If you connect a dual mono NC400 build up to the analog outs on a MacBook Pro, it's going to sound much different than if connected to the analog outputs of a MSB select DAC.
You'll likely find those who walk away from NC400's are folks who simply don't like the sound of their source gear, so they blame it on the amps for being too transparent.
Slew rate/bandwidth and feedback structure will have an effect, as well as noise characteristics of the input stages.
What causes these differences in integrated on a die vs assembled on a board?
Size and tolerance of devices? I assume even the actives differ significantly in their topology between vlsi vs discrete and hence characteristics?
Also if they have comparable freq response and noise measurements, are they likely to sound different? I understand that can be subjective.
I am just trying to get an idea. Designing with the best opamps would arguably be simpler than getting a good discrete right.
What kind of differences? Anything that can be concretely described or/and measured?
I dont quite get airy, wide and deep, warm and cold.
Opamps are something you just have to listen to. That's all there is to it.
There's many threads out there on opamp rolling. Just google "opamp rolling".
One important thing is simply physical layout and size. An IC has much smaller components with shorter connections.
But we also aren't comparing different layouts of the same circuit. Transistors are cheap in an IC, but a discrete buffer would only have the minimal amount of transistors needed for the basic functionality - so very different circuits.
At a minimum, distortion measurements (THD and IM) are pretty important too.
A lot of opamp rolling is based on the rather misguided belief that many opamps are mutually interchangeable in a given circuit. What people don't understand is that most circuits are designed for a specific opamp.
hypex ncore
I guess if the end result is a sound that the roller finds more enjoyable, than it was worthwhile. At the end of the day we do listen with our ears.
I guess if the end result is a sound that the roller finds more enjoyable, than it was worthwhile. At the end of the day we do listen with our ears.
Sure. But as I keep saying, a graphic equalizer (maybe combined with a compressor and distortion effect) would be a much more flexible method to achieve that.
I am getting a bit confused I have not built the NC400 dual mono yet so I have the choice between this and an NC500 built amp from the guy thats selling for £999.00 which is a very good price.
But which will sound best I should add that I would prefer the one with the warmest sound but which one would that be.
But which will sound best I should add that I would prefer the one with the warmest sound but which one would that be.
"Warm" usually means slightly emphasized mid range and/or rolling off treble, often combined with low-order harmonic distortion and some compression. That is best achieved in a preamp. If that is what you want, I don't think it really matters if you pick nc400 or nc500 - both will be neutral enough so that you can add warmth using DSP or an EQ box (or something like VintageWarmer2.
hypex ncore
If you want some true advice from someone with experience with both amps, I'll tell you what to do to achieve sound beyond the level your even hoping to achieve. Best part is it can be done for dirt chip, as well as support the DIY community.
1: Buy Sonny's DAC with Discrete output stage and preamp board.
http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/showthread.php?t=274456
2: Buy Boggit's NC 500 monoblocks.
3: Once Boggit's monoblocks arrive, open up the case and solder the little jumper for the onboard buffer stage to the buffer bypass position.
4: Connect the Diff outs from the preamp, to the input buffer board diff inputs.
5: Enjoy an integrated DAC/pre/amp combo that will put $15000 units to shame.
If you want to take it up another level, swap the adapter boards IC voltage regs to the HxR units.
That's all the advice anybody needs for a while. Trust me.
If you want some true advice from someone with experience with both amps, I'll tell you what to do to achieve sound beyond the level your even hoping to achieve. Best part is it can be done for dirt chip, as well as support the DIY community.
1: Buy Sonny's DAC with Discrete output stage and preamp board.
http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/showthread.php?t=274456
2: Buy Boggit's NC 500 monoblocks.
3: Once Boggit's monoblocks arrive, open up the case and solder the little jumper for the onboard buffer stage to the buffer bypass position.
4: Connect the Diff outs from the preamp, to the input buffer board diff inputs.
5: Enjoy an integrated DAC/pre/amp combo that will put $15000 units to shame.
If you want to take it up another level, swap the adapter boards IC voltage regs to the HxR units.
That's all the advice anybody needs for a while. Trust me.
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While I have no reason to suspect the system you are suggesting wouldn't be excellent, I am just curious to hear what made you pick that specific DAC/preamp, what others you have compared it to (and how), and how you have verified that it is OK driving the non-buffered nc500?
If you want some true advice from someone with experience with both amps, I'll tell you what to do to achieve sound beyond the level your even hoping to achieve. Best part is it can be done for dirt chip, as well as support the DIY community.
1: Buy Sonny's DAC with Discrete output stage and preamp board.
AK4490 USB Dac with dsd support. - diyAudio
2: Buy Boggit's NC 500 monoblocks.
3: Once Boggit's monoblocks arrive, open up the case and solder the little jumper for the onboard buffer stage to the buffer bypass position.
Interesting but I have the Audiolab CDQ8200 CD/DAC so dont really want another DAC.
4: Connect the Diff outs from the preamp, to the input buffer board diff inputs.
5: Enjoy an integrated DAC/pre/amp combo that will put $15000 units to shame.
If you want to take it up another level, swap the adapter boards IC voltage regs to the HxR units.
That's all the advice anybody needs for a while. Trust me.
Interesting but I already have the Audiolab CDQ8200 CD/DAC/Pre Amp.
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