Tonearm. That's not an averagely priced turntable setup also.
Some were replacing the linear transformer in SL-1200MKII with an SMPS to remove its mechanical vibrations. The SL-1200G is superior player to the GR with magnesium arm, heavier chassis, heavier brass-top platter, and double rotor. At double the price. Either will last a lifetime most probably in spec.
Just to reminisce in real time—Here's the final followup to my original FSP build with the SUTs in place. After a recent back and forth with Tea regarding carts—I understood the breadth of his experience—and took a chance on a bargain entry level (for MC) DL-103—if only to test the "quietness" of the SUTs. All I can say is WOW (my actual reaction was considerably more colorful in reality). I had no idea what I was missing. Just insane. There was another major adjustment to the system (Aikido tube preamp)—but DL-103 vs Grado Reference (with ruby Soundsmith retip no less—purchased second hand) was shocking. All subjective I realize, but there it is. All I can do is that cliche of listening to all the records I have again. They are all new.
In any event—The SUTs are quiet—even with the wiring a mess (didn't want to cut anything yet). The whole system is for that matter. SP-10 Mk2 and Jelco SA-750 for anyone interested. Can't wait to get Ultra online—and see if it's possible to improve on the Denon (those two are not related of course, thinking I'd like to try a Hana). Too much fun. Incidentally, FSP is configured for MM, SUTs are wired for 1:10—will also experiment with 1:20 all things considered with the Denon specifically.
In any event—The SUTs are quiet—even with the wiring a mess (didn't want to cut anything yet). The whole system is for that matter. SP-10 Mk2 and Jelco SA-750 for anyone interested. Can't wait to get Ultra online—and see if it's possible to improve on the Denon (those two are not related of course, thinking I'd like to try a Hana). Too much fun. Incidentally, FSP is configured for MM, SUTs are wired for 1:10—will also experiment with 1:20 all things considered with the Denon specifically.
Attachments
Can i post this here? MODUSHOP summer sales
ESTATE10 = 10% off on our products (order minimum 50 Euro)
ESTATE15 = 15% off on our products (order minimum 150 Euro)
ESTATE20 = 20% off on our products (order minimum 300 Euro)
To apply the discount, you simply have to add the products you would like to buy to your cart then paste the coupon code in the "Use Coupon Code" box before completing and paying for your order.
Hurry! This offer is only available from July, 17th until July, 24th included
ESTATE10 = 10% off on our products (order minimum 50 Euro)
ESTATE15 = 15% off on our products (order minimum 150 Euro)
ESTATE20 = 20% off on our products (order minimum 300 Euro)
To apply the discount, you simply have to add the products you would like to buy to your cart then paste the coupon code in the "Use Coupon Code" box before completing and paying for your order.
Hurry! This offer is only available from July, 17th until July, 24th included
Some extra info:
Takes more system gain for such a cart to sound as dynamic as 0.4-0.5mV mV carts on same sensitivity speakers when the phono gain stays the same. If there isn't spare gain in the line preamp at least, gonna sound decidedly subdued vs those. Carts of 0.3mV down to 0.25mV output may still fair well enough though.
There is a terrorist tactic too. You go bypass R8 with a Nichicon ES 1000uF 10V bipolar cap which is good for signal and the UFSP's gain doubles (+6dB). No less than 1000uF so to keep LF response as it was. There are some small size polar polymer caps too (+ side goes to Q4's Source pin) but I don't know if subjectively as good for the purpose.
The circuit will also go +6dB THD without R8's local feedback anymore but a cart of half output or less than normal MC carts won't push the situation too much. Certainly a more colorful end result. But adequately loud and dynamic for the wimpy cart. More gain also equals more noise when all other things remain equal.
My AT33PTG/II claims 0.3mV but I find it 0.25mV with 1kHz 5cm/sec American test record (Telarc) at about 200 Ohm load. They could be testing at 47k reference load. I am afraid if the air core ART9 is even lower than 0.2mV for my vs their measuring method. 0.25mV plays loud and dynamic enough at LoMC mode in my system but I have 94dB/W/m speakers.
For those who don't know the model:
at33ptgii-review
For those who don't know the model:
at33ptgii-review
Good pic.
I would be interested in your listening session results between your two boards with the LOMC gain for 103 of UFSP versus the FSP with the Cinemags.
Cinemags transformers in general have left a positive sound signature in my setups for the most part when needed over some other brands. However I wonder if we hear more without them in.
You don't change R8 you just piggyback the bypass cap over it i.e. soldered in parallel.
P.S.
The low output air core new ART9 is Shibata stylus the normal output new ART9 is Microline.
I'm using a Helikon Lyra SL, nominal output voltage is 0.22 mV
I really have no complains about gain -- actually, switched back to 56 dB setting over the weekend to give that a listen, and it sounds great too (but likely will switch back to 62db).
I'll try the R8 terrorist tactic, too, just for fun -- but right now I'm not craving for more gain, actually.
I've set things up so I can usually keep the volume pot wide open (then, when I want to listen really loud, I just add a gain stage) --- why waste precious low signal gain upstream by dumping it into a resistor?
But it will be interesting to compare with the highest gain settings. I'll order the caps to give that a try!
I really have no complains about gain -- actually, switched back to 56 dB setting over the weekend to give that a listen, and it sounds great too (but likely will switch back to 62db).
I'll try the R8 terrorist tactic, too, just for fun -- but right now I'm not craving for more gain, actually.
I've set things up so I can usually keep the volume pot wide open (then, when I want to listen really loud, I just add a gain stage) --- why waste precious low signal gain upstream by dumping it into a resistor?
But it will be interesting to compare with the highest gain settings. I'll order the caps to give that a try!
When phono gain is enough in a system its better to keep it conservative. For THD & noise reasons. R8 except setting DC bias gives some AC control to Q4 over THD and moderates transconductance (Yfs) for easier gain match between Q4s in the two channels. Trying all tweak scenarios is fun of course. This is DIY's salt and pepper. Keep in mind that bypassing R8 with that capacitor will give +6dB across all the switchable gain modes. Its not the normal UFSP spec and results land its rodeo land.
Tea—That is EXACTLY what I CAN'T WAIT to try. Just pulled the trigger on the aluminum sheets for chassis build (from scratch).... should be up in a week or so or two!
Is this what I'm doing for config for UFSP? (From Salas instruction/notes post) for 103:
LoMC 62dB
S5 ON S6 ON S9 ON all others OFF
And, oh, this matters right? The Aikido pre has nuts amounts of gain it would seem—compared to my other pres (Wayne's 2018 and ZM's Iron pre)—It's also possible I'm seeing the effects of my R hacked TKD linear pot I picked up cheap.
Last edited:
Salas, in your opinion, do you agree with people claiming that more gain in the phono stage produces a "more dynamic and exciting" sound (I read that in several places)? Do you think there is something to it? Or is this just listening at higher volumes?
I haven't experienced that, yet, switching the gain around (it's brilliant that UFSP allows to do that easily!), but I haven't had a chance to listen very much to it yet, either.