Hey everyone, I'm back with a new big project!!!

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chops

chops

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Joined 2003
charlest.zenfolio.com/
Alright, after doing a little more research, I have decided to again go with a pro amplifier instead of the plate amps. Like someone else said here, most sub amps have a high-pass filter around 15 or 20Hz, and that stinks.

So I have found the Behringer Europower EP2500 amp, which B&H Photo sells for $299 and is an exact clone to QSC's RMX series amps which I was planning on buying to begin with. The Behringer actually has more power, has good reviews, and is nearly half the $$$.

Check out these two links....

Behringer EP2500

QSC RMX Series
 
BassAwdyO

BassAwdyO

Member
Joined 2004
most sub amps have a high-pass filter around 15 or 20Hz
Click to expand...

Most pro amps have a high pass filter around 30-50hz!

Those 9mm Xmax 1000watt 96db@1w Pro subs are going to run out of excursion VERY quickly!

I dont believe a rumble filter is terribly difficult to modify however... I was actually thinking of starting a thread about doing just that!
 
bossobass

bossobass

Member
Joined 2005
The QSC RMX series amps have a DC protection HP at 5 Hz.

The 30 Hz HP is selectable on/off on the back panel.

Adire's ADA amps have a DC protection HP at 2 Hz.

Not familiar with the Behringer amp, and not generally a fan of their products to begin with.

We need to organize some sort of 'Amps for subs' list of info, or, better yet, a shootout that includes subjective listening. It would be great to have a quick reference for the specs/features/sound of all plate and pro amps.

Bosso
 
B

BAM

Member
Joined 2001
optionalnecessity.tripod.com
Actually, the Europower is not an exact clone. Several key components (including the transformer and power supply section) are de-rated in order to save on manufacturing costs. As a matter of principle I don't buy Behringer stuff if it can be avoided, because they are riding along on someone else's engineering. Chinese companies like them take money away from the American companies like QSC that are actually doing the engineering.
 
chops

chops

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Joined 2003
charlest.zenfolio.com/
I honestly don't care about all of the political crap and I don't want to see this thread turning bad because of it. And I AM NOT going to get into an argument over it either.

I have used Behringer products for years and have never had a problem with them, even if they are using other people's technology. Who isn't these days?!

Anyway, it's HP is at 5Hz, well below what I'll be asking from it, and more than enough power that what I'll need.

I don't have loads of money to spend so I get the best I can afford. Behringer has done me well for years now so I see no reason to quit using them, no matter what anyone says. Not to mention I can get this amp at cost through my brother's store, which is even more of a reason to buy it.
 
P

phase_accurate

Member
Joined 2002
Although Behringer stuff is most probably made in China - it is a German company.
I think there are many American companies as well that manufacture in China. I think this is more endangering for the local workforce than "stealing" some enginnering.

I didn't understand all the fuss about cheap imported clothes from China last summer - when almost 100% of strategic products like American brand PCs are already made in China !!!!!

O.K. back to topic.

Regards

Charles
 
owdi

owdi

Member
Joined 2003
Some general PR advice:

Typically your PRs should be able to sweep twice the volume as your woofers. This requirement can go up to 3x with a large box. WinISD pro is free and can be used to model this. You can mess around with mass loading, and see a PR excursion / frequency chart.

Passive radiators shake boxes, it's a good idea to use two PRs per speaker, and have them face opposite directions. Better yet, use two smaller woofers facing opposite directions with two PRs facing opposite directions.

Dan
 
chops

chops

Member
Joined 2003
charlest.zenfolio.com/
owdi said:
Some general PR advice:

Typically your PRs should be able to sweep twice the volume as your woofers. This requirement can go up to 3x with a large box. WinISD pro is free and can be used to model this. You can mess around with mass loading, and see a PR excursion / frequency chart.

Passive radiators shake boxes, it's a good idea to use two PRs per speaker, and have them face opposite directions. Better yet, use two smaller woofers facing opposite directions with two PRs facing opposite directions.

Dan
Click to expand...

I've been thinking about that a little bit, as far as "shake" is concerned. However, I WILL be mounting both enclosures on one common base plate, and they will also have one common top plate.

Anyway, I ran a few more numbers for using 2 PRs and a smaller 7 cu.ft. enclosure. Some of the results actually turned out better, especially group delay.

The 9 cu.ft. design with 3 PRs is tuned to 17Hz and the 7 cu.ft. design with 2 PRs is tuned to 16Hz.

Here's a couple pics of the actual WinISD Pro charts....

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An externally hosted image should be here but it was not working when we last tested it.
 
kingdaddy

kingdaddy

Member
Joined 2002
geocities.com/kingdaddykeith/Kingdaddys_DIY_Projects.html?1078331
owdi said:
Some general PR advice:

Typically your PRs should be able to sweep twice the volume as your woofers. This requirement can go up to 3x with a large box. WinISD pro is free and can be used to model this. You can mess around with mass loading, and see a PR excursion / frequency chart.

Passive radiators shake boxes, it's a good idea to use two PRs per speaker, and have them face opposite directions. Better yet, use two smaller woofers facing opposite directions with two PRs facing opposite directions.

Dan
Click to expand...

Very good advice, I agree. Vibration is an ugly form of distortion.
 
chops

chops

Member
Joined 2003
charlest.zenfolio.com/
I think "shake" will not be a problem in my design since both sub enclosures will share one common top plate and bottom plate, plus I'll be using a single layer of that softer rubber non-slip padding between the unit and the floor. Not to mention that the entire unit with everything mounted including the center channel and sub amp should be running close to 400 lbs! It's going to take a Mack truck just to move the thing. LOL :D

Anyway.....

Any suggestions on an amp for my subs?

I'm looking for at LEAST 400 watts per sub at 4 ohms, preferably 600W @ 4 ohms. It doesn't need a subsonic filter, but if it comes with one, I would like it right at or below the tuning freq of the sub (16Hz), or if it's adjustable, even better. And it does not need a crossover either as my receiver has an adjustable crossover built in. I would also like the price to stay at $400 or less.

Thanks! :)
 
kingdaddy

kingdaddy

Member
Joined 2002
geocities.com/kingdaddykeith/Kingdaddys_DIY_Projects.html?1078331
chops said:


Any suggestions on an amp for my subs?

I'm looking for at LEAST 400 watts per sub at 4 ohms, preferably 600W @ 4 ohms. It doesn't need a subsonic filter, but if it comes with one, I would like it right at or below the tuning freq of the sub (16Hz), or if it's adjustable, even better. And it does not need a crossover either as my receiver has an adjustable crossover built in. I would also like the price to stay at $400 or less.

Thanks! :)
Click to expand...

I like the Mackie 1400i, it has all the bells and whistles and much lower distortion then any pro amp for the price. In addition, it will do a 2-ohm load if you ever need that.

http://www.zzounds.com/item--MACM1400I
 
chops

chops

Member
Joined 2003
charlest.zenfolio.com/
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