This is confusing and I think more of an issue 10 years ago.
Can PAL video be shown/played here in the USA, on professional BluRay players and new projector (with many formats) without some kind of color loss or flickering issue?
The flim may be sent on a disk/thumb drive OR it may be sent Quick Time and converted here in the USA (at a video production house).
e.g. of a Pro Player:
http://www.pioneerelectronics.com/PUSA/Professional/Pro-Video/BDP-V6000
Can PAL video be shown/played here in the USA, on professional BluRay players and new projector (with many formats) without some kind of color loss or flickering issue?
The flim may be sent on a disk/thumb drive OR it may be sent Quick Time and converted here in the USA (at a video production house).
e.g. of a Pro Player:
http://www.pioneerelectronics.com/PUSA/Professional/Pro-Video/BDP-V6000
In my experience it depends on the player and display device. Most of the modern stuff has no problem with different frame rates and will scale most common resolutions anyway.
Aside the region codes, I don't think you'll have a problem. Most of this stuff is made to be sold all over the world, so can handle anything.
Aside the region codes, I don't think you'll have a problem. Most of this stuff is made to be sold all over the world, so can handle anything.
Aakman.com
Thanks Pano,
Sometimes I get involved with "displays" and end up trying different players, moinitor or projectors; and the "films" do come from around the world.
This little box is the installers dream machine, just move videos files to a thumb drive and away she's goes. Just turn on the power and it will run for years, power goes out, it will reboot and start plaaying again once the power goes back on.
Akman Incorporated - Quality Audio & Video Products Since 1983
Thanks Pano,
Sometimes I get involved with "displays" and end up trying different players, moinitor or projectors; and the "films" do come from around the world.
This little box is the installers dream machine, just move videos files to a thumb drive and away she's goes. Just turn on the power and it will run for years, power goes out, it will reboot and start plaaying again once the power goes back on.
Akman Incorporated - Quality Audio & Video Products Since 1983
It is based on scan rate. PAL and NTSC are not compatible however if the machine is able to convert the output to the display type then it can be viewed. The player output must match the display input or the display capable of both formats and the player must be compatible with the source material.
I am sure that there are professional version machines that can play both types but they are probably expensive too but professional machines don't have copyright blocking chips in them either like consumer grade ones do. Same goes for studio audio electronics. Professional grade machines allow you the ability to reproduce blocked materials.
I am sure that there are professional version machines that can play both types but they are probably expensive too but professional machines don't have copyright blocking chips in them either like consumer grade ones do. Same goes for studio audio electronics. Professional grade machines allow you the ability to reproduce blocked materials.
The pioneer is up there in cost; was anyway, looks like it was discontinued. The BDPV6000 and the Akman have similar outputs, just scroll through menu, 50hz and 60hz. To tell you truth, a lot of the time I didn’t see much of a difference (scrolling).
Some of the co-workers are worried about the word “conversion” i.e. they want an untainted image, which is mildly amusing because there are not that many options.
They have solid state line level voltage converter that will “do anything”, so I could convert 60hz to 50hz but then I would need all new PAL gear (which is not going to happen).
Thanks for helping me understand this.
Some of the co-workers are worried about the word “conversion” i.e. they want an untainted image, which is mildly amusing because there are not that many options.
They have solid state line level voltage converter that will “do anything”, so I could convert 60hz to 50hz but then I would need all new PAL gear (which is not going to happen).
Thanks for helping me understand this.
Most modern players and TVs are designed to be used all over the World.
Region Codes aside, just check the spec to see if it NTSC and PAL compatible.
If I recall correctly the difference between PAL 1 and PAL 2 is which side of the video signal the sound is located, this is only an issue for the TV radio stages.
SECAM is also very close to PAL.
NTSC came about because the Americans wanted colour TV before it was really practical to build good colour TVs.
I'm surprised that they have lived with it for so long before going digital.
Region Codes aside, just check the spec to see if it NTSC and PAL compatible.
If I recall correctly the difference between PAL 1 and PAL 2 is which side of the video signal the sound is located, this is only an issue for the TV radio stages.
SECAM is also very close to PAL.
NTSC came about because the Americans wanted colour TV before it was really practical to build good colour TVs.
I'm surprised that they have lived with it for so long before going digital.
They had digital sets back in the 70s, I remember a sales guy demonstrating one back then.
btw, The first USA OTA digital broadcast was 1996, in NC.
Probably most folks on here are wise to this, but alot of folks don't know to install a UFH antenna on the roof (or attic) and hook it to a "new" TV for a crystal clear, HD pic. I'm picking up 40+ OTA channels last time I looked (not all HD).
btw, The first USA OTA digital broadcast was 1996, in NC.
Probably most folks on here are wise to this, but alot of folks don't know to install a UFH antenna on the roof (or attic) and hook it to a "new" TV for a crystal clear, HD pic. I'm picking up 40+ OTA channels last time I looked (not all HD).
I remember that. Channel 5 in Raleigh.
It's amazing how much things have changed since then. Back then we still had to deal with NTSC & PAL problems and getting them synched with oddball computer scan rates. Now it's mostly just different frame rates, but the new equipment seems to handle it all with ease. I work mainly with pro gear, but the consumer stuff has gotten much easier and more flexible, too.
There really has been progress!
Remember Voom satellite? Lol.....that was a good system, their set top boxes were awesome, crystal clear pic and wonderful sound.
The sales pitch was "we provide local channels", the catch was you needed a outdoor atenna...Lol
I got into digital OTA when I had Voom, still have a couple of the Motorola set top boxes. Even modified a couple old atennas with hacksaw; cut the bottom away and use the top, UHF section(s).
The sales pitch was "we provide local channels", the catch was you needed a outdoor atenna...Lol
I got into digital OTA when I had Voom, still have a couple of the Motorola set top boxes. Even modified a couple old atennas with hacksaw; cut the bottom away and use the top, UHF section(s).
Even the PAL in some South-American countries that use it, is a hybrid of NTSC/PAL. PAL-M (Brasil) is just a NTSC with PAL colour carrier (almost same frequency of color carrier). PAL-N is a 50Hz version of PAL-M.
In US, even if PAL is not listed in the new HDTV specs, most of them are compatible because they use the same "universal" SD circuits like the models sold in the rest of the world.
Anyway, in some contries, due to complete transition to digital TV, there is not any over-the-air PAL or NTSC anymore. USA does not have NTSC as over-the-air standard anymore, now it is HD digital: ATSC.
This is not accurate anymore, but it was for the SD:
In US, even if PAL is not listed in the new HDTV specs, most of them are compatible because they use the same "universal" SD circuits like the models sold in the rest of the world.
Anyway, in some contries, due to complete transition to digital TV, there is not any over-the-air PAL or NTSC anymore. USA does not have NTSC as over-the-air standard anymore, now it is HD digital: ATSC.
This is not accurate anymore, but it was for the SD:
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I think you guys are mixing the concepts of image standard and color encoding. PAL (Phase Alternating Line) was an engineering solution to the color drift problem common in NTSC. That problem made the Tint button a requirement in NTSC television sets, and also originated the mocking interpretation of the acronym: Never Twice the Same Color
I know more than I want about color TV 
NTSC was the first system that allowed inserting the color in the existing black and white signal, without a lot of interference on black&white TV. The frequency was cristal derived, calculated exactly to "fit" the modulation products in the spectrum gaps of the B&W. Unfortunatelly, because US has one of the oldest TV systems, the bandwidth allowable for video was only 4MHz, therefore the color carrier needed to be low enough to allow for sidebands and in a precise relation to cancel the visibility - 3.579545MHz. The framerate was changed also from 60Hz to 59.94Hz to minimize further some errors. This was 1953.
After years of usage, some ideeas of improving the system apeared (mainly to improve the Over-The-Air quality, because Cable TV was not even in works). PAL was NTSC improved (by alternating the colour phase every line to cancel the propagation errors), carrier frequency was higher, at 4.43361875 MHz because the channels in Europe where wider, at 5.0 Mhz due to latter adoption of B&W TV (exception was UK, that in VHF had the first B&W transmissions, with lowest bandwith - UHF band was different and practially the oly one used in the end). Frame rate was lower than US (50 versus 60Hz). This was happening in 1967 in UK and Germany.
SECAM transmissions started in France in the same year (1967) - different system to block foreing stations to be received on a France TV set.
South American countries had originally US B&W equipment (adapted for 50Hz in some countries) and when they adopted colour, they kept some of the things identical, Brasil having the luxury to be able to introduce a PAL version of NTSC (same field rate, same carrier, but with alternating phase). This started in 1972 and was completed in 1977.
When are transmitted on cable, all the systems perform similary, because there are no "echoes" to correct (like over the air) and the colour phase alternation of PAL or SECAM is doing nothing more than just reducing the vertical colour resolution without a benefit.
NTSC was the first system that allowed inserting the color in the existing black and white signal, without a lot of interference on black&white TV. The frequency was cristal derived, calculated exactly to "fit" the modulation products in the spectrum gaps of the B&W. Unfortunatelly, because US has one of the oldest TV systems, the bandwidth allowable for video was only 4MHz, therefore the color carrier needed to be low enough to allow for sidebands and in a precise relation to cancel the visibility - 3.579545MHz. The framerate was changed also from 60Hz to 59.94Hz to minimize further some errors. This was 1953.
After years of usage, some ideeas of improving the system apeared (mainly to improve the Over-The-Air quality, because Cable TV was not even in works). PAL was NTSC improved (by alternating the colour phase every line to cancel the propagation errors), carrier frequency was higher, at 4.43361875 MHz because the channels in Europe where wider, at 5.0 Mhz due to latter adoption of B&W TV (exception was UK, that in VHF had the first B&W transmissions, with lowest bandwith - UHF band was different and practially the oly one used in the end). Frame rate was lower than US (50 versus 60Hz). This was happening in 1967 in UK and Germany.
SECAM transmissions started in France in the same year (1967) - different system to block foreing stations to be received on a France TV set.
South American countries had originally US B&W equipment (adapted for 50Hz in some countries) and when they adopted colour, they kept some of the things identical, Brasil having the luxury to be able to introduce a PAL version of NTSC (same field rate, same carrier, but with alternating phase). This started in 1972 and was completed in 1977.
When are transmitted on cable, all the systems perform similary, because there are no "echoes" to correct (like over the air) and the colour phase alternation of PAL or SECAM is doing nothing more than just reducing the vertical colour resolution without a benefit.
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Yeah and that phase problem was pretty much gone by 1970. When was the last time you changed 'tint' or 'hue'? The 'drift' problem was because of the transmission in Europe had some serious problems and an NTSC type system would have been a big problem. PAL changed the system so that a subcarier phase error became a saturation shift rather than a decoding angle (Hue) shift. On the flip side, it made editing in composite even more difficult than NTSC as your 'color frame' is now 4 frames in PAL vs 2 frames in NTSC. I'm glad it's pretty much gone as it was a challenge to make it all work reliably.
As for "PAL" playback in North America, you're likely talking DVD or BluRay which are not PAL or NTSC as they are component formats and have no subcarrier. At work we use Sony monitors in some of the bays and they had a problem 2 weeks back where the 26Hz frame rate video would not display. That model will NOT display 25Hz video even though it was receiving valid video. At our house we got a "PAL" DVD from my wife's friend in the UK. I selected the video standard in Windows XP in the TV computer and played stable flicker free video into the Samsung DLP set. The software in the PC was ATI MMC 9.14. I do NOT know if the TV was getting 25 or 30 Hz frame rate video but I did NOT see any frame conversion artifacts common in inexpensive standards converters. It's possible the video was actually 24 Hz frame rate. Hollywood uses this 'slow PAL' for mastering film to video. The 24 Hz video is played back 4% fast at 25Hz for the 25Hz frame rate countries and the magical 3:2 field replication is used for the 30Hz countries.
A word of caution if you want to play "PAL" vs "NTSC" DVDs in your PC. You can only change the drive settings 5 times before it locks you out and inhibits further changes. I'm told this info is stored in the DVD drive itself and cannot be reset. It might be possible - and certainly inexpensive - to simply install a second DVD drive and set one up for each frame rate. I do NOT know if this works as I haven't tried it nor do I know if the 25Hz/30Hz change will work with BluRay. FWIW the up res conversion in the PC - still running ATI MMC - is significantly better than the LG BluRay drive playing a std def DVD.
G²
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