You got that right JJ, no more antifeedback switch, I think that might be the main culprit, but I know it is not the only reason, as I tested the limits again, and sure enough (with the antifeedback switch off) if I go up to 9 or 9-1/2 it will shut down. I don't want to play that loud anyway, it does not sound good at that level, so I guess I can say I want it to shut down automatically at that level, all good.
I know what is happening now, I can control it to a great degree, and I can get back rocking quickly, so I feel much better about this. I can' t really say I have it 100% figured out, but 95% is still an "A", I will take it!
Since that is really the last bugaboo that was getting me, I can honestly say I am ready, finally, how many years did it take?
I did not get a second call from the recording studio yet, so I sent them my Patent and all my PPT info, hopefully it will go to a engineer that likes this sort of thing. I don't want to get a guy that usually does rap, and they do a lot of that. If that is your thing, that is cool, just not mine.
House to myself for an afternoon Jam session tonight. I have Little Martha down now, know all the cords, finger picking, changes. I love the final open E chord with a harmonic on every string, basically a harmonic chord one string at a time. I love that sound. When you play that and put your ear up to the sound hole, man the inside of the guitar is just bursting with sound, really shows how much sound is inside the guitar also and wants to "come out" so to speak.
I wonder when I will be able to play Little Martha and sound like Duane Allman or Dickey Betts. I know when, NEVER! Man do I love their playing, such an inspiration to me, and many people! You just can't play a song on the electric guitar and have it sound like that, not possible.
Can't remember if I shared this, there is a guy on YouTube that wants to know how much the body of a solid body electric guitar shapes the sound. I can tell you for sure, not much. He has strings going from one 2x4 to another with a pickup only underneath. Playing slide, it sounds pretty much like an electric guitar.
The body of an acoustic instrument means everything! Get as much sound from the instrument itself as possible. Why make an acoustic guitar sound more electric, by using an amp only, with just speaker or two in a cabinet? Put some drivers and horns inside the guitar and let her rip!
I know what is happening now, I can control it to a great degree, and I can get back rocking quickly, so I feel much better about this. I can' t really say I have it 100% figured out, but 95% is still an "A", I will take it!
Since that is really the last bugaboo that was getting me, I can honestly say I am ready, finally, how many years did it take?
I did not get a second call from the recording studio yet, so I sent them my Patent and all my PPT info, hopefully it will go to a engineer that likes this sort of thing. I don't want to get a guy that usually does rap, and they do a lot of that. If that is your thing, that is cool, just not mine.
House to myself for an afternoon Jam session tonight. I have Little Martha down now, know all the cords, finger picking, changes. I love the final open E chord with a harmonic on every string, basically a harmonic chord one string at a time. I love that sound. When you play that and put your ear up to the sound hole, man the inside of the guitar is just bursting with sound, really shows how much sound is inside the guitar also and wants to "come out" so to speak.
I wonder when I will be able to play Little Martha and sound like Duane Allman or Dickey Betts. I know when, NEVER! Man do I love their playing, such an inspiration to me, and many people! You just can't play a song on the electric guitar and have it sound like that, not possible.
Can't remember if I shared this, there is a guy on YouTube that wants to know how much the body of a solid body electric guitar shapes the sound. I can tell you for sure, not much. He has strings going from one 2x4 to another with a pickup only underneath. Playing slide, it sounds pretty much like an electric guitar.
The body of an acoustic instrument means everything! Get as much sound from the instrument itself as possible. Why make an acoustic guitar sound more electric, by using an amp only, with just speaker or two in a cabinet? Put some drivers and horns inside the guitar and let her rip!
Last night I played a few tunes at the open mic. The sound guy - meaning well and doing a good job accommodating everyone - didnt seem to understand when I asked for a little "wet" on my vocal. John Lennon 50's slap back was what I was wanting (Phil Spector would have known what to do) - couldnt do it apparently. I noticed all night everyones vocal was bone dry. I tried to joke about it, saying it was like I'm bare naked up here, or like driving a car with no mirrors...
It was just me and a nylon string Suzuki I picked up at the thrift store up the road for $50. I didnt even change the strings - they were black from oxidation. S.I.T. and didnt break during my playing "Seeds 'n Stems blues", "Solitary Man", "Circle Game". Pretty meh performances on my part, but a lot of folks bit off more than they could chew last night. I'm not going to get up there and try to pull off Rush's "Time Stand Still" which I've been working on for a couple weeks. You just cant go from imagination to performance of something like that in that short a time. I'll have to do "City of New Orleans" with the resident bass player, which I can actually make it through.
My solution which I'll bring going forward is my vocal reverberant guitar. Vocal picked up by my own "private" headset mic -> reverb echo effect -> amp -> exciter driver mounted to the inside of the guitar's back. Not just anywhere, in just the right spot - or best as I can find in limited research.
So with the same mic arrangement provided last night - one for vocal, one for guitar - I can get my own vocal effects radiating from the guitar body - which to me makes it much easier to sing. Sort of if you can hear where you've been, it easier to get to where you're going kind of thing. Or the slight delay allows for something about the pitch I'm trying to hit to more easily brain register. I bet this is a known phenomena. Art?
Of course, your guitar could be arranged to do the same thing. Another conceptual split possibility between those two horns; one for the guitar, one for vocals. Busking at the bus station, no speaker box to carry.
It was just me and a nylon string Suzuki I picked up at the thrift store up the road for $50. I didnt even change the strings - they were black from oxidation. S.I.T. and didnt break during my playing "Seeds 'n Stems blues", "Solitary Man", "Circle Game". Pretty meh performances on my part, but a lot of folks bit off more than they could chew last night. I'm not going to get up there and try to pull off Rush's "Time Stand Still" which I've been working on for a couple weeks. You just cant go from imagination to performance of something like that in that short a time. I'll have to do "City of New Orleans" with the resident bass player, which I can actually make it through.
My solution which I'll bring going forward is my vocal reverberant guitar. Vocal picked up by my own "private" headset mic -> reverb echo effect -> amp -> exciter driver mounted to the inside of the guitar's back. Not just anywhere, in just the right spot - or best as I can find in limited research.
So with the same mic arrangement provided last night - one for vocal, one for guitar - I can get my own vocal effects radiating from the guitar body - which to me makes it much easier to sing. Sort of if you can hear where you've been, it easier to get to where you're going kind of thing. Or the slight delay allows for something about the pitch I'm trying to hit to more easily brain register. I bet this is a known phenomena. Art?
Of course, your guitar could be arranged to do the same thing. Another conceptual split possibility between those two horns; one for the guitar, one for vocals. Busking at the bus station, no speaker box to carry.
Great on the open mic JJ! Personally I am usually disappointed with open mics, I have not done one in decades. I love doing a random jam with friends, so much better. A few acoustic guitars, and if people that can actually sing in two or three part harmony, so much fun.
What you call wet, I call fat, pretty much the same thing, I get it, bad sound can really be a downer.
That said, anything live is really great, so much fun, so improvisational, so chill, so nerve racking. Gets the blood flowing! Keep it up brother!
Today I jammed with great joy, house to myself, in a big room. With the anti feedback switch off, I play on 7, great. I go to 8, really rocking on the right song. Go to 8-1/2, be careful, but it does work, and rocks. I can feel some good sustain, which to me is the beginning of feedback, but not there. No limiter circuit problems. Now 9, I do not dare, because it might not happen right away, but it will shut down, to damn bombastic for my guitar horns anyway.
I passed the laugh test twice today. I played the guitar acoustically, then turned it on at 8-1/2, BAM what a difference, this makes me laugh out loud! Then after jamming, turn the drivers off and keep playing, BAM what a difference, sounds so lame, laughing again!
What you call wet, I call fat, pretty much the same thing, I get it, bad sound can really be a downer.
That said, anything live is really great, so much fun, so improvisational, so chill, so nerve racking. Gets the blood flowing! Keep it up brother!
Today I jammed with great joy, house to myself, in a big room. With the anti feedback switch off, I play on 7, great. I go to 8, really rocking on the right song. Go to 8-1/2, be careful, but it does work, and rocks. I can feel some good sustain, which to me is the beginning of feedback, but not there. No limiter circuit problems. Now 9, I do not dare, because it might not happen right away, but it will shut down, to damn bombastic for my guitar horns anyway.
I passed the laugh test twice today. I played the guitar acoustically, then turned it on at 8-1/2, BAM what a difference, this makes me laugh out loud! Then after jamming, turn the drivers off and keep playing, BAM what a difference, sounds so lame, laughing again!
I think you have a good excuse to try again. "Hey, maybe that guy with the horn guitar will show up tonight". If you can video some good performances and responses, that (up on YT) would help sell your invention. Live is what's real. Someone would see it and imagine what they could do "up there" with that instrument.
I'd just like to do something before the arthritis moving through my left hand takes the opportunity away. Now it's in the index finger. Same card Alex Lifeson pulled to get Rush back on the road, according to the documentary. It's good to have a goal like "I'll go do the 6 - 9:00 open mic every Friday". I'm so lucky they have something like that, right down the road from where I live.
I did the Jamulus thing with my son last night. Worked like a charm!
Joe K thinks "wet" is "fat", which most "sound guys" would equate with more bass or low mid harmonics which a "thin" sound would lack.
"Wet" does not have any universal meaning, though it was usually associated with reverb rather than echo. Phil Spector may have increased the wet/dry ratio between the echo chamber and your voice, but the echo chambers he used did not have a "slap back" echo, they had a reverberant sound without discreet echo, and were applied during the mix down, not during the recording process.
If you want an effect on your voice or guitar the time to discuss it is before you are on stage- "wet" could mean anything from a spring, plate, or cathedral reverb to a 50ms "slap back", a 2 second "canyon echo" or even phase shifting.
The sound guy may have any of those, few or no effects available, and application of any inappropriate or obvious ("wet") effects can totally throw a performer off.
The "singing in the shower" phenomenon can give a singer more confidence and hide pitch problems.
Putting the vocal reverb through your guitar may work fine to you at home, but will sound hokey when the guitar is miced up- a washy vocal reverb mixed in with the guitar will not be possible to "fix in the mix".
There's that - singing against the blow dryer works too. I was just wondering if, in your experience, any singer has 'wanted' a little reverb or delay along side their voice, to sing better? Or are all stage monitors "dry" by definition and in the sound reinforcement business it would be unheard of to put any such effect there. Most mixers I've seen dont give you that opportunity.
Perhaps it's just my brain that does this, but if I can hear my own voice some 10s of milliseconds later, it just feels easier, more comfortable.
I bought a cheap "Donner" pitch shifter. That does the opposite, confuses me as to which pitch is me and I lose the ability to sing at all. It even has a bit of delay while it figures things out before making a sound. When it comes on in the mix, it's like my vocal control loop gets hooked to the wrong input. I suppose, like anything, with practice (and a volume pedal to swell that 5th harmonic here and there)...
The nylon guitar I have that system in is the tubbiest sounding guitar I have; the steel string one is much less so. My fingers arent up to steel yet. Hopefully I can work it out somehow without harassing the sound guy too badly. (I've already presented him with a guitar having a low-Z output, which wrecked his wireless 1/4" TS module he's using for everyone. Got my own board channel.)
Some sound mixers (engineers) don't know how to mix effects, so may not give you the opportunity to hear them.
Some mixing consoles have no effects- if you asked the sound guy to provide some "wet" sound you might as well have asked him to give you more clothes or mirrors for your car. Before asking for something on stage you should find out what is available.
Most mixing consoles have multiple auxiliary (aux) sends that can be routed to individually to effects and monitors.
The return from the effects (whether built in or outboard) can be routed independently to front of house and stage monitors.
Any wet/dry ratio desired can be independently mixed in front of house or stage monitors.
Most singers want a little reverb or delay with their voice to "sound" better, not sing better.
Usually the effects used in the front of house are more than enough to be heard on stage, the stage monitors are used to hear their voice over the room's reverberant level and other instruments stage volume.
There are exceptions when effects are beat matched or such a part of the sound (distortion) where the effect is needed for the vocal performance.
I would never put effects in the stage monitors unless requested by the performer.
With in ear monitors, the house sound is blocked, so performers often do ask to hear both the effect and some of the room sound.
Some mixing consoles have no effects- if you asked the sound guy to provide some "wet" sound you might as well have asked him to give you more clothes or mirrors for your car. Before asking for something on stage you should find out what is available.
Most mixing consoles have multiple auxiliary (aux) sends that can be routed to individually to effects and monitors.
The return from the effects (whether built in or outboard) can be routed independently to front of house and stage monitors.
Any wet/dry ratio desired can be independently mixed in front of house or stage monitors.
Most singers want a little reverb or delay with their voice to "sound" better, not sing better.
Usually the effects used in the front of house are more than enough to be heard on stage, the stage monitors are used to hear their voice over the room's reverberant level and other instruments stage volume.
There are exceptions when effects are beat matched or such a part of the sound (distortion) where the effect is needed for the vocal performance.
I would never put effects in the stage monitors unless requested by the performer.
With in ear monitors, the house sound is blocked, so performers often do ask to hear both the effect and some of the room sound.
Ok, thanks - appreciate your response. He has some Behringer mixer and it's not a QX, a model which has the "Klark-Teknik" effects built in. Perhaps I'll end up with my own "pedal board" handling my guitar and vocal, dialed up how I want. Another player had such, with a giant tote he dropped it into. Ugh, more to carry besides just the guitar...
Now back to our regular FHAG program.
I recorded Little Martha on my iPhone, I just don't think the recording sounds that good. Then I play it again on my guitar, yeah that does not sound the same. I am very happy with the guitar, and this is just on a low end Martin in a hotel. Plus the earlier recordings I sent, I thought were OK, nothing to write home about. It just does not capture the great guitar sound.
I am sure some of it is operator error, but man I don't think an iPhone cuts it, even a new one. I need a professional studio with an engineer. I need help!
So I do have that setup for January as I noted before, me thinks the results will be much better!
I am sure some of it is operator error, but man I don't think an iPhone cuts it, even a new one. I need a professional studio with an engineer. I need help!
So I do have that setup for January as I noted before, me thinks the results will be much better!
It may be that the mic in that phone is equalized for voice calls... I know the spectrum analyzer apps can "bypass" the Apple mic equalization somehow; unsure if whatever app used to make the audio recording does this. Unsure if some external plug-in mic for iphone would be another way to bypass that EQ.
What's you're equipment list? I know you have a laptop, a USB measurement mic, the Roland amp. There must be more. If you have your laptop when you go off on business, maybe bring the measurement mic along with? No someone's EQ on that - flat. I think you could set it on a pad (folded towel), out on the floor in front of you. Not too hard to try; see if the result beats the iphone.
Most Windows PCs will make an audio recording easy enough. Audacity is pretty easy to use. Wouldnt be surprised in REW can record the audio stream from the mic too.
Hotels have lobbies, courtyards and larger spaces than a std room. Maybe sneak into one of the bigger, empty for the moment conference rooms - setup, done and out before anyone notices!
Art - I have questions for you specifically, if you would be so kind to share your knowledge again. I am losing track of how many times you have done this!
I am asking because I want to market my guitar through my YouTube video, but I want to be accurate. Some marketing I have seen is total ********. Some products stand on their own and does not need this. I hope my guitar is in this group.
Obviously most of a YouTube audience is quite different from diyAudio people. Are these statements correct:
"Folded Horns have much greater efficiency, so they generate more power with less wattage, with less distortion". (I know this is true).
"Folded horns can make small full range speakers sound like larger speakers". (My iPhone test where the bass dB increases by 25 dB horns uncovered vs. covered suggests this is true, I can sure hear it).
"Folded Horns Improve Tone". (I get much greater lows and highs shown in REW, and I can hear it very easily).
"Folded Horns help waves develop before they bounce off walls". (Definitely not sure about this one).
"Folded Horns provide directivity". (I know this is true, but not sure it applies to my guitar all that much).
"Folded Horns need to follow the 1/4 wavelength rule to be effective". (I think this is true? Sure seems to work for my guitar).
I have attached my updated YouTube plan, would like to hear from everybody about this, if you are so inclined.
I also attached my "Yellow Data" again. Yes I did this with a yellow highlighter. I do not see how to do this in REW. Me thinks this shows how much sound is really there, comparing horns and no horns, just a great visual! Comments anybody?
Man the lows and highs above 50 dB really stands out, I can hear it! REW is so accurate, I never see data that does not match what I am hearing, pretty awesome.
I played my FHAG though my Fender Acoustic amp again, not bad, but man it WILL NOT deliver lows and highs like the FHAG, with all tone controls on zero, (as I do with the FHAG).
Yes it will deliver the lows and highs somewhat better if the tone controls are up, but it starts to sound like an electric guitar, just not near as good! Plus the sound is "over there", not in the guitar! The distortion grows as you turn it up, drivers into air, not near as good as horns!
I played the FHAG and then listened to my past iPhone recording right away after that, to get the relative difference in sound, not even close, don't get me started.
I am lucky enough to have the house to myself again, and man is the Folded Horn Acoustic Guitar rocking! So pleased to be back where everything works again, no worries, just plug in and jam. Play acoustic, cool, turn on the horns, WOW! I hear the power, but I am listening closely to the tone, man it is great. The lows are fat, the highs are bright, and of course with a guitar the mids are always good.
I can't wait to get in the studio. Check out my studio recording plan and please comment, all views welcome. Let's Make The Acoustic Guitar Rock! Oh wait, I already did that!
I am asking because I want to market my guitar through my YouTube video, but I want to be accurate. Some marketing I have seen is total ********. Some products stand on their own and does not need this. I hope my guitar is in this group.
Obviously most of a YouTube audience is quite different from diyAudio people. Are these statements correct:
"Folded Horns have much greater efficiency, so they generate more power with less wattage, with less distortion". (I know this is true).
"Folded horns can make small full range speakers sound like larger speakers". (My iPhone test where the bass dB increases by 25 dB horns uncovered vs. covered suggests this is true, I can sure hear it).
"Folded Horns Improve Tone". (I get much greater lows and highs shown in REW, and I can hear it very easily).
"Folded Horns help waves develop before they bounce off walls". (Definitely not sure about this one).
"Folded Horns provide directivity". (I know this is true, but not sure it applies to my guitar all that much).
"Folded Horns need to follow the 1/4 wavelength rule to be effective". (I think this is true? Sure seems to work for my guitar).
I have attached my updated YouTube plan, would like to hear from everybody about this, if you are so inclined.
I also attached my "Yellow Data" again. Yes I did this with a yellow highlighter. I do not see how to do this in REW. Me thinks this shows how much sound is really there, comparing horns and no horns, just a great visual! Comments anybody?
Man the lows and highs above 50 dB really stands out, I can hear it! REW is so accurate, I never see data that does not match what I am hearing, pretty awesome.
I played my FHAG though my Fender Acoustic amp again, not bad, but man it WILL NOT deliver lows and highs like the FHAG, with all tone controls on zero, (as I do with the FHAG).
Yes it will deliver the lows and highs somewhat better if the tone controls are up, but it starts to sound like an electric guitar, just not near as good! Plus the sound is "over there", not in the guitar! The distortion grows as you turn it up, drivers into air, not near as good as horns!
I played the FHAG and then listened to my past iPhone recording right away after that, to get the relative difference in sound, not even close, don't get me started.
I am lucky enough to have the house to myself again, and man is the Folded Horn Acoustic Guitar rocking! So pleased to be back where everything works again, no worries, just plug in and jam. Play acoustic, cool, turn on the horns, WOW! I hear the power, but I am listening closely to the tone, man it is great. The lows are fat, the highs are bright, and of course with a guitar the mids are always good.
I can't wait to get in the studio. Check out my studio recording plan and please comment, all views welcome. Let's Make The Acoustic Guitar Rock! Oh wait, I already did that!
I would think the you-tube crowd would react better to a live demo; put your horns on a foot switch or use the guitar's volume control.
Play something as a plain acoustic guitar, crank up the volume (or step on the switch) to kick in the horns. You could even arrange a song where you go back and forth several times between the plain acoustic and then rock on the amplified sound coming through those horns.
Given the sound comes out the guitar itself, rather than from a box over there, would be a point of differentiating what you have, versus a typical amplified arrangement. You'd want to tout each, every and all aspects of why that's better in your presentation.
You got it JJ, I will eventually use a foot switch. For the YouTube demo, I want to reach down and flip the switch on the amp that clearly has the speakers removed. I don't want anybody to think there is some trick going on, want to make it obvious.
Man the jam last night was fantastic! I purposely tripped the circuit limiter for testing. Had everything on 9-1/2 before she blew, and that took a few minutes. If I power down and start up again, will not work, hence what led me down the wrong path earlier. Even a few minutes, will not turn on. Power down, unplug everything, wait about ten minutes, and she works every time. Maybe temperature related??
Man the jam last night was fantastic! I purposely tripped the circuit limiter for testing. Had everything on 9-1/2 before she blew, and that took a few minutes. If I power down and start up again, will not work, hence what led me down the wrong path earlier. Even a few minutes, will not turn on. Power down, unplug everything, wait about ten minutes, and she works every time. Maybe temperature related??
Probably. Has all the "usual suspects".
Last night I did play "Time Stand Still" in front of other people which has been a goal for the last few weeks. As I think I keep hearing Geddy say in interviews; "You have to practice to the point where it's just all automatic, because you've done it so many times". I'm beginning to get it. My A string broke - new set, pinched in the nut slot - on the Suzuki nylon strung classical I brought when I was tuning just before I was to go up. The sound guy let me use his guitar, an Ovation. With steel strings. I was able to play through my 3 song set nevertheless - nice action on that guitar of his. Saved my evening, I didnt think I was going to go on. After having my son stop by and sit through all the other performances; I was last.
Greater efficiency means more sound pressure level is derived from a given electrical power.
A subjective observation that is meaningless, the size of a speaker does not relate to the sound.
Again, subjective.
Objectively, your measured results using a swept sign wave signal show a decidedly peaky response with far less gain at either end of the horn's response.
A sound wave develops when it leaves the transducer or horn mouth and enters the room, explain what you mean by "help waves develop".
Horns have directivity patterns that vary with frequency, so do front mounted drivers. Inasmuch as horns generally have more forward directivity, any yours is pointed sideways to the direction the guitar faces, that directivity would be considered a drawback.
The resonance of bass horns are usually a quarter wavelength long at the low cutoff, Fc.
A properly sized horn has sufficient resistance to damp the resonances into insignificance.
Undersize horn mouths such as yours have unmasked resonances with peak to dip magnitude levels considered unacceptable in proper horn design, as your measurements have demonstrated.
"11) Klipsch, Bose, Weltersys, Danley. Acoustic Body is Everything. Electric Body Not So Much."
No idea what you mean by that, but if you are using my name, it's Welter, company name Welter Systems, Inc.
Me thinks the "Yellow Data" does not show what you think it does, and is misleading.
Art
Thanks Much Art, appreciate your comments as always. I know your last name is Welter, I will change your company name to Welter Systems (thought it was Weltersys). I would like to mention your name along with Klipsch, Bose and Danley, just so people watching the YouTube video can do a bit of research regrading horns/waveguides, if they are so inclined.
As far as the horns help develop soundwaves discussion, I have seen this online, but not sure it is legit. Some people claim that 1/4 of the wavelength being in the horn before it exits helps "develop" the sound wave, before it bounces off walls, as opposed to coming from an open driver. Other say this has been disproven. I don't have an opinion on this, because I don't know. Sounded interesting, but many falsehoods sound interesting, so I will leave this out of the conversation, unless somebody can prove otherwise.
When I mention the body of an acoustic guitar, it produces sound big time (resonator), as opposed to the body of an electric guitar, which has almost nothing to do with the sound of the guitar.
My "yellow data" is not getting love, not sure why. I don't think it is misleading. It is based on REW data, shows the sound exploding up to high dB levels at every frequency. REW traces do the same thing, this is just a better display for a YouTube video, not meant for diyAudio people that already understand this, attached again for comments from all.
Last weekend I was wearing a short sleeve shirt when playing the FHAG. My right arm was on the soundboard and tingling, all the way up through my bicep. Talk about being one with your instrument, not kidding, my arm was very slightly vibrating. The soundboard is on fire when jamming on 8-1/2 or maybe 9.
Of course this means a very small amount of sound was coming off my arm (theoretically). I wonder what kind of tone comes off skin? Sorry, kidding, but you get the point!
I wonder if electric guitar players ever feel this? Oh wait, they can't, their sound is not coming from the guitar. I bet standing in front of a powerful amp or PA in a big arena can do something like that, but maybe more of a hair dryer feeling!
As far as the horns help develop soundwaves discussion, I have seen this online, but not sure it is legit. Some people claim that 1/4 of the wavelength being in the horn before it exits helps "develop" the sound wave, before it bounces off walls, as opposed to coming from an open driver. Other say this has been disproven. I don't have an opinion on this, because I don't know. Sounded interesting, but many falsehoods sound interesting, so I will leave this out of the conversation, unless somebody can prove otherwise.
When I mention the body of an acoustic guitar, it produces sound big time (resonator), as opposed to the body of an electric guitar, which has almost nothing to do with the sound of the guitar.
My "yellow data" is not getting love, not sure why. I don't think it is misleading. It is based on REW data, shows the sound exploding up to high dB levels at every frequency. REW traces do the same thing, this is just a better display for a YouTube video, not meant for diyAudio people that already understand this, attached again for comments from all.
Last weekend I was wearing a short sleeve shirt when playing the FHAG. My right arm was on the soundboard and tingling, all the way up through my bicep. Talk about being one with your instrument, not kidding, my arm was very slightly vibrating. The soundboard is on fire when jamming on 8-1/2 or maybe 9.
Of course this means a very small amount of sound was coming off my arm (theoretically). I wonder what kind of tone comes off skin? Sorry, kidding, but you get the point!
I wonder if electric guitar players ever feel this? Oh wait, they can't, their sound is not coming from the guitar. I bet standing in front of a powerful amp or PA in a big arena can do something like that, but maybe more of a hair dryer feeling!
Well, if you've ever owned a Gibson SG, you would know that the solid body - somehow - resonates at concert pitch. The guitar actually "comes alive" when you tune it up and it's something you can feel. This is a real SG; unsure if the bolt on neck Epiphones do that. I do note however that the Epi units where the neck is built, glued onto the body seem to be more sought after and I assume they do that resonant thing too.
Having trouble conceptualizing. One would think a high degree of isolation would be ideal (the 1/2" separator board), between the section of your instrument with the horns and drivers and the section that's the acoustic guitar part; specifically the braced membrane part the strings mechanically vibrate to make sound. If the speaker part is driving sound back into the part - or section - it's getting its sound from, how is it doing that without feedback? Especially at the level of making your arm numb or whatever. ??
As explained previously (posts 241, 630 etc.) the amplified speaker's output makes the body resonate, the strings vibrate at the resonant frequencies, the pickups (or microphones) pick up the string vibration, an acoustic/mechanical feedback loop. Happens on all acoustic string instruments and drums when the amplified level reaches a certain threshold at any resonant frequency, typically triggered when playing sympathetic note frequencies.
Unless dampened by fingers, covering sound holes, adding strips of tape or gel, or reduced/eliminated by equalization (parametric notch filters) the acoustic/mechanical feedback loop will run away, an unwanted experience for both the player or audience.
An acoustic/mechanical feedback loop as you describe is only desirable if the player initiates and can control it as part of the performance.
Many performances have been ruined or interrupted by an acoustic/mechanical feedback loop, for instance a string instrument note may trigger a timpani drum- the drum continues ringing after the note has been played, regardless of what the rest of the ensemble plays.
More common is the guitarist or bassist that can't let go of the strings without the instrument "howling".
Steve Howe (As JJ mentioned previously) or other guitarists that have emulated Jimi Hendrix know how to control sustain and feedback.
A solid body electric does not have as much as much acoustic/mechanical feedback as an acoustic instrument or hollow body electric because their very small resonant chambers are typically above the frequency range excited by fundamental note frequencies.
The acoustic/mechanical feedback effect can be created (and felt) at any desired level with steel strings using an "EBow", an inductive string driver feedback device which includes a sensor coil, driver coil and amplifier to induce forced string vibrations. Electric (and acoustic) guitar players have been feeling the effect for over 50 years now.
Art
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Wow, I never knew that's how it worked. I thought all this time it just spat out a rapid fire series of EM pulses, which hit the string like a fast picking stroke.