Ok before I buy the bipolar caps. I did the mods as shown in Mike's site. Popped out the muting circuits and removed the blocking caps. I soldered in the jumper wires as shown in Mikes photos. Now in his post he notes possible issues with DC in the component down stream from the PS1. I am not sure what to check about D.C. blocking in the preamp. I have a Denon AVR3802 receiver as my preamp setup. With just soldering the jumper wire as shown in Mike's site am I at risk of damaging other components let alone the PS1 (which I got for $8.00 anyways)?
Thanks in advance
Mike's site
Thanks in advance
Mike's site
NotSure,
you sure (pun intended ehehe
) mentioned all of the last bits that could be improved with general usability as the playstation. And yes, I suppose it woulde be possible. But not easy. So it will depend upon how good in reverse-engineering your friends are
I spared myself of all the hassle of even thinking about this, in a very simple way: mounted a nice LCD in the case, receiving the RCA video output from the PS1. Works great, and I guarantee you, I can't hear any of it, thanks to a seperate supply (seperate transformer and all). Also I hardwired buttons to a controller and mounted in the case. Not to mention the remote. But that's nothing new lol...
Ah, and nothing about sticking erasers in switches overhere... I localized the connections of the switch on the maiboard, soldered wires to it and another sensitive switch, installed exactly in the right place so that upon closing the "door" of my casing, the playstation gets activated. Just like it was intended originally
You see, a little improvising and it can all be done easily.
But if you really manage to find someone able to find out the signals carrying digital data about track and playingtime, etc, please tell us. I'd be delighted to build a nice 16x2 illuminated LCD controlled by a PIC into my unit in exchange for the big LCD "wasted" for such simple use...
Phileas, if you're not sure what you're doing (and it seems so. otherwise you'd know how to measure DC offset: with a simple multimeter), better go and buy yourself some nice caps and don't risk anything
you sure (pun intended ehehe
) mentioned all of the last bits that could be improved with general usability as the playstation. And yes, I suppose it woulde be possible. But not easy. So it will depend upon how good in reverse-engineering your friends are I spared myself of all the hassle of even thinking about this, in a very simple way: mounted a nice LCD in the case, receiving the RCA video output from the PS1. Works great, and I guarantee you, I can't hear any of it, thanks to a seperate supply (seperate transformer and all). Also I hardwired buttons to a controller and mounted in the case. Not to mention the remote. But that's nothing new lol...
Ah, and nothing about sticking erasers in switches overhere... I localized the connections of the switch on the maiboard, soldered wires to it and another sensitive switch, installed exactly in the right place so that upon closing the "door" of my casing, the playstation gets activated. Just like it was intended originally
You see, a little improvising and it can all be done easily.
But if you really manage to find someone able to find out the signals carrying digital data about track and playingtime, etc, please tell us. I'd be delighted to build a nice 16x2 illuminated LCD controlled by a PIC into my unit in exchange for the big LCD "wasted" for such simple use...
Phileas, if you're not sure what you're doing (and it seems so. otherwise you'd know how to measure DC offset: with a simple multimeter), better go and buy yourself some nice caps and don't risk anything
NotSure said:
So from the replies I guess I must be the oldest member of this thread, as clearly none of you ever had a turntable
I instinctively always turn the volume down to zero at the start and end of listening. I think it's conditioned into me, from trying to save my speakers from the "kurrrrr-whump" sound you got when the arm descended and stylus first descended into the groove of an LP. This conditioning has meant I have never heard the PS1 "Fanfare" as I only turn the volume up when a CD is in the player and the first track is starting. Speaking of Turntables I'm hoping Mick will soon complete his Magnus Opus on the Thorens TD160, though how he's going to fabricate a huge grey plastic clam lid for it beats me
@Phileas:
If you're not sure solder the same in like in Micks' description. I haven't had the same values in my tinker box so I used just 1µF WIMA (~ 1 US$) and 47kOhm which has nearly the same effect than of fc but a faster time constant.
Sorry, but with a AVR3802 you will not hear the use of 10$ bipolar or silver-oil caps! I doubt if you can hear it with high-end gear.
Many high-end manufacturer use the same cheap stuff and sound doesn't suffer from it.
@Notsure
Are you sure to start such a big project just to mod the PS1? It sounds good but with this effort it would be more reasonable to build a complete new cd-player with good cd-drive, excellent DAC and nice class-A output stage.
PS1 is no magic machine. Many players can keep up with it. Don't remain out of consideration that there is still a big hype about this gadget that is not to underestimate.
I think a well modded Sony, Panasonic or Denon player wouldn't raise so much attention!
If you're not sure solder the same in like in Micks' description. I haven't had the same values in my tinker box so I used just 1µF WIMA (~ 1 US$) and 47kOhm which has nearly the same effect than of fc but a faster time constant.
Sorry, but with a AVR3802 you will not hear the use of 10$ bipolar or silver-oil caps! I doubt if you can hear it with high-end gear.
Many high-end manufacturer use the same cheap stuff and sound doesn't suffer from it.
@Notsure
Are you sure to start such a big project just to mod the PS1? It sounds good but with this effort it would be more reasonable to build a complete new cd-player with good cd-drive, excellent DAC and nice class-A output stage.
PS1 is no magic machine. Many players can keep up with it. Don't remain out of consideration that there is still a big hype about this gadget that is not to underestimate.
I think a well modded Sony, Panasonic or Denon player wouldn't raise so much attention!
Thanks for the advice guys...
Ok, I did buy some caps. They did not have any 100uf bi-polar caps but since it was said here to try other values and I asked the guy at the parts store about them I picked up two values they had in stock a 33uf pair and a 22uf pair to swap out if I wish. The store plans to reorder some sizes they were out of too.
I soldered in the 33uf bi-polar caps but only have one question hope it does not sound stupid. To fit it in I had to bend it over on its side. No metal wires touch, I trimmed the down and wrapped their bare wire ends with some electrical tape, any other part but the caps housing does seat in and around other chips on the board, is there anything I need to worry about.
Thanks in advance.
Ok, I did buy some caps. They did not have any 100uf bi-polar caps but since it was said here to try other values and I asked the guy at the parts store about them I picked up two values they had in stock a 33uf pair and a 22uf pair to swap out if I wish. The store plans to reorder some sizes they were out of too.
I soldered in the 33uf bi-polar caps but only have one question hope it does not sound stupid. To fit it in I had to bend it over on its side. No metal wires touch, I trimmed the down and wrapped their bare wire ends with some electrical tape, any other part but the caps housing does seat in and around other chips on the board, is there anything I need to worry about.
Thanks in advance.
First just an update... I had a brain cramp in a previous post, the first set of caps I put in are 10uf caps. I have them soldered in based on the description in Mike's web site.
So I fired the unit up and began some listening. What I have noticed is that the sound stage has a bit more presence over stock setup. Instruments hit a bit harder but it still sounds quite smooth. In stock form I find the PS to sound mellow and bit roll off in sharpness but a bit narrower in sound stage, very pleasant though. With the 10uf caps in place the sound stage opens up a little and has a bit more depth based again mostly on the more forward sounds in music attacking a bit harder. It's interesting in that it has a bit more of an edge but a bit more air and as I said presence too. I'll live with it for a while with the 10uf caps and later solder in my 33uf caps.
OBTW I also have added some damping pieces, foam rubber tabs and cut balsa wood strips here and there to help dampen things more. It also has spike feet added and an iso-platform that is a sprung design sandwiched between two MDF boards.
So I fired the unit up and began some listening. What I have noticed is that the sound stage has a bit more presence over stock setup. Instruments hit a bit harder but it still sounds quite smooth. In stock form I find the PS to sound mellow and bit roll off in sharpness but a bit narrower in sound stage, very pleasant though. With the 10uf caps in place the sound stage opens up a little and has a bit more depth based again mostly on the more forward sounds in music attacking a bit harder. It's interesting in that it has a bit more of an edge but a bit more air and as I said presence too. I'll live with it for a while with the 10uf caps and later solder in my 33uf caps.
OBTW I also have added some damping pieces, foam rubber tabs and cut balsa wood strips here and there to help dampen things more. It also has spike feet added and an iso-platform that is a sprung design sandwiched between two MDF boards.
PS1 without amp
Hi,
I am about to start modding a PS1. However, I note that a lot of the mods have totally removed the amplifiers which follow the DAC. The DAC is then connected via a cap directly to the following pre-amp. Is there not a seriosu loss of voluem when thsi is done? Does anyone knwo the output of the DAC without amplification?
I tend to agree that the amps in the PS1 may not be the best quality but I guess they served soem purpose, so what are we losing with this upgrade?
All advice gratefully received
George
Hi,
I am about to start modding a PS1. However, I note that a lot of the mods have totally removed the amplifiers which follow the DAC. The DAC is then connected via a cap directly to the following pre-amp. Is there not a seriosu loss of voluem when thsi is done? Does anyone knwo the output of the DAC without amplification?
I tend to agree that the amps in the PS1 may not be the best quality but I guess they served soem purpose, so what are we losing with this upgrade?
All advice gratefully received
George
Output Level
Hi,
I have made the PS1 upgrade of bypassing the caps after the DAC and running direct to the RCA connectors via 3.3uF Wima caps and resistor.
The sound is certainly better, clearer, detailed and the bass is also improved.
However, the sound level is now way down and the pre-amp has its volume control some 60 degrees further rotation for equivalent level from teh PS1 as from my SCD-1.
I guess I am now looking for a high quality amp to build to get the PS1 level up to the norm for my preamp. I have looked at the cmoy kit for this but I am keen not to lose the quality I have. Can anyone suggest anything that I could build for the PS1?
Hi,
I have made the PS1 upgrade of bypassing the caps after the DAC and running direct to the RCA connectors via 3.3uF Wima caps and resistor.
The sound is certainly better, clearer, detailed and the bass is also improved.
However, the sound level is now way down and the pre-amp has its volume control some 60 degrees further rotation for equivalent level from teh PS1 as from my SCD-1.
I guess I am now looking for a high quality amp to build to get the PS1 level up to the norm for my preamp. I have looked at the cmoy kit for this but I am keen not to lose the quality I have. Can anyone suggest anything that I could build for the PS1?
I did listening tests with the modded output stage.
- I can't hear any difference between Multi-AV and cinch.
- Multi-AV had before the output stage mod a warmer and not so detailed sound. I am not sure why it is now the same as cinch?
- Sound is very airy and cloudy now with much details but a lack of mids. I miss the analog sound.
- Highs are a little bit to dominant or harsh. Especially at piano and cymbals. That was better before the mod.
- I have used a 1µF cap and a 47k resistance as HPF. I only removed the first two caps behind the AK4309.
- sound level is no problem for my preamp. Only with the passive pre and a CD with low level it is a problem (e.g. Brothers in Arms)
Any explanations or experiences for this. How do you describe the sound change (or improvement).
- I can't hear any difference between Multi-AV and cinch.
- Multi-AV had before the output stage mod a warmer and not so detailed sound. I am not sure why it is now the same as cinch?
- Sound is very airy and cloudy now with much details but a lack of mids. I miss the analog sound.
- Highs are a little bit to dominant or harsh. Especially at piano and cymbals. That was better before the mod.
- I have used a 1µF cap and a 47k resistance as HPF. I only removed the first two caps behind the AK4309.
- sound level is no problem for my preamp. Only with the passive pre and a CD with low level it is a problem (e.g. Brothers in Arms)
Any explanations or experiences for this. How do you describe the sound change (or improvement).
georgebrooke,
you can go the easy way and build a simple opamp stage, but with a good opamp and good components, I was very happy with the results. For some ideas, have a look at my thread on the other forum ( http://www.diyhifi.org/forums/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=1356 ). Or you can try something more complicated, like a discrete buffer or so...
Tolu,
you said this:
- I can't hear any difference between Multi-AV and cinch.
- Multi-AV had before the output stage mod a warmer and not so detailed sound. I am not sure why it is now the same as cinch?
for me, that makes perfect sense: you removed the caps and the connection to the opamp from the cinch signal path, so now you have it sounding the same like the multi-AV... gotta look at things the other way round, it wasn't the multi-av out that had the warmer and not so detailed sound, I'd say it was the cinch that had the harder, probably a little harsher (gives the illusion of more detailed) sound, due to caps and opamp
you can go the easy way and build a simple opamp stage, but with a good opamp and good components, I was very happy with the results. For some ideas, have a look at my thread on the other forum ( http://www.diyhifi.org/forums/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=1356 ). Or you can try something more complicated, like a discrete buffer or so...
Tolu,
you said this:
- I can't hear any difference between Multi-AV and cinch.
- Multi-AV had before the output stage mod a warmer and not so detailed sound. I am not sure why it is now the same as cinch?
for me, that makes perfect sense: you removed the caps and the connection to the opamp from the cinch signal path, so now you have it sounding the same like the multi-AV... gotta look at things the other way round, it wasn't the multi-av out that had the warmer and not so detailed sound, I'd say it was the cinch that had the harder, probably a little harsher (gives the illusion of more detailed) sound, due to caps and opamp
PS1 Sound
Hi,
I think I shall put up with the low output for now as I am afraid of losing the present sound improvement with the introduction of an amplifier.
I spent last night switching between familiar CDs and the differences between the Sony SCD-1 and the PS1 are becoming clearer. For a start I am hearing more seperation of instruments, particularly in the higher frequencies. In some ways this is like switching between a conventional loudspeaker and an electrostatic. More focus, more detail, better imaging are just some of my notes on this. Of course it might be that there is a misbalance in the treble, giving false information, but the sound is definitely not sharp/painful or pronounced. Given the 20 seconds or more settling time of my big Sony, the PS1 has become our preferred player. The build quality of PS1 leaves a bit to be desired.. a piece of plastic fell off the drive yesterday (Superglue will fix it, but for £20 what can you expect?). Longevity is probably not its strong point and it does get a bit warm. I shall rehouse it and integrate the remote control as it really looks naff hanging out of the front. I am inclined to put by SCD-1 on eBay as the PS1 demonstrates that you do not need a crate-sized box or enormous bank account to hear good quality music.
Hi,
I think I shall put up with the low output for now as I am afraid of losing the present sound improvement with the introduction of an amplifier.
I spent last night switching between familiar CDs and the differences between the Sony SCD-1 and the PS1 are becoming clearer. For a start I am hearing more seperation of instruments, particularly in the higher frequencies. In some ways this is like switching between a conventional loudspeaker and an electrostatic. More focus, more detail, better imaging are just some of my notes on this. Of course it might be that there is a misbalance in the treble, giving false information, but the sound is definitely not sharp/painful or pronounced. Given the 20 seconds or more settling time of my big Sony, the PS1 has become our preferred player. The build quality of PS1 leaves a bit to be desired.. a piece of plastic fell off the drive yesterday (Superglue will fix it, but for £20 what can you expect?). Longevity is probably not its strong point and it does get a bit warm. I shall rehouse it and integrate the remote control as it really looks naff hanging out of the front. I am inclined to put by SCD-1 on eBay as the PS1 demonstrates that you do not need a crate-sized box or enormous bank account to hear good quality music.
Hi
about the output mod:
Did you have a series resistor in the output path from AK4309 to cinch or just the HPF?
The manufacturer of the AK4309 recommends "some series resistors" and caps about >1µF in the datasheet.
What values (and parts) sound best? What kind of HPF did you use and did you use any series resistors in the signal path?
I have compared the modded cinch (1µF+47k HPF) vs. Multi-AV and in my setup the Multi-AV won because highs were smoother and sound was rounder than cinch HPF outputs (e.g. with Katie Melua - Piece by piece where the voice has to struggle with sharp esses).
about the output mod:
Did you have a series resistor in the output path from AK4309 to cinch or just the HPF?
The manufacturer of the AK4309 recommends "some series resistors" and caps about >1µF in the datasheet.
What values (and parts) sound best? What kind of HPF did you use and did you use any series resistors in the signal path?
I have compared the modded cinch (1µF+47k HPF) vs. Multi-AV and in my setup the Multi-AV won because highs were smoother and sound was rounder than cinch HPF outputs (e.g. with Katie Melua - Piece by piece where the voice has to struggle with sharp esses).