It's better to start with what one can afford, then spend what one doesn't have...

[roddyama]

I don't know about those B&W's. I think they are ******* ugly ( a local shop has them set up with two krell monoblocks) Altogether, I think that the system cost more than $50,000. IMHO it didn't sound that good. I haven't heard a set of conventional speakers that can touch ESL's.

Although personally, I don't think they look that bad, I was thinking of the concept more then the exact design.

BTW, I feel the same way about horns as you do about ESL's

 

[Circlotron]

seriously....I would flip them over *snip*

The way they are now, they are out of reach of cat's claws and 3 year old diy'ers testing out X-max with their fingers.

 

[Vikash]

3 year old diy'ers testing out X-max with their fingers.

LOL. Been there. Ended up inverting the subs (and counting to 10 a number of times)

I haven't heard a set of conventional speakers that can touch ESL's...

Considering statics are simpler by design (versus a dynamic transducer), have reportedly superior sound, and I assume they're not expensive to make, I don't see why the majority of us still go down the dynamic route if they're so much better. I've always been curious to what people think make a dynamic better over an ESL or vica versa.
Sorry for bending off topic...

 

[Circlotron]

I don't know about those B&W's. I think they are ******* ugly

I think they look kind of spooky. You won't catch me alone in the house on a dark stormy night with a pair of them around... Edit - I meant the nautilus shell shaped ones.

When a manufacturer publishes a frequency responsse cureve for a tweeter, is it hanging in free space or is it attached to some kind of flat surface?

Hey skinnyboy, congrats on the project. Venom 8 inchers hey? I'm thinking about a pair of the 15's some time later this year. They demand about 300 litres each though. but they should be ok in my 245 litre boxes.

What capacity are your boxes?

 

[purplepeople]

Originally posted by Circlotron When a manufacturer publishes a frequency response curve for a tweeter, is it hanging in free space or is it attached to some kind of flat surface?

I imagine that the spec would be useless if the tweeter was mounted to something during the test since it would already assume how the tweeter would be used.

But, with specsmanship the way it is, who knows?

ensen.

 

[slowmotion]

Tweeters from below ear level don't work well, but of course they can be somewhat higher than ear level - I would try some form of temporary positioning and listening evaluation before putting a great deal of effort in it.

Hi all

Actually IMHO when you get used to it,
tall speakers may not be such as negative ,
my tweeters / midranges is 150cm above the floor
( Unity horns )
gives " a wall of sound " if you are placed some distance from the speakers.
Very subjective, I know, YMMV and all that.

cheers

 

[purplepeople]

When I am having a party, the mains get a boost to put the tweeters at about 4 ft / 125cm high to match the surrounds. It's actually just about right since the sound is the same whether you are sitting or standing and you get your highs off-axis so it doesn't compete with the conversation in the room. The apparent boost in bass is also somewhat appropriate since people expect and are impressed by it.

ensen.

 

[SkinnyBoy]

Wow... this thread really rolled on without me... (I have been away for the last 3 days)

Hey skinnyboy, congrats on the project. Venom 8 inchers hey? I'm thinking about a pair of the 15's some time later this year. They demand about 300 litres each though. but they should be ok in my 245 litre boxes.

What capacity are your boxes?

I don't like the 15's... the magnets are really quite undersized for the weight of the cone...

Each tower is 60litres.. so each "subwoofer" is effectivly getting 30 litres... tuning frequency is about 38Hz was going to be 36Hz, but it made the port TOOOO long.. hehe

 

[7V]

How high will the woofers go (or how low the mids)?

If you can get the mids down to 100Hz, then my recommended solution would be to have the woofer cabinets as separate enclosures. Positioning them to work well in your room would then be much easier. You could lay the subs flat if you wanted.

It's a bit radical and involves more MDF but ...

 

[SkinnyBoy]

How high will the woofers go (or how low the mids)?

You could lay the subs flat if you wanted.

It's a bit radical and involves more MDF but ...

I dunno.... but I doubt my mids will go that low...

Laying the "subs" flat seems quite silly to me... I made them to take up as little floor space as possible..

I don't want more MDF... not too much more anyway.. lol

 

[Ken L]

I like Ken L's suggestion

Well, I still like my suggestion, too _big grin_.

But it was intended to suggest that Skinny Boy copy the old 801 series lll, head - which had the tweeter on top of the mid - as an integral unit - the mid and the tweeter were in one molded housing that rotated and could be completely lifted off.

This style was what I bought new in 1983. I did a google search and found no picts other than a later model.

Actually, the old style 802 had the same head but a different woofer cabinet.

So what I am suggesting as one solution to his problem - build a trapezoidal pod that will house the mid-range and tweeter and sit on the top of the current boxes

Don't place them in a position that is fixed and design them in such a way that they can be toed in.

Then you can toe in the mid and the tweeter appropriately, yet leave the bass firing dead ahead.

If you become obsessive about placing the bass on a true, square line - then the bass frequencies will tend to "snap in" and reinforce themselves - not muddy at all - at least that was the case with the 801's. It really was an excellent design feature that worked very well.

YMMV

Regards

Ken L

 

[Peter Daniel]

I tried to build B&W 802 clones once

 

[SkinnyBoy]

thanx for all the suggestions... I'm just gunna finish the towers, with no tweeters, seal them up, and worry about mids and tweeters later.. lol

 

[Guss]

hum lol , How about adding something like that...

 

[Ken L]

I tried to build B&W 802 clones once

Slick, Peter!

As usual, your execution is excellent.

How did they sound?

Your picture illustrates the concept beautifully.

Regards

Ken L

 

[Peter Daniel]

I'm still using them sometimes and they sound well, but I have a feeling that crossovers could be improved. They feature original B&W tweeter, Accuton midrange and 8" Cabasse in TL enclosure.

 

[roddyama]

Well, I still like my suggestion, too _big grin_.

But it was intended to suggest that Skinny Boy copy the old 801 series lll, head - which had the tweeter on top of the mid - as an integral unit - the mid and the tweeter were in one molded housing that rotated and could be completely lifted off.

This style was what I bought new in 1983. I did a google search and found no picts other than a later model.

I couldn't find a pic of the 801's

 

[Da5id4Vz]

801

google picture mode:

 

[roddyama]

Re: 801

google picture mode:

Hey, good job Peter.

 

[Da5id4Vz]

Nautilus 801?

But what’s the reference I find with a broken link?

A Marantz/BW Nautilus 801?

Kind of what I was thinking with the cast plaster (doesnt use any more MDF) suggestion, but what are these things, haven’t seen them before: