Hi guru's.
I'm on the hunt for a solid speaker design as a first project and I'm having a hell of a time keeping to a reasonable budget based on the availability/expense of drivers in Australia.
As for my requirements, I'm pretty open to suggestion but I'll state the following as a direction:
- While we listen to virtually all styles of music, we tend to play 60's - 80's rock , pop, electric & acoustic guitar, folk, some blues, jazz etc. I used to DJ so I have many electronic "dance" tracks that we play too. Less so classical.
- I'm looking to avoid strong sweet spots and like the idea of controlled directivity designs.
- I'll likely be building the 150W SKA amp kit or similar to power the speakers.
- That being said, I'd prefer higher efficiency speakers where possible.
- I like the sound of JBL monitors and Wilson Audio Shashas... but they don't fit my "reasonable budget".
I've looked at many in my search and most recently I have been very keen on the Fusion-12 Tempest, a budget design using the SEOS waveguide as developed by members on the AVS forum.
If I was in the USA I could build the Tempests for about $860 a pair... in Australia I can't find a way to get it below about double that.
With all that in mind, does anyone have any suggestions? Suppliers over here that I should check? Designs that have taken Aus availability in mind? Group buys I should know about?
You're combined wealth of knowledge is greatly appreciated.
Regards,
Tani
I'm on the hunt for a solid speaker design as a first project and I'm having a hell of a time keeping to a reasonable budget based on the availability/expense of drivers in Australia.
As for my requirements, I'm pretty open to suggestion but I'll state the following as a direction:
- While we listen to virtually all styles of music, we tend to play 60's - 80's rock , pop, electric & acoustic guitar, folk, some blues, jazz etc. I used to DJ so I have many electronic "dance" tracks that we play too. Less so classical.
- I'm looking to avoid strong sweet spots and like the idea of controlled directivity designs.
- I'll likely be building the 150W SKA amp kit or similar to power the speakers.
- That being said, I'd prefer higher efficiency speakers where possible.
- I like the sound of JBL monitors and Wilson Audio Shashas... but they don't fit my "reasonable budget".
I've looked at many in my search and most recently I have been very keen on the Fusion-12 Tempest, a budget design using the SEOS waveguide as developed by members on the AVS forum.
If I was in the USA I could build the Tempests for about $860 a pair... in Australia I can't find a way to get it below about double that.
With all that in mind, does anyone have any suggestions? Suppliers over here that I should check? Designs that have taken Aus availability in mind? Group buys I should know about?
You're combined wealth of knowledge is greatly appreciated.
Regards,
Tani
Wilson Audio Shashas 
You can look for drivers in Australia...
Speakerbug, Accuton, Audio Technology,
Jenzen-ATS
You can look for drivers in Australia...
Speakerbug, Accuton, Audio Technology,
Jenzen-ATS
Attachments
It will help if you fill in the following:
Budget:
F3:
Sensitivity:
Max SPL's:
Nominal impedance:
This one might work for you, kind of a poor man's Wilson copy, very well regarded - https://sites.google.com/site/undefinition/tarkus.
Maybe someone from Australia can make better recommendations, but a quick search found these driver sources:
**** Stones Sound Studio -Australia's Hometheatre speaker kit specialist ,RAAL RibbonTweeter Bybee Filter Peerless Fountek Sb Acoustics Shanling Quinpu Visitation Monacor Mundorf* Fountek RAAL Peerless Scan Speak Vifa PHL RAAL Nakamichi Shanling
Essential Audio | Australia | Guitar Speakers | Bass Speakers | PA Speakers | Hi Fi SPeakers | Home Theatre | Cabinet Hardware
DST-AU Home
If you are really stuck on those Fusion speakers, notice that Essential Audio sells the Eminence drivers. I wonder if you contact DIY Sound Group and explain your situation whether or not they might sell you just a partial kit with the plans instead of the whole thing. That should save you a load of cash.
But besides Peerless and Eminence, it looks like you have easy access to SB Acoustics, Fountek and ScanSpeak drivers as well. Lots of other very good designs out there using those drivers.
Budget:
F3:
Sensitivity:
Max SPL's:
Nominal impedance:
This one might work for you, kind of a poor man's Wilson copy, very well regarded - https://sites.google.com/site/undefinition/tarkus.
Maybe someone from Australia can make better recommendations, but a quick search found these driver sources:
**** Stones Sound Studio -Australia's Hometheatre speaker kit specialist ,RAAL RibbonTweeter Bybee Filter Peerless Fountek Sb Acoustics Shanling Quinpu Visitation Monacor Mundorf* Fountek RAAL Peerless Scan Speak Vifa PHL RAAL Nakamichi Shanling
Essential Audio | Australia | Guitar Speakers | Bass Speakers | PA Speakers | Hi Fi SPeakers | Home Theatre | Cabinet Hardware
DST-AU Home
If you are really stuck on those Fusion speakers, notice that Essential Audio sells the Eminence drivers. I wonder if you contact DIY Sound Group and explain your situation whether or not they might sell you just a partial kit with the plans instead of the whole thing. That should save you a load of cash.
But besides Peerless and Eminence, it looks like you have easy access to SB Acoustics, Fountek and ScanSpeak drivers as well. Lots of other very good designs out there using those drivers.
If you want controlled directivity and high sensitivity, a line array could be an option. Every time you double the number of drivers stacked in the array, the sensitivity should go up by around 6dB instead of the expected 3dB, as long as they're working in phase that is. That sort of thing could work well with a wide dispersion horn for the midrange or tweeter.
I had in mind something vaguely resembling this as a starting point.. MONITOR 890 MK III
but with an array of smaller low-cost woofers arranged in a vertical line to give better control over the dispersion.
Making the boxes big and wide in the front also makes them slightly louder because you're loading the drivers with a tiny bit more horn pressure, and helping to equalise that pressure on the other side of the baffle. I don't know what experience you have with building speakers, but don't forget to give the baffle some bulk to absorb vibrations. For home use, people usually want speaker boxes to be small and sleek, but for gigs you probably have more room.
I had in mind something vaguely resembling this as a starting point.. MONITOR 890 MK III
but with an array of smaller low-cost woofers arranged in a vertical line to give better control over the dispersion.
Making the boxes big and wide in the front also makes them slightly louder because you're loading the drivers with a tiny bit more horn pressure, and helping to equalise that pressure on the other side of the baffle. I don't know what experience you have with building speakers, but don't forget to give the baffle some bulk to absorb vibrations. For home use, people usually want speaker boxes to be small and sleek, but for gigs you probably have more room.
Thanks for your replies.
jReave:
1. I'd like to keep costs below $1000 for the pair, but could stretch if a design had a jump in quality... low price/performance ratio is more important than ultimate cost I guess. I'll just have to save longer if they're more expensive. Lets say $1500/pr max.
2. Not certain on LF extension required but much of my music has significant bass so I'd estimate 40Hz as an upper limit.
3. Sensitivity min of 88dB (2.83v @ 1m) but I'd prefer it to be in the 90's
4. Max SPL of around 100dB as a min. I like it pretty loud sometimes.
5. Nominal impedance: 8 ohms would be preferable but most amps I've been looking at would be happy at 4 ohms.
The Tarkus was one I had looked at seriously over a year ago. Again, I couldn't find the drivers (locally or otherwise) at anything less than ~2x the cost in the USA.
I had found the Eminence drivers at Essential Audio and buying the other components from DIY Sound Group is an option... yet again, price is a killer. The Delta Pro-12A alone will be $591 for the pair from Essential. I'll be well over $1000 before I even think about cabinets.
jReave: "SB Acoustics, Fountek and ScanSpeak drivers as well. Lots of other very good designs out there using those drivers" - If it's not too much work, would you be kind enough to point to a couple of candidates? I have trolled through so much information in my hunt that some specifics would be greatly appreciated.
I guess I was mostly asking if there was a design that took Australian supply into account specifically, but it appears that simply economies of scale work against us here when trying to attain a budget build. Every time I think I've found a good candidate I either can't get the drivers here or the cost of shipment is prohibitive. I'll keep searching however I'm getting to a point where I'd much rather be building and listening
Might just have to throw more money at my project than a US builder would need to. No real harm in that I guess.
Regards,
Tani.
jReave:
1. I'd like to keep costs below $1000 for the pair, but could stretch if a design had a jump in quality... low price/performance ratio is more important than ultimate cost I guess. I'll just have to save longer if they're more expensive. Lets say $1500/pr max.
2. Not certain on LF extension required but much of my music has significant bass so I'd estimate 40Hz as an upper limit.
3. Sensitivity min of 88dB (2.83v @ 1m) but I'd prefer it to be in the 90's
4. Max SPL of around 100dB as a min. I like it pretty loud sometimes.
5. Nominal impedance: 8 ohms would be preferable but most amps I've been looking at would be happy at 4 ohms.
The Tarkus was one I had looked at seriously over a year ago. Again, I couldn't find the drivers (locally or otherwise) at anything less than ~2x the cost in the USA.
I had found the Eminence drivers at Essential Audio and buying the other components from DIY Sound Group is an option... yet again, price is a killer. The Delta Pro-12A alone will be $591 for the pair from Essential. I'll be well over $1000 before I even think about cabinets.
jReave: "SB Acoustics, Fountek and ScanSpeak drivers as well. Lots of other very good designs out there using those drivers" - If it's not too much work, would you be kind enough to point to a couple of candidates? I have trolled through so much information in my hunt that some specifics would be greatly appreciated.
I guess I was mostly asking if there was a design that took Australian supply into account specifically, but it appears that simply economies of scale work against us here when trying to attain a budget build. Every time I think I've found a good candidate I either can't get the drivers here or the cost of shipment is prohibitive. I'll keep searching however I'm getting to a point where I'd much rather be building and listening
Might just have to throw more money at my project than a US builder would need to. No real harm in that I guess.
Regards,
Tani.
for that price your pretty much going to have to look at peerless drivers (here in aus anyway)
Silicon chip have a new speaker that might be possible.
the crossover is, crude, but otherwise it fits your wants.
for something that i would think is better, have a look at troels web site for ideas.
I'm currently building a pair of his nomex164's for a freind.
total cost (not including veneer) is under 1k.
cabinets should not be too expensive, a sheet of 25mm mdf is ~$70.
Silicon chip have a new speaker that might be possible.
the crossover is, crude, but otherwise it fits your wants.
for something that i would think is better, have a look at troels web site for ideas.
I'm currently building a pair of his nomex164's for a freind.
total cost (not including veneer) is under 1k.
cabinets should not be too expensive, a sheet of 25mm mdf is ~$70.
There are a number of good options in Australia; SEAS, Peerless, SB Acoustics, Scan Speak, and a few others. You could do a quality build with any of them but the SBs would be the cheapest one.
Another, better option would be to reconsider whether you need an expensive stereo amp in the middle driving energy wasting passive cross-overs, go the active option. Six drivers, six chip amps, active cross-overs and better sound.
SB Acoustics SB23NRXS45-8 8 Woofer
SB Acoustics SB15NRXC30-8 5 Midwoofer & SB15NRXC30-8-UC
SB Acoustics SB29RDNC-C000-4 Tweeter 1.2
About $460 for drivers and another $300-400 on electronics and you are still around the budget with cabinets.
Abs
Another, better option would be to reconsider whether you need an expensive stereo amp in the middle driving energy wasting passive cross-overs, go the active option. Six drivers, six chip amps, active cross-overs and better sound.
SB Acoustics SB23NRXS45-8 8 Woofer
SB Acoustics SB15NRXC30-8 5 Midwoofer & SB15NRXC30-8-UC
SB Acoustics SB29RDNC-C000-4 Tweeter 1.2
About $460 for drivers and another $300-400 on electronics and you are still around the budget with cabinets.
Abs
Or this Australian build;
2channelaudio: 2CA12.5.1 | DIY 3 way speaker | SB Acoustics & Seas Drivers
Abs
2channelaudio: 2CA12.5.1 | DIY 3 way speaker | SB Acoustics & Seas Drivers
Abs
there's almost no point of buying large woofers with ferrite as shipping will be too much.
u'll spend the same for deltalites and kappalites than their ferrite version landed in aussie
Not sure if this still applies, but back about ten years ago I bought 4 vifa 8" from apex jr in the US because they were on special and very cheap. Shipping to Melbourne was ~$100 to my workplace. No duty was payable as the total value was less than $500. I saved a considerable amount. So don't write off importing as an option if you can source the drivers for a really good price.
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