I dunno, Jean-Pierre, I got very good service from Earl and I'm not complaining about the cost. I've got beautifully made waveguides that are the equivalent of something that would cost hundreds of dollars and a crossover designed by a very good engineer.
I think the latest version represents a very good value and the things you mention don't appear to be an issue
See post http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/showthread.php?postid=1607743#post1607743
I think the latest version represents a very good value and the things you mention don't appear to be an issue
See post http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/showthread.php?postid=1607743#post1607743
Thanks Frank - he obviously did not read all of the posts. I guess he won't be buying a pair then 
I would look into water based epoxies put on with a foam brush. They have no smell dry very fast and clean up with water. They are quite expensive but I think that they are worth it. $100 would buy all the paint and you'd have lots left over.
But if you can get a body shop to paint them then go that way. I'm trying to arrange having a body shop do it for me as paint is just such a PITA. But those guys use paint that can cost $200 a gallon so there will be a big ticket on that approach.
I would look into water based epoxies put on with a foam brush. They have no smell dry very fast and clean up with water. They are quite expensive but I think that they are worth it. $100 would buy all the paint and you'd have lots left over.
But if you can get a body shop to paint them then go that way. I'm trying to arrange having a body shop do it for me as paint is just such a PITA. But those guys use paint that can cost $200 a gallon so there will be a big ticket on that approach.
Re: after eading
Jean , you could save $50 (and your high pressure) by not ordering a cab.
For the best speakers on a planet they are actually a screaming deal. I paid $1350 for a pair of used and abused Lowther DX4 (new are what $2500??) drivers .They look like they hammered them in a foundry and fostex looks like a milion bucks next to them but the difference in sound is MAJOR. It was noted many times that you're paying for a project . Regards
W
uvodee said:
Jean , you could save $50 (and your high pressure) by not ordering a cab.
For the best speakers on a planet
they are actually a screaming deal. I paid $1350 for a pair of used and abused Lowther DX4 (new are what $2500??) drivers .They look like they hammered them in a foundry and fostex looks like a milion bucks next to them but the difference in sound is MAJOR. It was noted many times that you're paying for a project . RegardsW
Quality
Seems a bit troll-ish to be raising issues about quality after they appear to have been resolved and coimplaints have died off.
Especially now that Earl is having the panels manufactured for him.
Nick.
PS: Why do people always talk about cost in terms of materials, there is I.P., time and profit to take into account, it really grinds my gears, and if you dont like the price then build your own.
Seems a bit troll-ish to be raising issues about quality after they appear to have been resolved and coimplaints have died off.
Especially now that Earl is having the panels manufactured for him.
Nick.
PS: Why do people always talk about cost in terms of materials, there is I.P., time and profit to take into account, it really grinds my gears, and if you dont like the price then build your own.
Re: Quality
You don't get it. It's not about the money, it's about what you are getting for the money.
Were there any complaints about the drivers? How about the crossover components? No? These, I guess, were manufactured to an acceptable fit and finish to satisfy the consumer.
Would you accept a driver that has a malformed basket or waste parts or the casting still attached? A basket that is out of round? Poorly wound inductors?
Go to the lumber store for that matter, and buy a sheet of plywood or MDF. Would you complain if the thickness was not uniform or there were other manufacturing defects?
As far as "build your own", I thought that was the point of this forum anyway.
Grumpy_Git said:
You don't get it. It's not about the money, it's about what you are getting for the money.
Were there any complaints about the drivers? How about the crossover components? No? These, I guess, were manufactured to an acceptable fit and finish to satisfy the consumer.
Would you accept a driver that has a malformed basket or waste parts or the casting still attached? A basket that is out of round? Poorly wound inductors?
Go to the lumber store for that matter, and buy a sheet of plywood or MDF. Would you complain if the thickness was not uniform or there were other manufacturing defects?
As far as "build your own", I thought that was the point of this forum anyway.
But the quality issue has been resolved so why bring it back up? That was MY point.
As for the costs, I would think that the drivers cost little to produce but are sold for circa $150 each (in the UK), this is to recoup development, IP etc on the devices, so why the complaints that Earl is charging $650 for his kits? Its not a materials material cost, its a cost based on many parameters.
(And one that I consider reasonable for the IP and work involved.)
I rarely (that doesnt mean always) buy Gen 1 products cos I prefer mature systems with fewer issues, thats me, my choice, and couldn't care less about others.
Sheet materials are rarely exactly as advertised, 18mm mdf varying and ply having flaws and warps. Yes I accept them, they are the materials available.
If you want to build your own go for it, this kit obviously isn't for you. DIY is the point of the site as a whole but there is a huge quantity of kit builds/interest on this site.
Nick.
As for the costs, I would think that the drivers cost little to produce but are sold for circa $150 each (in the UK), this is to recoup development, IP etc on the devices, so why the complaints that Earl is charging $650 for his kits? Its not a materials material cost, its a cost based on many parameters.
(And one that I consider reasonable for the IP and work involved.)
I rarely (that doesnt mean always) buy Gen 1 products cos I prefer mature systems with fewer issues, thats me, my choice, and couldn't care less about others.
Sheet materials are rarely exactly as advertised, 18mm mdf varying and ply having flaws and warps. Yes I accept them, they are the materials available.
If you want to build your own go for it, this kit obviously isn't for you. DIY is the point of the site as a whole but there is a huge quantity of kit builds/interest on this site.
Nick.
Just a quick comment about Sherwin Williams. They have an industrial division too that has some very good stuff you can't get at their retail stores, although they can often order it for you. One that works good on cabinets if you are spraying is their Polane 700T. This is a water based version of their Polane T. The T stands for texture as you can get various different textures depending on the pressure you spray it at and amount of thinning you do. I'd expect you could brush or roll it to get a nice texture as well.
http://www.sherwin-williams.com/oem/us/eng/pdf/sell-sheets/polane-700T-enamel.pdf
John
http://www.sherwin-williams.com/oem/us/eng/pdf/sell-sheets/polane-700T-enamel.pdf
John
To keep you up to date:
Did someone say "Better Sound Through Research"?
Best, Markus
An externally hosted image should be here but it was not working when we last tested it.
Did someone say "Better Sound Through Research"?
Best, Markus
Please
Markus - they look great! Sorry they were so much trouble to build
You know on stands like that I think that the lower edge might look better with a round-over. I have mixed feelings about rounding over the bottom. It might look better, but it adds a complexity - mostly when spray painting them.
Markus - they look great! Sorry they were so much trouble to build
You know on stands like that I think that the lower edge might look better with a round-over. I have mixed feelings about rounding over the bottom. It might look better, but it adds a complexity - mostly when spray painting them.
a diy result
look at these corners,
this is what a true DIY does by himself when not buying a kit but getting the wood from a lumberplace
and a true diy sands to get smooth surfaces for quality paint results, not to have pieces match with a tolerance of 1/4"
this is a movie poster light box 45x30, look at the edges, not treated, not sanded yet...
Do I need to add anything more?
Jean-Pierre
Federal Way, WA
look at these corners,
this is what a true DIY does by himself when not buying a kit but getting the wood from a lumberplace
and a true diy sands to get smooth surfaces for quality paint results, not to have pieces match with a tolerance of 1/4"
this is a movie poster light box 45x30, look at the edges, not treated, not sanded yet...
Do I need to add anything more?
Jean-Pierre
Federal Way, WA
Attachments
markus76 said:Having no rounded edges at the bottom is part of the design – end of story
You could have sanded them
The reason that I mentioned it is that John asked me about this. He changed the way the bottom was attached to match the top thus making for common parts all the way arround - smart move. But he said that he could just as easily radius the lower edge too. I said no, but now I'm thinking again. It seems to all depend on how they sit. A small stand like yours makes rounded look better, but a stand which is larger looks better with them flat (like the ones that I have here). I like your stands though so I'm leaning that way. Trivial detail I suppose.
Markus, good work. I wonder if you could make the stand have a speaker sized platform with a roundover on the bottom of it?
The looks of the stand complement the design of the speakers perfectly. Great choice. I wonder if Ikea or someone else makes similar stands.
Again, great work. I'm very much looking forward to you getting the subwoofer system complete so you can provide your impressions.
The looks of the stand complement the design of the speakers perfectly. Great choice. I wonder if Ikea or someone else makes similar stands.
Again, great work. I'm very much looking forward to you getting the subwoofer system complete so you can provide your impressions.
gedlee said:
Don't rub salt in my wounds. One can't roll on thick coats so the end result depends solely on what the surface looked like after sanding, filling and sealing. There's no "fix it in the mix" – recording engineers tend to work like that...
So there are flaws that I see but they are in the range of the flaws that the factory new Bose stands show.
Best, Markus
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