Re: Classd amplifier
Ecodoppler
I cannot vouch for the 300 watts modules having never heared them but you will require a full power supply for these wereas the 600w have the rectifier and caps on board. I suppose you could use a switch mode power supply for these but that's something that I did not want to do because of RFI issues. The 600w is so simple to connect up that I am sure that you would not need any help from anyone. All you require is a transformer with 0 - 70V and 15v - 0 -15v secondaries. (I use 700V/A transformers one per channel)
ecodoppler said:
Ecodoppler
I cannot vouch for the 300 watts modules having never heared them but you will require a full power supply for these wereas the 600w have the rectifier and caps on board. I suppose you could use a switch mode power supply for these but that's something that I did not want to do because of RFI issues. The 600w is so simple to connect up that I am sure that you would not need any help from anyone. All you require is a transformer with 0 - 70V and 15v - 0 -15v secondaries. (I use 700V/A transformers one per channel)
Classd amplifier
jaydeecee
Ok. Tomorrow I'll ask information to Classd staff. What is the cost of Canterbury Toroidal transfromers? What is the brand of caps?
What do you think about their performance with high/midrange frequencies (voices, strings). In other words, I read that Hypex could have Highs too brittle, harsh for someone.
Thank you
Ecodoppler
jaydeecee
Ok. Tomorrow I'll ask information to Classd staff. What is the cost of Canterbury Toroidal transfromers? What is the brand of caps?
What do you think about their performance with high/midrange frequencies (voices, strings). In other words, I read that Hypex could have Highs too brittle, harsh for someone.
Thank you
Ecodoppler
Re: Classd amplifier
Ecodoppler
The two Canterbury transformers cost £145/€155
The caps (power supply electrolytics) are standard Samwha, not what you might accept as audiophile caps and I questioned that with Ecotec and they responded that they did not have any degrading audible effect but were chosen for their application/suitability for this Class D design. I can certainly vouch for this fact in how they sound.
The performance of these amplifiers is beyond what you might imagine. They are dynamic when the signal calls for this and have a fantastic soundstage, at no time do they sound brittle. They have no fatigue factor whatsoever. I also have a set of Audio Mirror 6C33C SET tube monoblocks and I tell you I haven't switched them on since firing up the Ecotec Class D amps. To me it's like sitting at a live performance and with the right recordings the hairs on the back of my neck stand up. Voices are natural and the amps dig deep into the recording venues. There is so much more on my CDs that I never imagined was there. Let me say that I have no association with Ecotec Systems and only happened upon them by the chance that another diyAudio member suggested that I take a look at their website. I had no way of knowing how they would sound but ordered blind. It's the best "mistake" I've ever made.
ecodoppler said:
Ecodoppler
The two Canterbury transformers cost £145/€155
The caps (power supply electrolytics) are standard Samwha, not what you might accept as audiophile caps and I questioned that with Ecotec and they responded that they did not have any degrading audible effect but were chosen for their application/suitability for this Class D design. I can certainly vouch for this fact in how they sound.
The performance of these amplifiers is beyond what you might imagine. They are dynamic when the signal calls for this and have a fantastic soundstage, at no time do they sound brittle. They have no fatigue factor whatsoever. I also have a set of Audio Mirror 6C33C SET tube monoblocks and I tell you I haven't switched them on since firing up the Ecotec Class D amps. To me it's like sitting at a live performance and with the right recordings the hairs on the back of my neck stand up. Voices are natural and the amps dig deep into the recording venues. There is so much more on my CDs that I never imagined was there. Let me say that I have no association with Ecotec Systems and only happened upon them by the chance that another diyAudio member suggested that I take a look at their website. I had no way of knowing how they would sound but ordered blind. It's the best "mistake" I've ever made.
jaydeecee said:
Yes I was referring to those amplifiers. I needn't hear them in order to quantify them by their own merits, anymore than I need to stick my hand in a flame to know it burns.
It's somewhat less fallacious than having the ability to confirm a third party's, salesman's, "subjective marketing comparison", of how it bested a Krell while not having evaluated the two side by side myself.
Comments such as "There is so much more on my CDs that I never imagined was there" point to the problem. There is only ever what's on the CD, where a good amplifier's job is to add to it gain and as little else as possible, never to show you things that aren't there.
The game in making a truly good amplifier is in maximizing the "as little else as possible" goal, more than the next guy. Proper distortion and measurements are telling of this. To give up on that game and do a 180 implies the inability of being a true contender.
Such marketing is the same old schtick they immediately fall towards when they can't produce a decent amplifier. Simply reinvent reality to suit a product that ignores reality as it is.
A class d amplifier with no feedback is a rediculous notion to the extreme in terms of clean, accurate, and natural "reproduction" of the source. What you end up with instead is every kind of distortion and noise, some of it euphonic in nature, but it's only pleasing in the short duration until you become wise to how it's showing you the exact same things that were missing on every recording. That's to say, how it makes each recording sound identical to the next. Clearly this results more in the taking away from the natural recording rather than enhancing it, which is something that can't be done by an amplifier.
What you have here is an amplifier that's entirely unsuitable for accurate and natural full range audio reproduction. THD is only meaningless in the context they portrayed it, which is a single unknown and very optimal frequency, load, supplies, and generally lab conditions. There is such a thing as meaningful and telling measurements however, and the rest of the industry seems to know this.
I believe you will find that an already high 0.5% THD is the best case outcome and it will only get worse, much worse. You can't honestly expect us to believe that suddenly high distortion sounds good. It's certainly fair, and obvious to say that what they're selling you is distortion and noise, that can be easily mistaken as euphonic until you become aware of it, and in time you will.
To say it bested a krell or any linear, well behaved amplifier just say's you allowed yourself to be taken in by euphony, poor response, and generally blinded to what's really on the source to be experienced. In my experience this is a short term high that's always followed by a hard come down once you come to realize what it is you're missing out on, that which is actually there, for which the distortion and noise is no substitute.
So please keep that in mind as you recommend it to others that might be out to experience true high end sound reproduction from an amplifier that doesn't burry the source in as much euphonic mud as possible and is rather more interested in the long term enjoyment of their investment.
Classd amplifier
jaydeecee
Thank you for your reply. You are very polite. Actually you seem enthusiastic about this amplifiers. I've seen on their website that they can provide SDV1061-600 evaluation board with 300 W output power on demand; my Magneplanars are 4 ohms load and the builder recommends amplifier with maximum power of 200 watts.
Caps: I imagine the values of power supply caps are very high; in this case it's impossible to use Mundorf or other famous brands (too expensive). One year ago, I replaced the original caps of the Magneplanar's crossover with Ducati energia and Obbligato caps (see Humblehomemadehifi caps test), new woodcase and pure 0.5mm silver wire with teflon sheat. The result is extraordinary: smooth and warm sound.
Yesterday I send an email to Classsd and I'm waiting the reply.
It' s a pleasure to receive advices from you
regards
Ecodoppler
jaydeecee
Thank you for your reply. You are very polite. Actually you seem enthusiastic about this amplifiers. I've seen on their website that they can provide SDV1061-600 evaluation board with 300 W output power on demand; my Magneplanars are 4 ohms load and the builder recommends amplifier with maximum power of 200 watts.
Caps: I imagine the values of power supply caps are very high; in this case it's impossible to use Mundorf or other famous brands (too expensive). One year ago, I replaced the original caps of the Magneplanar's crossover with Ducati energia and Obbligato caps (see Humblehomemadehifi caps test), new woodcase and pure 0.5mm silver wire with teflon sheat. The result is extraordinary: smooth and warm sound.
Yesterday I send an email to Classsd and I'm waiting the reply.
It' s a pleasure to receive advices from you
regards
Ecodoppler
classdphile said:
Hello Berns,
I do appreciate your response and understand what you are saying but it is just theory on your part.
I have many years of listening to quality products and as I stated in my previous post I also own a pair of Audio Mirror 6C33C SET tube monoblocks.
Regardless of what you state I still maintain everything that I have said about the Ecotec amps. If you are ever in the UK, rather than in the 3rd stone from the sun, you are welcome to come and experience them first hand.
Regards, John
Re: Classd amplifier
Ecodoppler
You are very welcome, and yes the SDV1061-600 are the modules that I have.
Regardless of what Berns says in his post I still stand by what I am hearing in my system.
I do realize that we all listen to and like are music in different ways, that is why there are so many different amps, speakers etc. out there so do bear this in mind that this is only my reaction to this product, you must make your own decision on this.
I know that I have been enthusastic about certain kit when having read a rave review but when I have had a demo I have thought it very ordinary.
Regards, John
ecodoppler said:
Ecodoppler
You are very welcome, and yes the SDV1061-600 are the modules that I have.
Regardless of what Berns says in his post I still stand by what I am hearing in my system.
I do realize that we all listen to and like are music in different ways, that is why there are so many different amps, speakers etc. out there so do bear this in mind that this is only my reaction to this product, you must make your own decision on this.
I know that I have been enthusastic about certain kit when having read a rave review but when I have had a demo I have thought it very ordinary.
Regards, John
Re: Classd amplifier
Leandro,
Yes, it is possible that they might well be closed for Christmas. I will phone them on Monday and ask if they have received your mail and then post back on here. Or you could e-mail me on jaydeecee@tiscali.co.uk which might be better than posting here.
John
ecodoppler said:
Leandro,
Yes, it is possible that they might well be closed for Christmas. I will phone them on Monday and ask if they have received your mail and then post back on here. Or you could e-mail me on jaydeecee@tiscali.co.uk which might be better than posting here.
John
Anybody using anything from http://www.redrocksaudio.es./e_main.html?
They have 200W and 1000W amp modules, SMPS and dsp boards, all for very reasonable prices.
They have 200W and 1000W amp modules, SMPS and dsp boards, all for very reasonable prices.
for those who asked about TA2022 new version, is up and running... http://connexelectronic.com/product...ducts_id=45&osCsid=deqp4aecosab7cncvg2bn7qj31
the module can be used in BTL mode if supply 180* shifted signal for left and right channel. the output power will be up to 200W at 8 Ohm.
for nominal output power the ic requires +-32V DC, which means 2x24V AC at minimum 3.5 A. can use a thoroidal transformer with this ratings.
the size of the board is 100x60mm heatsink is 50 mm tall, 18 mm thick and 100 mm long and is mounted on the pcb 6.5mm inside. on the bottom of the pcb are few diodes and some resistors and capacitors which increase the height with about 2 mm under the board. so, total height will be 50mm heatsink, +1.6mm the pcb, +2.5mm required space for components on the bottom side. this is about 54 mm for 10.000uF/50V capacitors. if the board use 12.000uF/63V capacitors, will be higher with about 2mm, in total 56 mm.
so the final size will be W: 100mm, D:71.5mm H: 54mm or 56 mm depending on type of capacitors.
for nominal output power the ic requires +-32V DC, which means 2x24V AC at minimum 3.5 A. can use a thoroidal transformer with this ratings.
the size of the board is 100x60mm heatsink is 50 mm tall, 18 mm thick and 100 mm long and is mounted on the pcb 6.5mm inside. on the bottom of the pcb are few diodes and some resistors and capacitors which increase the height with about 2 mm under the board. so, total height will be 50mm heatsink, +1.6mm the pcb, +2.5mm required space for components on the bottom side. this is about 54 mm for 10.000uF/50V capacitors. if the board use 12.000uF/63V capacitors, will be higher with about 2mm, in total 56 mm.
so the final size will be W: 100mm, D:71.5mm H: 54mm or 56 mm depending on type of capacitors.
Attachments
Absolute maximum rating for power supply voltage, as is stated in datasheet is +- 40V. I would not recommend to use more than +-35V due to the required safety margin. at higher supply voltage than +-32 the efficiency would be lower, due to increased losses, and near to +-40 V the risk of damage the IC is increased, esspecially at high output power levels on low frequencyes, where can experience the Bus pumping effect. the IC has the undervoltage/overvoltage protection which will give the working voltage range between +-24V to +-35V.
this is quoted from the datasheet:
"The TA2022 can operate over a wide range of power supply voltages from +/-12V to +/-36V. In order
to optimize operation for either the low or high range, the user must select the proper values for
RVNNSENSE, RVPPSENSE, RFBA, RFBB, and RFBC. Please refer to the Modulator Feedback Design and
Over/Under-voltage Protection sections for more additional information."
this is quoted from the datasheet:
"The TA2022 can operate over a wide range of power supply voltages from +/-12V to +/-36V. In order
to optimize operation for either the low or high range, the user must select the proper values for
RVNNSENSE, RVPPSENSE, RFBA, RFBB, and RFBC. Please refer to the Modulator Feedback Design and
Over/Under-voltage Protection sections for more additional information."
Anyone ever seen this TA2024 based Class D board before?
Hey guys, I was hoping for a generic opinion on this TA2024 based board I found on eBay the other day.
Here is the link:
Cheap TA2024 Amp - eBay
I was going to buy a Sonic Impact amp for a small set of Monitor Audio bookshelves I have sitting around. Well once I started digging around on the web (yay for Google) I found these forums and now I have the crazy idea that I could get something a little better than the SI amp and satisfy my ever growing need for doing something myself.
I am DEFINATELY no electrical engineer. Infact elecrticity and I do not get along so well, however I appreciate good sounding speaker setups, and that is what I am hoping to acheve in a small footprint with a Class D or T amp.
Any and all guidance would be much appreciated, I did search but was unable to find the exact board on here that I linked to on eBay. Thanks in advance.
-Hadrien
Hey guys, I was hoping for a generic opinion on this TA2024 based board I found on eBay the other day.
Here is the link:
Cheap TA2024 Amp - eBay
I was going to buy a Sonic Impact amp for a small set of Monitor Audio bookshelves I have sitting around. Well once I started digging around on the web (yay for Google) I found these forums and now I have the crazy idea that I could get something a little better than the SI amp and satisfy my ever growing need for doing something myself.
I am DEFINATELY no electrical engineer. Infact elecrticity and I do not get along so well, however I appreciate good sounding speaker setups, and that is what I am hoping to acheve in a small footprint with a Class D or T amp.
Any and all guidance would be much appreciated, I did search but was unable to find the exact board on here that I linked to on eBay. Thanks in advance.
-Hadrien
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