burnedfingers said:
all relevent to how much you want to spend, how involved the interest,
and what YOU can hear.
start with remove muting and output caps then better quality opamps
simple cheap and improvement
but if you cannot hear the difference?
don't worry about it
low cost and no damage done.
allan
SimontY
Quote:
You could be the first. What equipment do you have for measuring distortion, and what types of distortion? And what would you be looking for?
It is unfortunate that I cannot ask a simple question without getting atitude in return.
I have Sound Technology distortion analyzers and I can measure IM and THD distortion. I would think if there was a viable improvement it would show up here in terms of lower distortion.
Quote:
You could be the first. What equipment do you have for measuring distortion, and what types of distortion? And what would you be looking for?
It is unfortunate that I cannot ask a simple question without getting atitude in return.
I have Sound Technology distortion analyzers and I can measure IM and THD distortion. I would think if there was a viable improvement it would show up here in terms of lower distortion.
burnedfingers said:
Ok, great. I know nothing of test equipment, but it sounds like you can do some basic measurements. If this is what you'd like to do, I might suggest particular changes, which produce substantial gains in sound quality. If you perform said changes and measure before and after you might get some interesting results. Try addon master clock with dedicated psu, op-amps, removal of output parts. I'd love to know just how much distortion comes away. If we can hear it, it must be measurable, right?
burnedfingers said:
Hi.
Just to add my 2p worth to this side topic............
The only equipment that counts in ANY audio measurement are your ears. After all that's what it's about - listening.
Distortion, clock jitter etc. do not count if you like what you hear.
For example, some Very Expensive High-End equipment does not measure well in the distortion department but is well received when listened to!
The point is - if you like the sound of the original equipment, don't do anything.
If you are not happy, try a mod... if the result is a change for the better, well done. If not, change back and try something else. A case in point, GREEN Lights or BLUE - I will try this later just to see.
PLEASE ... LET'S NOT GO DOWN THIS ROUTE !!!!!!!!!
STOP NOW !!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Andy
rowemeister said:Im not going to reply, this thread will fall on its ar*e if we do.
Sod it !
We are all trying different things to make the audio sound better. Read any artical on noisy psu rails in these players. Do psu mods remove/isolate noise . simple job done.
I agree 100%
allan
ps these gentlemen have given there time advise suggestions free
what you do with it is your choice
pps like my stupid suggestion with that earth
and there was something nagging me about the top plane
rowemeister said:Im not going to reply, this thread will fall on its ar*e if we do.
Sod it !
We are all trying different things to make the audio sound better. Read any artical on noisy psu rails in these players. Do psu mods remove/isolate noise . simple job done.
burnedfingers said:
Now, now, people, no need to get excited
Burnedfingers, that's cool! With this kind of equipment maybe we can put the finger on the exact reason for these mod's we are doing. We know that the sound changes, to the better mostly, but I don't think any of us has had the opportunity to actually measure it, simply because we don't have this equipment available (BTW: i'm dead serious here).
I'm absolutely sure that it has to do with TIM and other nasty stuff, the only question is: do you have a CD63 or CD67 at your disposal? EDIT: yes you do
Regards,
Ray.
Quote:
Now, now, people, no need to get excited
Burnedfingers, that's cool! With this kind of equipment maybe we can put the finger on the exact reason for these mod's we are doing. We know that the sound changes, to the better mostly, but I don't think any of us has had the opportunity to actually measure it, simply because we don't have this equipment available (BTW: i'm dead serious here).
I'm absolutely sure that it has to do with TIM and other nasty stuff, the only question is: do you have a CD63 or CD67 at your disposal? EDIT: yes you do
I wasn't trying to start WW3 here. I was trying to find out what mods would deliver the best gain in performance. I also thought that being good diyers there might have been some measurement
taken. Measurement in the way of before and after are important to gauge the importance of the work being done.
Gentlemen, I could have possibly contributed positively here but gauging the attitude I will back out with my tail between my legs.
Now, now, people, no need to get excited
Burnedfingers, that's cool! With this kind of equipment maybe we can put the finger on the exact reason for these mod's we are doing. We know that the sound changes, to the better mostly, but I don't think any of us has had the opportunity to actually measure it, simply because we don't have this equipment available (BTW: i'm dead serious here).
I'm absolutely sure that it has to do with TIM and other nasty stuff, the only question is: do you have a CD63 or CD67 at your disposal? EDIT: yes you do
I wasn't trying to start WW3 here. I was trying to find out what mods would deliver the best gain in performance. I also thought that being good diyers there might have been some measurement
taken. Measurement in the way of before and after are important to gauge the importance of the work being done.
Gentlemen, I could have possibly contributed positively here but gauging the attitude I will back out with my tail between my legs.
6h5c said:
i have the Lclock in my cd850 just remembered the coax supplied and used is very thin, it was RG174
http://www.soundlabsgroup.com.au/lcaudio/lc_audio_lclock_xo.htm
allan
burnedfingers said:
I am sorry you feel that way burnedfingers. I admit that I probably helped set the tone by being sarcastic, for which I apologise. I never want to hurt anyones feelings.
I was sarcastic in reply to your initial question of measurements because I thought you were asking a somewhat loaded question. It seems obvious (if you read the whole thread) that no kind of distortion measurements have been performed. And it seems to be well accepted that THD measurements don't provide much insight to actual perceived sound quality. IM distortion test may provide something a bit more useful, if you can perform them with complex music as a test signal.
I also would like to know about the jitter situation before and after reclocking. Another useful test would be to measure the noise on the various psu lines, but commen sense suggests the noise will be reduced by dedicating different psus to different circuits. Do we need to measure the obvious?
A further point I'd like to make, which seems obvious to me, is that most of us just want to upgrade, listen, then upgrade some more. Even if we could perform an array of measurements (and most of us surely cannot) each time we replaced some resistors or caps or added a psu we might not want to spend time doing that, but would rather trust our ears for changes.
For most people the important thing is making the kit sound better, not quantifying in precise units how much each mod affects the sound. And it's my belief that it's impossible to quantify sound quality with current methods.
Perhaps blind listening A-B tests provide a way of trapping changes (for good or bad) and for those with the patience, let them post results here, which can be taken with a pinch of salt. I know Brent (rowemeister) intends to compare his LED mod in this way, and I commend him for undertaking something so difficult, as it will obviously be.
Here is a pic of a switch for the LED mod. lol
The switch on its own makes the sound much better. LOL
The switch on its own makes the sound much better. LOL
An externally hosted image should be here but it was not working when we last tested it.
. It would have been nice to have some measurements to support or debunk our subjective findings. I hope you didn't take my earlier message as sarcasm. No chance to turn the tide I suppose?
I have some coax here at work , its only 5mm and looks well made.
Do you think this will be ok for the job on digital lines?
http://www.hubersuhner.com/products...sc&col=1&prm=E2A3B3204C885317935753026D1683E5
Do you think this will be ok for the job on digital lines?
http://www.hubersuhner.com/products...sc&col=1&prm=E2A3B3204C885317935753026D1683E5
guys I like what your doing and the tone of this thread.
Im doing some of what you have suggested to a CD6000. It sounds worse than my cd67se so its a good reference. But its going slow and my clock I ordered was faulty, no output so I have to wait a while. Ive got a torroidal and new +-12V, analog 5V. Elna for audio 3300 caps, and nichion goldtune 3300 caps.
Have another transformer for clock 5V and digital 5V.
When Ive done this player I would like to do the cd67 with tube output, clock new psu etc and see which is best. Im picking cd67 is the one to beat. But I dont have so much time and its going slowly.
seeya arthur
Im doing some of what you have suggested to a CD6000. It sounds worse than my cd67se so its a good reference. But its going slow and my clock I ordered was faulty, no output so I have to wait a while. Ive got a torroidal and new +-12V, analog 5V. Elna for audio 3300 caps, and nichion goldtune 3300 caps.
Have another transformer for clock 5V and digital 5V.
When Ive done this player I would like to do the cd67 with tube output, clock new psu etc and see which is best. Im picking cd67 is the one to beat. But I dont have so much time and its going slowly.
seeya arthur