A quick look at what I'm working on currently.
Volt B250.8, ATC SM75-150S, Eton ER4.
The boxes are just test boxes at the moment. They're sealed, but may end up as dipoles. On the other hand they may just stay sealed because the bass is just fantastic as is. Smooth, tight and controlled. Extension to the lowest octave is missing, but I may add a sub-woofer or try a Linkwitz transform profile. The Volt's have a small glitch in the FR and impedance plots signalling the beginnings of breakup modes at about 550Hz. But I'm croosing to the ATC at 375Hz at 24dB/oct, so it's already well down.
The ATC's are amazing drivers, superb, expolsive, attack and control. Almost horn-like in their rendition of snare drums and brass. Strings and vocals are smooth and detailed.
But the SM75-150S isn't easy to apply, requiring some EQ and careful integration. They start getting too directional above about 3.5kHz, so at the moment they're crossed out at 3.35kHz.
The ER4 has an interesting character. I haven't heard better reproduction of cymbals, especially ride cymbals. But sometimes it can sound a bit confused. I haven't flush mounted the drivers yet, and the protective HPF has been cobbled together with parts I had on hand. It's highly variable directivity is causing some issues with the power response, so I will be doing some experiments with waveguide loading the ER4 to manipulate the power response. I'll also be trying out some AC ribbons and maybe a dome as well.
It's all sounding very impressive considering the development is only in it's early stages.
Cheers,
Ralph.
Volt B250.8, ATC SM75-150S, Eton ER4.
The boxes are just test boxes at the moment. They're sealed, but may end up as dipoles. On the other hand they may just stay sealed because the bass is just fantastic as is. Smooth, tight and controlled. Extension to the lowest octave is missing, but I may add a sub-woofer or try a Linkwitz transform profile. The Volt's have a small glitch in the FR and impedance plots signalling the beginnings of breakup modes at about 550Hz. But I'm croosing to the ATC at 375Hz at 24dB/oct, so it's already well down.
The ATC's are amazing drivers, superb, expolsive, attack and control. Almost horn-like in their rendition of snare drums and brass. Strings and vocals are smooth and detailed.
But the SM75-150S isn't easy to apply, requiring some EQ and careful integration. They start getting too directional above about 3.5kHz, so at the moment they're crossed out at 3.35kHz.
The ER4 has an interesting character. I haven't heard better reproduction of cymbals, especially ride cymbals. But sometimes it can sound a bit confused. I haven't flush mounted the drivers yet, and the protective HPF has been cobbled together with parts I had on hand. It's highly variable directivity is causing some issues with the power response, so I will be doing some experiments with waveguide loading the ER4 to manipulate the power response. I'll also be trying out some AC ribbons and maybe a dome as well.
It's all sounding very impressive considering the development is only in it's early stages.
Cheers,
Ralph.
Attachments
Thanks for the good words everyone.
Yeah, they are looking better than I was expecting. And they're certainly sounding great too.
You guys picked up on the reflection of the bricks pretty quick. I didn't even notice when I took the picture!
The whole box is a high-gloss black finish. I can't take any credit for the boxes though, I got them from another guy who made them for his now abandoned project. I figured it would be easier to use these rather than make my own. I'd still prefer a wood grain finish, but do they do look kinda cool - if a bit evil- in black.
I'm still waiting for the AC ribbons from a group buy through here. I paid for them in April, but there's been some problems with delivery and I'm still waiting. Not too much longer I hope!
Cheers,
Ralph.
Yeah, they are looking better than I was expecting. And they're certainly sounding great too.
You guys picked up on the reflection of the bricks pretty quick. I didn't even notice when I took the picture!
The whole box is a high-gloss black finish. I can't take any credit for the boxes though, I got them from another guy who made them for his now abandoned project. I figured it would be easier to use these rather than make my own. I'd still prefer a wood grain finish, but do they do look kinda cool - if a bit evil- in black.
I won't disagree with you at this stage Inertial. I've only had them running a couple of weeks and there's still lots of development work to do. I've already made several experiments with the rear loading, and haven't yet found what I'm looking for. But I have discovered they're tricky to integrate. At the moment they are firing into the top half of the enclosure which is loosely stuffed. Please let me know if you have some suggestions.
I got the ATC mid from Ebay in Germany. Got lucky on that one! Another abandoned project. I bought them with some other drivers including another pair of Volt B250.8's I've had shipped here to Melbourne and some PHL2460's and Raven R2's still with my sister in Holland. More drivers than I know what to do with at the moment!
I'm still waiting for the AC ribbons from a group buy through here. I paid for them in April, but there's been some problems with delivery and I'm still waiting. Not too much longer I hope!
Cheers,
Ralph.
Hi!
I am very interested in your work as I plan to build a no trade loudspeaker for my pleasure.
For the XO I plan to use this device: Pro C28 FIR Controller
http://www.klein-hummel.com/html/st...dio_index_e.htm
because I can get one at dirt cheap price (a studio that unfortunately went to bankrupt).
I am looking for best of the drivers and the ATC drivers seem to undergo a kind of hipe. As is impossible to get any curve about those jewels.... and it's possible, I'd like to have a look
at your measurements of the SM75 and others.
You can send me any kind of file including all the files compatibles with Lspcad...
Thanks in advance
@+
Maiky
I am very interested in your work as I plan to build a no trade loudspeaker for my pleasure.
For the XO I plan to use this device: Pro C28 FIR Controller
http://www.klein-hummel.com/html/st...dio_index_e.htm
because I can get one at dirt cheap price (a studio that unfortunately went to bankrupt).
I am looking for best of the drivers and the ATC drivers seem to undergo a kind of hipe. As is impossible to get any curve about those jewels.... and it's possible, I'd like to have a look
at your measurements of the SM75 and others.
You can send me any kind of file including all the files compatibles with Lspcad...
Thanks in advance
@+
Maiky
Hi Newfinish,
I can highly recommend the ATC mid for its intended purpose. I chose this driver because one of my key requirements is to avoid a crossover point in the 300-3kHz region. I have previously built 2 way systems and always felt that the transition between drivers at around 1-2kHz upset the stereo imaging.
With the ATC I get exceptional imaging. I had previously been listening to constant directivity horns and was worried I may lose some of the impact and imaging qualities of the horns. With my new setup I not only get a better balanced image, but also a much more consistent one across the entire listening area. It's really impressive the way the stereo image keeps its focus as I shift my listening position.
The horns are probably better suited to a larger room. I am listening from 3m away and have never been happy with the projection of conventional cone midranges and dome tweeters, finding these speaker types unengaging and the stereo image too diffuse. The ATC's seem to hit that sweet spot between the ambience and delicacy of cones+ domes and the impact and intimacy of horns in a medium sized room.
I can't comment on the Vifa drivers you mention, but in general I'm not a fan of largish diameter cones crossed over to 1" tweeters as there is generally a serious discontinuity in the power response and considerable lobing in the vertical axis due to the different dispersions of widely different radiator diameters. I should qualify that statement by pointing out that I intend it to apply to the main loudspeakers in your lounge room. The comments are less relevant to near-field monitors.
I hope that gives a better idea of the character of the ATC mids and what I'm trying to achieve with them.
Cheers,
Ralph.
I can highly recommend the ATC mid for its intended purpose. I chose this driver because one of my key requirements is to avoid a crossover point in the 300-3kHz region. I have previously built 2 way systems and always felt that the transition between drivers at around 1-2kHz upset the stereo imaging.
With the ATC I get exceptional imaging. I had previously been listening to constant directivity horns and was worried I may lose some of the impact and imaging qualities of the horns. With my new setup I not only get a better balanced image, but also a much more consistent one across the entire listening area. It's really impressive the way the stereo image keeps its focus as I shift my listening position.
The horns are probably better suited to a larger room. I am listening from 3m away and have never been happy with the projection of conventional cone midranges and dome tweeters, finding these speaker types unengaging and the stereo image too diffuse. The ATC's seem to hit that sweet spot between the ambience and delicacy of cones+ domes and the impact and intimacy of horns in a medium sized room.
I can't comment on the Vifa drivers you mention, but in general I'm not a fan of largish diameter cones crossed over to 1" tweeters as there is generally a serious discontinuity in the power response and considerable lobing in the vertical axis due to the different dispersions of widely different radiator diameters. I should qualify that statement by pointing out that I intend it to apply to the main loudspeakers in your lounge room. The comments are less relevant to near-field monitors.
I hope that gives a better idea of the character of the ATC mids and what I'm trying to achieve with them.
Cheers,
Ralph.
Hi Maiky,
That's a very nice looking speaker management unit. FIR filters should sound very nice. The 5-7ms latency is very low too. I'm running a dbx driverack that has 15ms latency with IIR filters.
I also found it strange that there was no hard information of the SM75-150s'. They seem cloaked in mystery. But I'll be happy to blow their cover!
I'll post some graphs of the amplitude/phase and impedance of the ATC mids for you in the next day or two.
Cheers,
Ralph.
That's a very nice looking speaker management unit. FIR filters should sound very nice. The 5-7ms latency is very low too. I'm running a dbx driverack that has 15ms latency with IIR filters.
I also found it strange that there was no hard information of the SM75-150s'. They seem cloaked in mystery. But I'll be happy to blow their cover!
I'll post some graphs of the amplitude/phase and impedance of the ATC mids for you in the next day or two.
Cheers,
Ralph.
newfinish said:
I'm not sure about Ralphs opinion on the realism of the driver but I agree with his thoughts on soundstaging and imaging.
Its a well known fact amongs ATC owners and enthusiast that they make some of the most natural and realistic sounding drivers in the world.
Better yet instead of me telling you how they sound take a look at this review of an ATC speaker package:
http://guidetohometheater.com/speakersystems/5/index1.html
Apart from the midrange this is of course a completely different set of speakers to ralphs setup. I chose the ATC 9" bass driver to partner my ATC mid, so it does share nearly the same drivers as the speakers in the above review. It still isn't a fair comparison though because of the widely different design principles and details. But what's written in the review closely reflects my own feeling about the performance of both the ATC mid and the ATC SB75-234SC bass driver.
For me they are the best I've heard yet. Not cheap but you certainly get what you pay for here.
thx guys this fantastic it helps me a lot for the next kit I want to make in the picture I think the tweeter is seas am I right?
http://guidetohometheater.com/speakersystems/5/index1.html
http://guidetohometheater.com/speakersystems/5/index1.html
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