I know this is an old post, and somewhat OT, but I asked Beyma about this yesterday because now the spec sheet says FS=33hz on the 15P80Nd. Got an answer this morning that the tech department had confirmed that the specs available now is correct.
It appears that Beyma built three different versions of the 15P80Nd speaker(attached). Not small changes... Version2 has Qts=0.34 while Version3 has Qts=0.179. Version3 has Le=0.8mH while Version2 has Le=1.6mH. The MMs stays from 99-105g.
The latest Version3 looks suited for a high efficiency midbass because of the low Qts = 0.179, Le=0.8mH, Fs=33.
Beyma also has a FR15A/2 CAD DIY cabinet for the 15P80Nd and TPL150H AMT tweeter with a very low 1,000 xover. FR15A/2 CAD. Home audio quality would favor a 1600Hz Xover.
The latest Version3 looks suited for a high efficiency midbass because of the low Qts = 0.179, Le=0.8mH, Fs=33.
Beyma also has a FR15A/2 CAD DIY cabinet for the 15P80Nd and TPL150H AMT tweeter with a very low 1,000 xover. FR15A/2 CAD. Home audio quality would favor a 1600Hz Xover.
Attachments
http://www.faitalpro.com/en/products/LF_Loudspeakers/product_details/index.php?id=101
What about this driver?
FaitalPRO | LF Loudspeakers | 10PR300
What is the difference between TPL150 and new TPL200? Anyone tested the new version?
Fanta
What about this driver?
FaitalPRO | LF Loudspeakers | 10PR300
What is the difference between TPL150 and new TPL200? Anyone tested the new version?
Fanta
Out of stock for a month I see.
Can I use it to check if a driver is ok and not blown too?
From the datasheets, it seems that Beyma has manufactured at least three versions of the TPL AMT tweeters.
TPL-150 (80W, 5.9 ohms)
TPL-150Silver and TPL-150Black Lower resistance (80W, 4.9 ohms)
TPL-200 (120W, 4.9 ohms) Higher Power
It is possible that the research in this 2010 Beyma AES paper resulted in construction changes used in the latest TPL pleated membranes and motor.
http://www.beyma.com/uploads/descargas/1355215096.pdf
Attachments
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RAAL ribbons vs. Beyma TPL
"RAAL ribbons are still champs up top, with the Beymas (relative) strength being lower down."
I can't remember if for this link or not but it was said some years ago:
"RAAL ribbons are still champs up top, with the Beymas (relative) strength being lower down."
You could measure the resistance of the voice coil. The newest third version V3 is 5.5ohms, first version V1 is 6.1 ohms, second version V2 is 6.2 ohms... this should separate V3 from (V1 or V2).
To separate V1 vs. V2
You could measure the impedance Z over say 20-100Hz in order to see the resonance Fs frequency peak. V1 =35Hz Fs, V2=54Hz Fs. This testing is done over low frequencies where most DVMs should be accurate.
BEST... build or purchase a T/S parameter test jig, You want accurate T/S parameters before you invest in Xover and cabinet design.
Difference between TPL-150 and ESS Heil AMT?
Can someone comment on the difference between the TPL-150 and the ESS Heil AMT? Heil AMT is a dipole but I have seen folks taking the back off of the TPL-150. Are they basically the same technology but the Heil AMT uses a huge magnet comb system/waveguide combo? I have paired the Heil AMT with a B&C 6MDN44 and the results look very nice - great sensitivity match and very smooth.
Here is the measured DSP XO:
Here is the measured nearfield HD:
Nearfield measured minimum phase:
Impulse response:
I paired it with a bass horn sub and it sounds very nice. Here is a sound clip (mono):
diyAudio
Will a TPL-150 sound as good or better?
Can someone comment on the difference between the TPL-150 and the ESS Heil AMT? Heil AMT is a dipole but I have seen folks taking the back off of the TPL-150. Are they basically the same technology but the Heil AMT uses a huge magnet comb system/waveguide combo? I have paired the Heil AMT with a B&C 6MDN44 and the results look very nice - great sensitivity match and very smooth.
Here is the measured DSP XO:
Here is the measured nearfield HD:
Nearfield measured minimum phase:
Impulse response:
I paired it with a bass horn sub and it sounds very nice. Here is a sound clip (mono):
diyAudio
Will a TPL-150 sound as good or better?
I am curious what your ESS sounds like?
I have heard the TPL but not the ESS. I also wonder is there any reason to have the TPL-150H when crossing at 1600hz or higher?
I dont know where I will XO at but probably higher. I have looked at the Raal also but dont want to cross at 2800hz. I will be trying out some small mids to go with the TPL-150/H. BUT I have never heard the Raal either.
I have heard the TPL but not the ESS. I also wonder is there any reason to have the TPL-150H when crossing at 1600hz or higher?
I dont know where I will XO at but probably higher. I have looked at the Raal also but dont want to cross at 2800hz. I will be trying out some small mids to go with the TPL-150/H. BUT I have never heard the Raal either.
If you are wondering what it sounds like listen to the clip in the previous post. I can upload more clips of you are interested. Basically, the AMT is very revealing with phenomenal transient response so that the finest temporal details are not lost. It is an ideal driver for high res 192kHz 24 bit recordings. It has the ability to resolve the attack of plucked strings like no other speaker I have heard. Combined with the ability to cover from about 600Hz (if asked) to 20khz with no XO in between, the phase coherence and spatial imaging and soundstage are also excellent.
Was looking at a few different AMT's and was curious. Not sure I am sold on the Beyma yet. I have no experience on the others in mind. I also will be using a pair of FaitalPro 8PR200 16ohm with it. Was thinking 3 way but possibly 2way MTM.
Not sure yet. Was going to go for budget but since this build will be not completed with both speakers until probably July I figure why not get the best I can for the AMT/Ribbon. Or at least the best I can afford.
Not sure yet. Was going to go for budget but since this build will be not completed with both speakers until probably July I figure why not get the best I can for the AMT/Ribbon. Or at least the best I can afford.
I have no reservations about recommending the ESS Heil AMT's - they are *World Class* driver and you won't be disappointed. They have limited power handling (40 watts) and are a true dipole design so you will have to make an MTM with an OB dipole tweeter, or probably easier to do a TMM and keep the AMT on top. I think the price point is comparable to the Beyma TPL-150 but the TPL-150 doesn't go down to 650Hz. It sounds so much more coherent when you can XO that low (essentially a FAST system).
Did you have a listen to the clips yet?
Did you have a listen to the clips yet?
Yes I did on my crappy, falling off response from 3khz line arrays. I was definitely considering those for my tweeter. I was going the three way route but think it will be a simple 2 way now.
Just have to see how to implement the AMT in a dipole while the rest is direct radiating. Was going to use them monopole but would like to try them dipole. Was going to have them on stands also with a side firing woofer in the stands for bass. BUT now I might just have to add a single 10" or such n the bottom front firing.
How open does the back need to be?
Meaning do I need to have a downward slope on the cabinet behind the eights?
Lots of questions....sorry. Never messed with a dipole tweeter and sealed woofers. I also only heard one clip 40secs long.
I was definitely considering those for my tweeter. I was going the three way route but think it will be a simple 2 way now.Just have to see how to implement the AMT in a dipole while the rest is direct radiating. Was going to use them monopole but would like to try them dipole. Was going to have them on stands also with a side firing woofer in the stands for bass. BUT now I might just have to add a single 10" or such n the bottom front firing.
How open does the back need to be?
Meaning do I need to have a downward slope on the cabinet behind the eights?
Lots of questions....sorry. Never messed with a dipole tweeter and sealed woofers. I also only heard one clip 40secs long.
Use good headphones - here are some more. Sounds better in flac but those are too big. The Heil AMT is world class sounding - very revealing, very resolving, very articulate without being harsh. No ringing, no sibilance whatsover.
xrk971,
Can you provide please also measurements at 15°, 30°,60° : it can give a lot of answers : many thinks these both AMT used too low give thin sound in such aeras.
I mean I don't know myself but read so much people saying than those both AMT are better above 2.8/3 K.... and even 6 to 8 K for the Heil where it gives its best !
Polar response ?
always myself asking the same questions : a low diameter (3" to 5"/6" classic driver, front loaded or not) or horn below the AMT is certainly the way to go... but how ? I believing now it seems more easy to follow you on your synergy design (Have to try it as it is cheap ) or with 2" / 1.5" CD driver with horn to avoid so such too low XO with AMTs' ?!
Very interrested by your results here !
I'm sure you thinked to the AMT in a synergy already ? Am I wrong ? Is there a problem here like a too low QTS or speed ?
cheers
Can you provide please also measurements at 15°, 30°,60° : it can give a lot of answers : many thinks these both AMT used too low give thin sound in such aeras.
I mean I don't know myself but read so much people saying than those both AMT are better above 2.8/3 K.... and even 6 to 8 K for the Heil where it gives its best !
Polar response ?
always myself asking the same questions : a low diameter (3" to 5"/6" classic driver, front loaded or not) or horn below the AMT is certainly the way to go... but how ? I believing now it seems more easy to follow you on your synergy design (Have to try it as it is cheap
) or with 2" / 1.5" CD driver with horn to avoid so such too low XO with AMTs' ?!Very interrested by your results here !
I'm sure you thinked to the AMT in a synergy already ? Am I wrong ? Is there a problem here like a too low QTS or speed ?
cheers
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...will really require a lot of work IMHO.