TBLA - could I possibly have the name of that dealer? He may be able to help...
Torgeir - yes i suspect your results are more accurate. My multimeter was jumping all over the place and I had to make a guestimate on the average figure.
Our chips are different though - mine is a later version (v. 1.15) but yet it says 50/60hz on it. Weird
Torgeir - yes i suspect your results are more accurate. My multimeter was jumping all over the place and I had to make a guestimate on the average figure.
Our chips are different though - mine is a later version (v. 1.15) but yet it says 50/60hz on it. Weird
fmak said:
I tried unconnecting the cables out of the transformer leading to the amp board and control board, measuring the voltage across the two pair of wires to the amp board to 21V AC, and 9.5V AC to the control board, with the switches in position 2-2-2.
Then I took a deep breath and after reconnecting the wires, plugged the amp into the mains.
I get the standby red diode lighting up, but the amp don't seem to want to go out standby; it doesn't react to the powerbutton being pressed, nor any commands from the remote.
Seems the chip indicating 60Hz is active....
The 2-2-2 switch configuration is clearly ok for 240V. There are two measuring points on the amp board that says +17v and -17v, and measures there I find about 17.5v and -17.5v.
The amp clearly has a bridged output stage configuration, if it is able to deliver the advertized output wattage with such a low voltage supply.
I probably need to copy someone elses EPROM containing the correct microcode for 50Hz operation. Can anyone help?
The amp clearly has a bridged output stage configuration, if it is able to deliver the advertized output wattage with such a low voltage supply.
I probably need to copy someone elses EPROM containing the correct microcode for 50Hz operation. Can anyone help?
Too right.
Importers like AS usually insist on being sole importers and strike an exclusivity deal with the mfr. AS provide Krell with local distribution, marketing, sales and support.
The reason AS want sole importership is to make profit through monopoly. It removes competition and allows them to fix prices and cream off a healthy margin (which is often 50% or more of final price). Having only a repair and upgrade business would not be anything like as profitable for them.
AS expect Krell to respect the sole import agreement. When individual customers import directly from the US the agreement is eroded. By law Krell's warranty is transferrable as has been mentioned. Unfortunately, the warranty doesn't cover voltage conversion. And with Krell doing this outrageous frequency detection and refusing to explain the conversion process they are conspiring with AS to break the spirit of the law so as to protect AS' monopoly. This is a form of price fixing and ought to be illegal.
Many hifi mfrs indulge in similar price fixing practices. Naim, for example, force their dealers to maintain recommended retail prices and punish the dealers if they stray. They can do this buy withdrawing "Naim dealer status" or more covertly by delaying inventory and so on. You won't find much difference if any in Naim prices across the UK. The same is probably true across the US. I had a discussion with an American Naim dealer about this and he confessed the price fixing practice.
Krell probably don't like the situation either. They probably get a lot of angry customers complaining about this. Krell probably don't see all of the price difference between US and UK products - AS will see much of it themselves. Krell doesn't have the resources to do the AS job themselves and are probably contractually obliged to use AS. So there is a power struggle between the two of them.
Michael Dell had the savvy to anticipate the distributor trap and avoid them right from the outset. It certainly worked and caused IBM, Compaq and HP some serious price pressure. After watching their market share wither for several years, Compaq decided to play Dell at their game and announced intentions to sell direct: immediatley their dealers turned on them and their sales took such a turn that the board were forced to withdraw the idea and apologize to all who were offended. That was many years ago and still today HP-Compaq haven't cracked the direct sales model.
As you say, if the customers don't feel they are being fairly treated then both mfr and distributor suffer in the end.
BAM
PS: Nelson, how does you company handle distribution to the UK?
Torgeir - I may be able to help because MY AMP IS WORKING!!! Hallelujah!! Thanks everyone so much for helping me get it to work - in the end it was just one switch that needed to be flicked.
Torgeir - if there's anything that you need me to do to get your amp working please feel free to ask. You gave me the winning combo and I'd hate to see Absolute Sounds get £550. Do you need to copy my chip in some form or manner? You have my email address...
I'm half tempted to phone up Absolute Sounds and give it to them in their face - that would give me so much joy. For now I will take silent pleasure in helping anyone that has a 300il convert their machines and depriving them of their monopoly. My amp seems to be newer than Torgeirs but yet it works at 50hz - that is very strange...
Well, I'm just over the moon!!! cheers everyone!!
Torgeir - if there's anything that you need me to do to get your amp working please feel free to ask. You gave me the winning combo and I'd hate to see Absolute Sounds get £550. Do you need to copy my chip in some form or manner? You have my email address...
I'm half tempted to phone up Absolute Sounds and give it to them in their face - that would give me so much joy. For now I will take silent pleasure in helping anyone that has a 300il convert their machines and depriving them of their monopoly. My amp seems to be newer than Torgeirs but yet it works at 50hz - that is very strange...
Well, I'm just over the moon!!! cheers everyone!!
The chip with the frequency specific data on it is a motorola MC68HC711E9 microcontroller, which seems to be quite common. It has a built in 12K EPROM, http://www.spkorb.org/final_report.html (scroll down).
It should be easily reprogrammed by someone who has the necessary equipment, http://www.cir.com/tools/tools.htm#megamax .
It should be easily reprogrammed by someone who has the necessary equipment, http://www.cir.com/tools/tools.htm#megamax .
You're quite right about not buying Krell - it's the only way we can force them to change their policy.
Why can't Krell license another distributor in the UK to introduce some competition? CSE in York who import Primare products are 100 times better than AS - these people have been incredibly helpful to me in the past and I can't recommend them enough. A bit of competition would force AS to smarten up their act. They get the units discounted from Krell direct anyway, so why do they need to put such a ridiculous profit margin on top of that anyway??? Greed I guess....
Tor - I sent you email. We must get your amp working too!
Why can't Krell license another distributor in the UK to introduce some competition? CSE in York who import Primare products are 100 times better than AS - these people have been incredibly helpful to me in the past and I can't recommend them enough. A bit of competition would force AS to smarten up their act. They get the units discounted from Krell direct anyway, so why do they need to put such a ridiculous profit margin on top of that anyway??? Greed I guess....
Tor - I sent you email. We must get your amp working too!
Pass Labs
Let's consult our resident CEO.
Suppose you decide to buy Pass instead of nasty, unfriendly Krell. You decide to mortgage your house and auction your wife on eBay to buy the X250 of your dreams.
You consult the Pass Labs website to find your only UK dealer, Metropolis Music. They are asking £5500 for the 230V critter. This is about US$10,300.
The auction completes but your wife doesn't fetch as much as you expected. You can't quite afford it. Instead you console yourself with a holiday in California. There you happen across Katli Audio and see your dream amp on sale for only US$6000. Wow! Even though you spent money on the holiday you still have enough to afford $6000. You buy it and bring it back to the UK.
Oops, it is set for 120V. You phone Metropolis to seek a voltage conversion,
What do Metropolis say?
(question for Nelson)
Let's consult our resident CEO.
Suppose you decide to buy Pass instead of nasty, unfriendly Krell. You decide to mortgage your house and auction your wife on eBay to buy the X250 of your dreams.
You consult the Pass Labs website to find your only UK dealer, Metropolis Music. They are asking £5500 for the 230V critter. This is about US$10,300.
The auction completes but your wife doesn't fetch as much as you expected. You can't quite afford it. Instead you console yourself with a holiday in California. There you happen across Katli Audio and see your dream amp on sale for only US$6000. Wow! Even though you spent money on the holiday you still have enough to afford $6000. You buy it and bring it back to the UK.
Oops, it is set for 120V. You phone Metropolis to seek a voltage conversion,
What do Metropolis say?
(question for Nelson)
this is a real possibility for myself
I'm British and living in the US (married, 3 kids etc.) and when they are grown and the wife decides she would like to live in the UK will the manufacturer of my present equipment alienate me by not giving me reasonably easy means to convert my equipment? That is the thing I fear more than anything and one of the reasons I didn't bring my Naim gear over, they wanted silly money to convert it.
Kevin
I'm British and living in the US (married, 3 kids etc.) and when they are grown and the wife decides she would like to live in the UK will the manufacturer of my present equipment alienate me by not giving me reasonably easy means to convert my equipment? That is the thing I fear more than anything and one of the reasons I didn't bring my Naim gear over, they wanted silly money to convert it.
Kevin
i don't think its only absolute sounds that are the "bad guy"....try to check the krell prices all over europe - they are the same as in the UK and its the same situation with lots of other american brands....levinson, pass, rowland,wadia,avalon...the list is endless, because there has to be a distributor to take care of the foreign markets.......its the same thing all over the world - you don't see danish copland or primare selling direct to a local shop in indonesia or whatever....!
just my 2c
but i will allways buy my things were the price is lowest and as someone probably noticed, i just bought a krell kps20i from a local dealer in new york for half of the price as in london or any other place in europe.
just my 2c
but i will allways buy my things were the price is lowest and as someone probably noticed, i just bought a krell kps20i from a local dealer in new york for half of the price as in london or any other place in europe.
Whilst I was trying to get this amp converted, I fired off an email to the Australian distributor in the hope that he may help. They got back to me and say that it was "no problem", "a simple job" and would cost $100 (not sure whether that is US or AUS). How about that??
Yeah I understand they need distributors and they need to make money...but given that they get them so much cheaper now (with v. weak dollar) do we see any of those savings passed on to us? It would be interesting to do a survey on prices of Krell around the world and European kit in America. I wonder if I'd save money importing Primare direct from Sweden?
FMAK - My 300iL was bought brand new from the US. I got it to work by using the 2+2+2 combo which Tor found out was OK for 240V (he has US 300il too). The chip that detects line frequency on mine allows 50/60hz. Tor's has a different chip (his machine is slighlty older) which doesn't allow this. There is a label on the chip that will tell you what line frequency it allows - so if you're interested in buying one, ask your friendly dealer/seller to check for you! I haven't changed the line fuse - it is still at 240V. Does anyone know if I should change this?
On a side note: my remote control ain't working. You reckon Absolute Sounds will give me a new one?
Yeah I understand they need distributors and they need to make money...but given that they get them so much cheaper now (with v. weak dollar) do we see any of those savings passed on to us? It would be interesting to do a survey on prices of Krell around the world and European kit in America. I wonder if I'd save money importing Primare direct from Sweden?
FMAK - My 300iL was bought brand new from the US. I got it to work by using the 2+2+2 combo which Tor found out was OK for 240V (he has US 300il too). The chip that detects line frequency on mine allows 50/60hz. Tor's has a different chip (his machine is slighlty older) which doesn't allow this. There is a label on the chip that will tell you what line frequency it allows - so if you're interested in buying one, ask your friendly dealer/seller to check for you! I haven't changed the line fuse - it is still at 240V. Does anyone know if I should change this?
On a side note: my remote control ain't working. You reckon Absolute Sounds will give me a new one?
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