I've done a number of experiments along these lines - everything makes a difference, especially with 'lower grade' setups. The current system, a modified all in one HT machine, has filters of my own design - very, very different from the standard efforts, but based on what the real behaviours of the mains, and power supplies of typical audio component are - and these have a substantial positive benefit. As in, I can achieve close to optimum sound level without having to shut down the whole house electrically ...
you personalized that John, I was referring to myself not going silly (although i'm sure thats arguable to some), its a turn of phrase. I wouldnt buy a silver power cord even if I could afford one, but then neither did you, not the sort of thing I would turn down as a gift either, but I dont hold out hope for it sounding any better than a sufficient gauge copper cable.
I do the power thing just in case without going nuts on it, because I can, I added parts with other orders over the years till I had a few cords, I like things to look nice, be mechanically sound and provide more than enough current carrying ability. but I think IECs are silly, dont care what they are made of, the Neutrik True1 connectors are the better choice, if one must have a connector IMO
I do the power thing just in case without going nuts on it, because I can, I added parts with other orders over the years till I had a few cords, I like things to look nice, be mechanically sound and provide more than enough current carrying ability. but I think IECs are silly, dont care what they are made of, the Neutrik True1 connectors are the better choice, if one must have a connector IMO
I found it quite surprising how much noise just a normal bridge rectifier made and put back into the power line.
If you have a better power cord it helps both ways.
I have posted some data bits a way back on this thread.
You know those silly real measurements.
Well, they aren't...nor are they near superconducting.
That said...how did you insert them into the line cord? Are they in hot and neutral, ground only, or all three?
jn
That has been my experience as well. And that of many of the public who bought line filters within multi-outlet plug strips. Even lay people with modest reciever system have told me it made everything sound more clear and they know nothing at all but how to turn it on and listen.
It is one of the last areas in audio that has gone without industry-wide attention. Been over-looked, I guess. But now with all the digital products and switching supplies hanging on the power lines, it is at a level which cannot be ignored anymore (or can it?).
Thx-RNMarsh
now you ARE being silly; silly, do we separate power cables into 2 distinct camps of pissant lamp cords or solid silver with bybees now?
there are ways to make a good power cord without getting crazy. I get a little crazy with it just because I like nice stuff and there arent many options here in AU for male connectors, but past just being smart about it and making sure its not a bottleneck, or an aerial, I dont think there is that much to recommend spending as much on your power cable as your amplifier
you can get decent cable for not much money, shielded like Belden, Alphawire, or even VHAUDIOs 12AWG UPOCC twisted pair or starquad is pretty well priced really ($6 a foot for the pair, $9 for the quad). a good power cable should last you a lifetime and if you build it OTT enough it should cope with anything you'll ever use in your house; so going too budget seems disingenuous.
I do really like the new powercons and they are pretty reasonably priced, so i'm thinking about building a distribution box with a couple filters and installing a rack of the TRUE1 sockets, which will cut my costs by half at least. i'll have to take it to an electrician to get it signed off on for insurance.
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Mains has always been dirty, and in the past the main culprit has been HVAC, add to that power line communications and all the rest of the mess and its pretty bad.
Some sort of filtering on mains has always been recommended, and in todays rich EMC world even more so.
Even more important is making sure your kit has a decent power supply on the front end SMPS or linear...
Some sort of filtering on mains has always been recommended, and in todays rich EMC world even more so.
Even more important is making sure your kit has a decent power supply on the front end SMPS or linear...
Actually I would not say power cords make the difference its having some mains filtering.
Having really thick low resistance wires for your power cords will often mean the lower audio frequencies are returning via the power cord safety earth rather then the device interconnects, as this is often the path of least resistance.
Having really thick low resistance wires for your power cords will often mean the lower audio frequencies are returning via the power cord safety earth rather then the device interconnects, as this is often the path of least resistance.
One thing the persistent or recently-arrived peruser of this thread can note is the details of the power supplies shown, in particular the incorporation of common-mode chokes in locations not normally seen. I don't know where to begin excavations among the 40k+ posts, but a few search term attempts could be made.
I counted them as in the category of "interesting things to try". They were in the midst of otherwise-standard iron-copper-diode-cap supplies, not switchers.
In general though I agree that a well-designed product should be more-or-less immune to the input power, provided it's not just pathologically terrible. But one should never underestimate how much the mains can sag or soar. I got bitten by this badly in a spectrometer, a one-of-a-kind effort upon which little effort was spared, when I didn't realize how much the power dipped at Lick Oberservatory during the evening. The effect was a dropout of a power rail's regulation on line voltage dips and the insertion of spikes in pixel readouts, and it took a month to find. The simple remedy was just to boost the a.c. input a bit with some variacs.
I counted them as in the category of "interesting things to try". They were in the midst of otherwise-standard iron-copper-diode-cap supplies, not switchers.
In general though I agree that a well-designed product should be more-or-less immune to the input power, provided it's not just pathologically terrible. But one should never underestimate how much the mains can sag or soar. I got bitten by this badly in a spectrometer, a one-of-a-kind effort upon which little effort was spared, when I didn't realize how much the power dipped at Lick Oberservatory during the evening. The effect was a dropout of a power rail's regulation on line voltage dips and the insertion of spikes in pixel readouts, and it took a month to find. The simple remedy was just to boost the a.c. input a bit with some variacs.
my poweramps are using double insulated, regulated switchers (onboard filtering) and the amps are balanced, so no thats unlikely to happen. its a good point though.
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I take it actual research and measurements being silly leaves your method
Of active fertilizer spreading to be your preference.
But for those who actually care a look at the neutrik data sheet for powercons is worth it.
Some pros don't use them due to limited current handling and contact resistance that is higher than some alternatives.
But go ahead quote cable names and types without any comprehension of the basics.
haha, get a grip mate, seriously. you really oughta take a good hard look at what you just read from what I wrote. clearly your use of the word silly was directed at me in the first place, yet you have no understanding of what I meant by it and have made up your own fantasy.
for DC umbilicals, if I need high current, I have ITT cannons, no problem. I read the datasheet fir the neutriks, they'll do nicely for ME thanks, but i'll take your ******** judgement under consideration.
ahh yes, its my old powercons that are 20A, the new ones are only 20A in the USA ~120V and 16A here; my apologies sir. the new ones will still do just fine, since we only have ~10A here at 230V and I dont need close to half of their rating (16A@ 250V ~1500W for each mono amp channel meets my needs OK ...)
for DC umbilicals, if I need high current, I have ITT cannons, no problem. I read the datasheet fir the neutriks, they'll do nicely for ME thanks, but i'll take your ******** judgement under consideration.
ahh yes, its my old powercons that are 20A, the new ones are only 20A in the USA ~120V and 16A here; my apologies sir. the new ones will still do just fine, since we only have ~10A here at 230V and I dont need close to half of their rating (16A@ 250V ~1500W for each mono amp channel meets my needs OK ...)
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Folks, I am a different kind of guy. I actually try things, before I condemn them, and I sometimes even open one up (destroying it, naturally) to INDEPENDENTLY verify if I am being lied to, or taken for a chump.
So, about 18 years ago, I independently listened to this BYBEE device that contained 2 bybee devices and 2 power resistors in parallel to each one. One of each for the hot and the neutral, then enclosed in a tough epoxy, with leads sticking out. This module was wired with AC outlets, one in and one out. I did not know Jack Bybee at the time. I did the listening test with my old (then newer) favorite, the STAX Lambda tube driven setup with electrostatic headphones. In time, I got to know Jack Bybee, and he even let me see, under the hood, so to speak, without the epoxy. I even went around with him, on occasion, when he would demo his device to some hi fi store.
In any case, there was a BIG debate as to what the Bybee device was on the internet. One guy INSISTED that it was made of a material that was highly inflammable and even reactive to water, which could make it dangerous. Of course, he, like so many here, and never seen a Bybee device, let alone, analyzed it.
So I decided to open up a Bybee device, left behind by Jack Bybee for my ultimate insertion in my speakers. I had to know: is this for real, or am I being sold a bill of goods? In any case, I found the resistor, of course, but in parallel to the resistor was this tube with 2 end caps, like a fuse, that measured a finite but not a very low value, so the resistor would take the bulk of the current. Unwrapping the cover, I found some lead filled damping material covering what appeared to be some metallic coatings on a ceramic substrate. In any case, once exposing the 'interesting' part of the device to the air, I took it outside, with a fire extinguisher, put it in a metal pan and added water.
Guess what? Nothing happened! The guy on the internet had just guessed at what it was, and speculated further about his guess. It happens around here, sometimes too!
I ultimately had to tell Jack what I did, and I think he came to understand that I could not BLINDLY trust him, I had to test for myself.
Nothing I say here will convince everybody, but this is my early experience with the Bybee.
So, about 18 years ago, I independently listened to this BYBEE device that contained 2 bybee devices and 2 power resistors in parallel to each one. One of each for the hot and the neutral, then enclosed in a tough epoxy, with leads sticking out. This module was wired with AC outlets, one in and one out. I did not know Jack Bybee at the time. I did the listening test with my old (then newer) favorite, the STAX Lambda tube driven setup with electrostatic headphones. In time, I got to know Jack Bybee, and he even let me see, under the hood, so to speak, without the epoxy. I even went around with him, on occasion, when he would demo his device to some hi fi store.
In any case, there was a BIG debate as to what the Bybee device was on the internet. One guy INSISTED that it was made of a material that was highly inflammable and even reactive to water, which could make it dangerous. Of course, he, like so many here, and never seen a Bybee device, let alone, analyzed it.
So I decided to open up a Bybee device, left behind by Jack Bybee for my ultimate insertion in my speakers. I had to know: is this for real, or am I being sold a bill of goods? In any case, I found the resistor, of course, but in parallel to the resistor was this tube with 2 end caps, like a fuse, that measured a finite but not a very low value, so the resistor would take the bulk of the current. Unwrapping the cover, I found some lead filled damping material covering what appeared to be some metallic coatings on a ceramic substrate. In any case, once exposing the 'interesting' part of the device to the air, I took it outside, with a fire extinguisher, put it in a metal pan and added water.
Guess what? Nothing happened! The guy on the internet had just guessed at what it was, and speculated further about his guess. It happens around here, sometimes too!
I ultimately had to tell Jack what I did, and I think he came to understand that I could not BLINDLY trust him, I had to test for myself.
Nothing I say here will convince everybody, but this is my early experience with the Bybee.
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