Hi DragonMaster,
I've worked with both. I would prefer not to use it in the house for speakers. Stiff dielectric, stiff jacket, stiff solid inner conductor. Completely fails the wife acceptance factor, and screams WACKO to girlfriends. Actually screams WACKO to male friends as well. Even if it's the correct wire (had CB installation as a teenager - RG-8). When installing satellites, RG-6 was commonly used, also for bar RF and video feeds. You an get stranded RG-6, I have some from wiring my house for RF left over. I still would not wish to use it for speaker wire.
-Chris
I've worked with both. I would prefer not to use it in the house for speakers. Stiff dielectric, stiff jacket, stiff solid inner conductor. Completely fails the wife acceptance factor, and screams WACKO to girlfriends. Actually screams WACKO to male friends as well. Even if it's the correct wire (had CB installation as a teenager - RG-8). When installing satellites, RG-6 was commonly used, also for bar RF and video feeds. You an get stranded RG-6, I have some from wiring my house for RF left over. I still would not wish to use it for speaker wire.
-Chris
I guess it should compare to my gray coaxes twisted together(What I have now)!
I'm SURE it can't beat my room's carpet(old ugly orange thing) or my drawings. (hehehe)
If we don't talk about ugliness and ease of use is it fine? Is it good for speakers and/or signal?
Well I have to try to believe it. Maybe I will use RG-58 or my 5' spare of "OFC" cable if I see they are really hard to work with. I guess I could ask to know how it is at the shop.
Just something that might compare to: Is it like stranded 12 AWG high temperature wire? (It seems to have some cotton shield)
I just went to see what type is my 20' tangled mess of coax and it's RG-59. I DO hate this thing(Al shield). RG-8 is even more hateful? Eek! If I remember correctly, it didn't make a good speaker cable or RCA cable. There was a great loss of gain. Maybe it's just because it's too long?
Hi DragonMaster,
I like my life simple. Without drama. Like trying to fight with wire. To be honest with you, the wire I've suggested is not at all expensive. I buy it by the 250' roll at a time. Typically I use 16GA unless there is a compeling reason to use something else. Example, my in wall speakers are fed with 18GA. 16 GA was too thick for the holes so I had to buy another roll. If I attempt to feed enough power into these speakers where the 18GA is too thin, I will have blown speakers and crossovers.
RG-59 is completely unsuitable as you've found. RG-58 is better (I use RG-58CU - stranded center for some test leads). RG-6 and RG-8 is too difficult to bend, every tie you move something it will be a pain in the ...
High temp wire has a stiff jacket and it's expensive - so why bother. OFC should be very limp and easy to use for it's gauge, it just costs more. If you already have it, use it. Otherwise, just get some fine strand 16/2 zip cord. Many car audio places have this, and jobbers.
-Chris
I like my life simple. Without drama. Like trying to fight with wire. To be honest with you, the wire I've suggested is not at all expensive. I buy it by the 250' roll at a time. Typically I use 16GA unless there is a compeling reason to use something else. Example, my in wall speakers are fed with 18GA. 16 GA was too thick for the holes so I had to buy another roll. If I attempt to feed enough power into these speakers where the 18GA is too thin, I will have blown speakers and crossovers.
RG-59 is completely unsuitable as you've found. RG-58 is better (I use RG-58CU - stranded center for some test leads). RG-6 and RG-8 is too difficult to bend, every tie you move something it will be a pain in the ...
High temp wire has a stiff jacket and it's expensive - so why bother. OFC should be very limp and easy to use for it's gauge, it just costs more. If you already have it, use it. Otherwise, just get some fine strand 16/2 zip cord. Many car audio places have this, and jobbers.
-Chris
Now I'm going to make some people mad but ...
The zip cord and the dual OFC coax (One shield + center wire per connection) sound the SAME. Or : It's too subtle to hear which = doesn't matter.
The way the coaxes are connected is the way that I found on a website telling that it was "much better" than just one coax. In fact, I think the resistance was brought to the same level as the zip cord when the guy tried this.
I can't even believe that zip cord can actually be the best speaker cable but that's what I seem to hear. I think that this wire seems too ordinary for us to even be able to think that it could be the best solution. Well, maybe I would not use it as a turntable cable but as a speaker cable, I think it's some of the best wire. RFI in speaker cables is not amplified so I don't see any problems with the fact that there would be some picked up.
I'm sure that we couldn't hear the hum picked up by a speaker cable near a 2kV line.
As for RG-214, I don't think I would use some as I don't have it. I would rather stick with what I already have:
"OFC" coax,
RG-6U,
RG-59,
zip cord,
CAT5.
What would you choose for signal and speakers? (If we don't talk about ease of use)
The zip cord and the dual OFC coax (One shield + center wire per connection) sound the SAME. Or : It's too subtle to hear which = doesn't matter.
The way the coaxes are connected is the way that I found on a website telling that it was "much better" than just one coax. In fact, I think the resistance was brought to the same level as the zip cord when the guy tried this.
I can't even believe that zip cord can actually be the best speaker cable but that's what I seem to hear. I think that this wire seems too ordinary for us to even be able to think that it could be the best solution. Well, maybe I would not use it as a turntable cable but as a speaker cable, I think it's some of the best wire. RFI in speaker cables is not amplified so I don't see any problems with the fact that there would be some picked up.
I'm sure that we couldn't hear the hum picked up by a speaker cable near a 2kV line.
As for RG-214, I don't think I would use some as I don't have it. I would rather stick with what I already have:
"OFC" coax,
RG-6U,
RG-59,
zip cord,
CAT5.
What would you choose for signal and speakers? (If we don't talk about ease of use)
If you take things back to basics, what you want to do is transfer power to the speaker without adding too much impedance.
Capacitance seems to be the most sensitive thing that may upset an amplifier, so stay with a reasonable gauge wire that is reasonably low in capacitance and inductance. In other words, exotic designs may not be your friend.
For RF pickup, I've had to use a series inductance with an RC in parallel (yup, a "snubber"). I had a CB'er who's transmissions would come through the speakers with the amp turned off. Running a bit over 5W I'd say. Didn't report him, just solved the problem.
-Chris
Capacitance seems to be the most sensitive thing that may upset an amplifier, so stay with a reasonable gauge wire that is reasonably low in capacitance and inductance. In other words, exotic designs may not be your friend.
For RF pickup, I've had to use a series inductance with an RC in parallel (yup, a "snubber"). I had a CB'er who's transmissions would come through the speakers with the amp turned off. Running a bit over 5W I'd say. Didn't report him, just solved the problem.
-Chris
That's the same thing, right?
OK, now I think I'm crazy, I re-tried my CAT5 cable without shorting the leads of my undescructible amp this time(It played correctly for 5 minutes with the cables shorted, after that, it was overheating. It still works!) and I have the impression it's better than the OFC or the plain ordinary 16AWG wire. I was A/B ing with one wire to one speaker and one to the other. Maybe that if I switch the cables, the 16AWG will magically sound better?
Hi DragonMaster,
Keep doing that and you'll confuse yourself!
Listening tests may or may not be effective. This is doubly true if you are doing it by yourself. When you get going in a group you could reach any conclusion.
The CAT 5 does not have enough copper, so you are running an equivalent smaller gauge cable to your speakers. I ran some tests earlier with a tube amp at higher power. The volume even dropped with CAT 5.
-Chris
Keep doing that and you'll confuse yourself!
Listening tests may or may not be effective. This is doubly true if you are doing it by yourself. When you get going in a group you could reach any conclusion.The CAT 5 does not have enough copper, so you are running an equivalent smaller gauge cable to your speakers. I ran some tests earlier with a tube amp at higher power. The volume even dropped with CAT 5.
-Chris
anatech said:
I've heard that effect clearly by changing Kimber 4TC for Supra Ply 3.4S.
The difference in gauge is (or should be) insignificant, so I think the problem is not only there.
Btw with that amp (a Rega Mira) the Supra even took all the treble and detail away, bass started to boom.
The volume was noticeably lower (same setting on the amp), confirmed by all the people present in the room.
For me, it was the highly capacitive Supra (but very low inductance) making the amp unstable.
Cat 5 is very capacitive, and it may be a trap for some amps, but it sometimes works very well, depending on the construction you make with it, and the gauge is whatever you want.
I have experienced too many times too: exotic cables may not be your friend, and a top of the range $$$$ Wirewold cable can be easily bettered by a cheap (~4€/m) figure-of-eight cable.
Not by hazard, the problems are always with highly capacitive cables.
You know,
some 20 years ago the whole cable shabang started.
Every month i read another enlightning techno story about interconnect and loudspeaker cables.
From skin effect to oxygen free copper, symmetrical versus non-symmetrical, stranded versus solid wires, solid to hollow cables, and homogenous to multimaterial strands, untill my head spinned.
Several times a year the new ultimate cable was released, prices per feet skyrocketing like the Nasdac.
People started twisting their own fabrications, even i was such a trendhopping git that i put pieces of cork around enamalled wire and shoved them in hollow PCV tubes because of the revalating sound benefits.
In those years the German Stereoplay magazine started their own cable tests including a comparison with industrial off the rail cable.
I went to visit a DIY audio shop in Essen, Germany, in 1987 to have a chance of listening to the stuff i had been reading about in the magazines. Each and everyone of the audio stores in Germany had the Tiden Bara Gar test track the Stereoplay magazine used, song by Therese Juel, Opus 3.
In Düsseldorf, also Germany, i managed to buy 80 feet of RG214.
Brought it home, took me 3 months to get the right kind of connectors that fit the wires, soldered them on the dual cables, and put woven sleeves around each pair.
Looked like a fancy cable, felt like one, and cost me $125 for a 20 feet set. Which was like 1/4th of my total monthly student allowance then.
In some 20 months from now i will have been using that same set of cables for 20 years, that is a little over $6 write-off for each year.
I've never occupied myself with cable stuff again, talking about coaxials now merely for sentimental reasons.
The ones occupying themselves over and over again with cable issues must have a masochist urge, imo.
Nevertheless, as the Double Dutch guy i am, the price for RG214 at the cable store Audiotux posted is so cheap, i am convinced i need a new set of bi-cabled RG214 shortly.
Jürgen, fielen dank für den link
some 20 years ago the whole cable shabang started.
Every month i read another enlightning techno story about interconnect and loudspeaker cables.
From skin effect to oxygen free copper, symmetrical versus non-symmetrical, stranded versus solid wires, solid to hollow cables, and homogenous to multimaterial strands, untill my head spinned.
Several times a year the new ultimate cable was released, prices per feet skyrocketing like the Nasdac.
People started twisting their own fabrications, even i was such a trendhopping git that i put pieces of cork around enamalled wire and shoved them in hollow PCV tubes because of the revalating sound benefits.
In those years the German Stereoplay magazine started their own cable tests including a comparison with industrial off the rail cable.
I went to visit a DIY audio shop in Essen, Germany, in 1987 to have a chance of listening to the stuff i had been reading about in the magazines. Each and everyone of the audio stores in Germany had the Tiden Bara Gar test track the Stereoplay magazine used, song by Therese Juel, Opus 3.
In Düsseldorf, also Germany, i managed to buy 80 feet of RG214.
Brought it home, took me 3 months to get the right kind of connectors that fit the wires, soldered them on the dual cables, and put woven sleeves around each pair.
Looked like a fancy cable, felt like one, and cost me $125 for a 20 feet set. Which was like 1/4th of my total monthly student allowance then.
In some 20 months from now i will have been using that same set of cables for 20 years, that is a little over $6 write-off for each year.
I've never occupied myself with cable stuff again, talking about coaxials now merely for sentimental reasons.
The ones occupying themselves over and over again with cable issues must have a masochist urge, imo.
Nevertheless, as the Double Dutch guy i am, the price for RG214 at the cable store Audiotux posted is so cheap, i am convinced i need a new set of bi-cabled RG214 shortly.
Jürgen, fielen dank für den link
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audiotux said:
Jürgen,
habe gerade geschaut das wir ungefähr den gleichen alter haben, also wahrscheinlich beide die Deutschen audio hochzeiten miterlebt haben.
Heutzutage nennt man die RG214 altmodisch, meiner meinung nach ist die noch immer ein superkabel.
Dagegen spricht das ich 10 jahre aus dem audio gewirbel war, bin erst seit einige jahren aus dem gefängnis.
Ein gruß zurück von den nachbarn.
Jacco.
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