I'm finally far enough along to post something. Scan 10f/8414 in the Blandas, along with Seas L16-SL sealed in the PE 0.25 cu ft cabinets. Nano-Digi is handling xover. A sub currently handles 100Hz and down, but I'm hoping to move that down once I can find time to measure and get a better amplification setup. (The Seas and sub xover are run through an HT receiver, and 100 is surprisingly the lowest you can set the xover.)
Really happy with the results despite the immature tuning.
Really happy with the results despite the immature tuning.
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Scan speak Discovery 10F is a 3". And it likes a small box (0.8 L for my miniOnken alignment)
dave
Great build !
Keep the thread updated, i'm really interested in your measurements. I did 1 pair with dayton's PS95-8 and 20cm bowls like yours.
Your project looks like a mini Elipson 4260 ;-)
Regards.
Hi again,
Find below a sketchup draw for my project with SB34NRX75-6 in 136.5L sealed box. I did not break-in my woofers yet, so final size may be smaller.
Medium is subject to change (currently Fostex FE166En). My pick list is :
- SB17NRX or maybe SB17MFC ;
- Seas CA18RLY (with linkwitz transform to fit 8L) ;
- Scan Speak 18W/4434 ;
- any other that fits 8L sealed, with good price/performance ratio
Tweeter is for future, with Scan Speak R3004/602010 as a good candidate.
Regards
Find below a sketchup draw for my project with SB34NRX75-6 in 136.5L sealed box. I did not break-in my woofers yet, so final size may be smaller.
Medium is subject to change (currently Fostex FE166En). My pick list is :
- SB17NRX or maybe SB17MFC ;
- Seas CA18RLY (with linkwitz transform to fit 8L) ;
- Scan Speak 18W/4434 ;
- any other that fits 8L sealed, with good price/performance ratio
Tweeter is for future, with Scan Speak R3004/602010 as a good candidate.
Regards
Attachments
Hi again,
Find below a sketchup draw for my project with SB34NRX75-6 in 136.5L sealed box. I did not break-in my woofers yet, so final size may be smaller.
Medium is subject to change (currently Fostex FE166En). My pick list is :
- SB17NRX or maybe SB17MFC ;
- Seas CA18RLY (with linkwitz transform to fit 8L) ;
- Scan Speak 18W/4434 ;
- any other that fits 8L sealed, with good price/performance ratio
Tweeter is for future, with Scan Speak R3004/602010 as a good candidate.
Regards
Damn nice construction and nice plan you've got. Of the suggested speakers I do not have any experience when it comes to SB but they should be great as those who started SB earlier worked for Scan-Speak. Therefore I beleive they should sound and be of similar high quality as S-S. I don't have experience of the mentioned Seas speaker nor the Scan-Speak speaker, but others.
Seas also makes speakers of very high quality but there are differences from S-S. Seas might have lower distorsion but even though they have good measurments they require a little more power, probably thats one reason. I have used different speakers from both S-S and Seas and I like them both. IMO I used to like S-S more since they play more lively, the sound is somehow released from the speaker compared to Seas that sounds more restrictive. Difficult to explain but thats my experience. However, lately I have com to like Seas a little more, not because they at first sounds boring but since the have very good control of the details and since they have good control of the music. The differences aren't big but there's just something ... it's just difficult to exactly put the finger on the difference. Personally I would go for the Seas CA18RLY that I beleive would fit good in the planned sealed box. The S-S 18W/4434G00 would most likely be able to create better low-mid bass output in a vented construction. I beleive Seas could sound more rapid and better in the planned sealed box and since you gonna have the SB in a closed box the bass will be handled anyway... again, depending on planned cross-over frequency.
The speakers are similar and I beleive you would be happy with any of them. However, theres a lot of user experiences on different forums from where you might find pros and cons with those speakers. Sorry for not just be able to tell you which one you should go for but there is something about how they sound and that's up to each one. My best tip is to find out more from tests and users.
I beleive it's difficult to find much better speakers in that price range.
Heres an interesting page describing the differences speaker Vas values:
QTS parameters How to Pick the Right speaker for your Speaker Cabinets
Another very intersting page where different speakers are tested/measured and compared: Zaph|Audio
The tweeter seems good, never used it myself. I have listened to Discovery R2604/833000 which is a cheaper ring radiator that sounds extremely good and balanced. Of course there are differences and the 602010 is a very good tweeter but is it worth it? They both perform equally (2kHz - 20 kHz). Besides that, the 833000 needs quite much less input to give same output. Distortion wise the 602010 is most likely better but I doubt you will hear the difference. Do you have possibility to listen to both?
In the end, it very much comes down to the filter construction which is as important as the speakers.
Very interesting project
Hello,
Thanks for your comments Bohusbusen.
I don't have the knowledge to design a passive filter, but I know how to setup a PC with a convolution engine and set crossovers, align phase and EQ. I bought 2/3 amps and multichannel soundcard to achieve this (to sum up i do active filtering).
From my investigations, it seems that any of the selected speakers may do the trick. It's not easy to compare speakers in such project. We need to guess from manufacturer's specs, some tools, and user reviews if any. I use the site belo (in french) to determine what we can do from a specific driver.
Catalogue simplifié haut-parleurs
Dominique Petoin did a fantastic work with this tool. You can even enter your own speakers T/S parameters to simulate and check what you can do (sealed, ported, ob, quarter wave...). Quite complete, easy to use, online.
For now, I don't know how good or bad the SB34 is on the 100-400 Hz range. I'll wait to build the box and test before deciding on the medium driver.
Regards
Thanks for your comments Bohusbusen.
I don't have the knowledge to design a passive filter, but I know how to setup a PC with a convolution engine and set crossovers, align phase and EQ. I bought 2/3 amps and multichannel soundcard to achieve this (to sum up i do active filtering).
From my investigations, it seems that any of the selected speakers may do the trick. It's not easy to compare speakers in such project. We need to guess from manufacturer's specs, some tools, and user reviews if any. I use the site belo (in french) to determine what we can do from a specific driver.
Catalogue simplifié haut-parleurs
Dominique Petoin did a fantastic work with this tool. You can even enter your own speakers T/S parameters to simulate and check what you can do (sealed, ported, ob, quarter wave...). Quite complete, easy to use, online.
For now, I don't know how good or bad the SB34 is on the 100-400 Hz range. I'll wait to build the box and test before deciding on the medium driver.
Regards
Well this is my design for the medium size bowls, I have upgraded the stand with a wireless charger and a extra usb port for another phone/tablet/...
This is for the front unit, as I want to build a 5.1... I'm still undecided about medium size or small size bowls.
The back unit will have a floor stand, currently checking design for that.
This is just a test build (the red pins were just untill the glue dries), as I will order new speakers
This is for the front unit, as I want to build a 5.1... I'm still undecided about medium size or small size bowls.
The back unit will have a floor stand, currently checking design for that.
This is just a test build (the red pins were just untill the glue dries), as I will order new speakers
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Hello,
Nice build! I love your stands.
What speaker did you use ?
From my experience, 28cm bowls will give you more internal volume and as such more options to select the right driver to go down to 100-150Hz (6" or 6"5) = easier to cross with a sub. It also depends how far from your speakers you will be listening, the room's size...
Sticking with 20cm bowls means choosing a smaller driver and crossing higher in frequency with the sub (smth like 250-400Hz). While the first point is not necessary a bad thing (better high-mids and dispersion) the last one is more problematic IMO.
I recently upgraded to satori MW16p-4, sealed with 28cm bowls. Amazing. Crossed with SS R3004 and soon with SB34NRX for the bass duties.
Regards
Nice build! I love your stands.
What speaker did you use ?
From my experience, 28cm bowls will give you more internal volume and as such more options to select the right driver to go down to 100-150Hz (6" or 6"5) = easier to cross with a sub. It also depends how far from your speakers you will be listening, the room's size...
Sticking with 20cm bowls means choosing a smaller driver and crossing higher in frequency with the sub (smth like 250-400Hz). While the first point is not necessary a bad thing (better high-mids and dispersion) the last one is more problematic IMO.
I recently upgraded to satori MW16p-4, sealed with 28cm bowls. Amazing. Crossed with SS R3004 and soon with SB34NRX for the bass duties.
Regards
thanks, it's nice to hear ;-)
Currently I'm just using some speakers from my old 5.1 Creative PC set, as this is just my testbuild (cambridge soundworks 4ohm)
I made a small and a medium size with the speakers, because for me the 28cm bowls are too big. But to be fair I didn't hear that much of a difference in volume or sound when I hear them together (or I'm really getting old)
As for the speakers, I'm thinking of buying the Dayton Audio RS100-8 4".
The sub woofers gonna be a Dayton Audio RS225-8 8" (as I don't want a too big of a box) I made another threat for some suggestions...
The room is 4m x 8m. I'm gonna be sitting 3.5m from my TV and the front speakers, the back one's are gonna be behind the sofa.
Currently I'm just using some speakers from my old 5.1 Creative PC set, as this is just my testbuild (cambridge soundworks 4ohm)
I made a small and a medium size with the speakers, because for me the 28cm bowls are too big. But to be fair I didn't hear that much of a difference in volume or sound when I hear them together (or I'm really getting old
)As for the speakers, I'm thinking of buying the Dayton Audio RS100-8 4".
The sub woofers gonna be a Dayton Audio RS225-8 8" (as I don't want a too big of a box) I made another threat for some suggestions...
The room is 4m x 8m. I'm gonna be sitting 3.5m from my TV and the front speakers, the back one's are gonna be behind the sofa.
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Nice choice with Dayton.
I did a 20cm bowl with PS95-4. Good results, but needs correction because high mids are forward. I own a rs100-8 for tv, but never tried that in a bowl. Quite good in 4L. My room is a little larger and i'm 4m away from tv. You will get better highs with ps95, but if room is not "easy" (reverb), stick with rs100. How to you plan to crossover with sub ? HT receiver, passive or active ?
I would recommand a minidsp to crossover and make corrections for your project.
If going active, the RS225 is ok in 40L vented from dayton's specs to reach bessel.
Regards;-)
I did a 20cm bowl with PS95-4. Good results, but needs correction because high mids are forward. I own a rs100-8 for tv, but never tried that in a bowl. Quite good in 4L. My room is a little larger and i'm 4m away from tv. You will get better highs with ps95, but if room is not "easy" (reverb), stick with rs100. How to you plan to crossover with sub ? HT receiver, passive or active ?
I would recommand a minidsp to crossover and make corrections for your project.
If going active, the RS225 is ok in 40L vented from dayton's specs to reach bessel.
Regards;-)
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Well right now I'm still looking on how to do my design and my plan was to hook everything up on a HT receiver (wich I also have to buy). The sub has to be an active one, from what I have found on the internet... so when I have more time I will check out on how I will create a sub or remodel an excisting sub.
Are you happy with the rs-100-8? are is it better that I'm looking at something else?
Ps: This is a testbuild for my stand of the rear speakers
Are you happy with the rs-100-8? are is it better that I'm looking at something else?
Ps: This is a testbuild for my stand of the rear speakers
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You have won the million dollar question ;-)
I'm going to slim the shoulder down to the plate next time, but right now I wanted to see the design in full... and I like it. (currently I just made a channel for the speaker cable at the back)
On the plus side, if a burgler breaks into my house... I just take my speakers and take a swing at him :-D
Hiya. Something that may assist another . . .
Saw these in WalMart yesterday, on End-Of-Summer Clearance for $5.
Interior is glassy, exterior is matte.
Thump test to hollow container was satisfactory, as is, with no disqualifying ring/ping.
http://www.amazon.com/gp/aw/d/B01JZ...+top+torch&dpPl=1&dpID=41aKMufQ7wL&ref=plSrch
Saw these in WalMart yesterday, on End-Of-Summer Clearance for $5.
Interior is glassy, exterior is matte.
Thump test to hollow container was satisfactory, as is, with no disqualifying ring/ping.
http://www.amazon.com/gp/aw/d/B01JZ...+top+torch&dpPl=1&dpID=41aKMufQ7wL&ref=plSrch
Oke, build is as good as done
I'm very pleased with the PS-95, I have used these parts for the baffle step.
Resistor
CERAMIC RESISTOR 10 W 3,3 OHM
Coil
SP 0,82 mH / 1,0 mm
Height 18 mm
Diameter 48 mm
Wire diameter 1,0 mm
Internal resistance 0,4 Ohm
I'm very pleased with the PS-95, I have used these parts for the baffle step.
Resistor
CERAMIC RESISTOR 10 W 3,3 OHM
Coil
SP 0,82 mH / 1,0 mm
Height 18 mm
Diameter 48 mm
Wire diameter 1,0 mm
Internal resistance 0,4 Ohm
Attachments
Thanks for the nice words Ear Wax, I've been using them for a month now and mostly for some background music. For me they sound really good and I'm happy with my investment
But when I'm watching some TV my eye's still drift away sometimes to check them out (And I'm like, How you doin ;-)) I did receive the comment 2 times now that the fronts look like Boobs, not that I'm complaining as a guy but there was probably some sigmund freud psyche going on when I was designing them ;-p
But when I'm watching some TV my eye's still drift away sometimes to check them out (And I'm like, How you doin ;-)) I did receive the comment 2 times now that the fronts look like Boobs, not that I'm complaining as a guy but there was probably some sigmund freud psyche going on when I was designing them ;-p
Project failed
Ok, to be fair, I've gave up this project. Even though it sounded quite good at first, those bowls are to small for the 8545 in a vented enclosure. Maybe they would sound better in a closed version but those speakers are made and plays better in a vented version. So instead of finding/building bigger bowls I have decided to make use for them in a new design for the 8545! I bought a house and building a wall inside for my TV corner where those will be built in as front speakers as well as for the center (got one extra 8545) - "in-wall" which gonna be intersting to find out how that will be soundwise.
The surround speakers will still be the four 20 cm with Seas that I'm really satisfied with. and maybe there will be four more for the roof (atmos) since the spread the sound quite well but that must be more tested and measured first.
I have also started to build a transmission line subwoofer in the wall to complement with the deepest frequencies (tuned to 24 Hz) but that belongs to another forum.
To summarize, don't try to use to small enclosures than the speaker was aimed for. Even if it's possible to tweak it to a certain extent it will never be as good as it could be. So, I've tried it so you won't have to
Ok, to be fair, I've gave up this project. Even though it sounded quite good at first, those bowls are to small for the 8545 in a vented enclosure. Maybe they would sound better in a closed version but those speakers are made and plays better in a vented version. So instead of finding/building bigger bowls I have decided to make use for them in a new design for the 8545! I bought a house and building a wall inside for my TV corner where those will be built in as front speakers as well as for the center (got one extra 8545
) - "in-wall" which gonna be intersting to find out how that will be soundwise. The surround speakers will still be the four 20 cm with Seas that I'm really satisfied with. and maybe there will be four more for the roof (atmos) since the spread the sound quite well but that must be more tested and measured first.
I have also started to build a transmission line subwoofer in the wall to complement with the deepest frequencies (tuned to 24 Hz) but that belongs to another forum.
To summarize, don't try to use to small enclosures than the speaker was aimed for. Even if it's possible to tweak it to a certain extent it will never be as good as it could be. So, I've tried it so you won't have to