You're welcome!
Recommended by who?
No plans for any I've built nor any I've helped with that I can remember other than this multi-use one in progress that includes a 604 version, but it's too big for the S3 based on published specs: GM-416-8B MLTL Corner Cabinet
I recall discussing one or more Altec alignments with Scott, but don't recall ever knowing/seeing anything about them or whether they were even built. For sure don't recall the 'Bison' name. Just looking at the scaling though, it reminds me of Jay's I helped with and gortnipper's ~ S3 clone I don't recall, but posted responses on: https://www.audioasylum.com/forums/hug/messages/16/162252.html
GM
Recommended by who?
No plans for any I've built nor any I've helped with that I can remember other than this multi-use one in progress that includes a 604 version, but it's too big for the S3 based on published specs: GM-416-8B MLTL Corner Cabinet
I recall discussing one or more Altec alignments with Scott, but don't recall ever knowing/seeing anything about them or whether they were even built. For sure don't recall the 'Bison' name. Just looking at the scaling though, it reminds me of Jay's I helped with and gortnipper's ~ S3 clone I don't recall, but posted responses on: https://www.audioasylum.com/forums/hug/messages/16/162252.html
GM
Sorry GM my wording is bad.. Here's the story: I sold my amp to a guy and he told me he was also going to purchase the GPA 604 III drivers from Great Plains Audio. Anyhow I thought that was pretty cool as I'd like to be able to do that kind of thing myself, but can't afford it.. Anyhow I asked him what cab he was going to use for them, and he mentioned that Bill at GPA suggested the Stonehenge V. So with me reading around various threads over the years I suggested that he should try an MLTL cab for them, and that I read about some designed by various people like you etc.. So I mentioned he should join DIY and make a thread discussing what he wants to do etc. He just uses his cell phone mostly and doesn't go to web forums much, so I said I'd start a thread for him to help him out, and here I am lol..
Also the Altec 604 and M19 has always interested me, and so yeah I got to talking with the guy and knew that there should be something better in a newer design like an MLTL.. I put all his particulars in my first post, like room size, and no issue with cab size etc..
Dunno, I suck at all the math and thought that there were maybe some ready made newer plans for the 604III. The Bison cab I just learned about in this thread, and then found a bit on it on a forum elsewhere. It seems like a good contender perhaps. Anyhow as the guy can't diy at all, looks like the Bison would fit the bill if it's a ready made plan to follow etc. I cannot find any other designs out there other than the older Altec cabs, and many other peoples cabs that do not show plans, or were not GPA 604III specific etc. And I need a GPA 604III specific plan for that driver, so he can just give it to his cabinet builder to make for him.
Edit: Also if there weren't any free designs on the web that I could find (that were allowed and okay'd by the designer) that is okay, as he is willing to purchase some plans for a good SQ design.
Also the Altec 604 and M19 has always interested me, and so yeah I got to talking with the guy and knew that there should be something better in a newer design like an MLTL.. I put all his particulars in my first post, like room size, and no issue with cab size etc..
Dunno, I suck at all the math and thought that there were maybe some ready made newer plans for the 604III. The Bison cab I just learned about in this thread, and then found a bit on it on a forum elsewhere. It seems like a good contender perhaps. Anyhow as the guy can't diy at all, looks like the Bison would fit the bill if it's a ready made plan to follow etc. I cannot find any other designs out there other than the older Altec cabs, and many other peoples cabs that do not show plans, or were not GPA 604III specific etc. And I need a GPA 604III specific plan for that driver, so he can just give it to his cabinet builder to make for him.
Edit: Also if there weren't any free designs on the web that I could find (that were allowed and okay'd by the designer) that is okay, as he is willing to purchase some plans for a good SQ design.
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I'm not sure actually or if he will keep using my amp as he is looking for another tube amp also. Maybe a Decware Torii III he found online.
Here's the manual: http://www.decware.com/newsite/SE84TSowners manual.pdf
Here's the specs from the manual of the amp I sold him:
•
Weight
14 lbs. ea.
•
Dimensions
8.5" H x 7.25" W x 14..75" D
•
Chassis 2mm T6 Aluminum
•
Finish
Powder Coat Gloss
•
Base
Solid hardwood / user interchangeable
•
Circuit type
Single ended Class A Pentode
•
Power output
6 watts RMS into 8 ohms x 2
•
Input voltage
2.3 volts for full output
•
Noise / Hum
Less than 1 millivolt
•
Response
20 Hz ~ 20 kHz
•
Rectification
5Y3GT tube rectification
•
Output tubes
SV83 or EL84/6BQ5
•
Signal tube
12AX7 or 12AT7 or 12Au7
•
Transformers
All transformers are custom made for this amplifier by Decware
•
Biasing
Self-Biasing circuit - never needs adjustment
•
Resistors
All resistors are precision WW/MF by DALE, VISHAY
•
Signal Cap
Audiophile grade poly film & foil
•
Filter Caps
Premium grade electrolytic's
•
AC cord
Fused IEC connector provided with removable power cord
•
Consumption
75 watts at full power
•
Input jacks
RCA type 24K Gold / Teflon
•
Output jacks
Gold 5-way binding posts accept 8 gauge wire
•
Speaker dB/1w
89 dB minimum / 96 dB is ideal
•
Warranty
Lifetime to original owner / 90 days on tubes
I can't comment much on the above, but FWIW:
Bison was (thank you for the reminder Dave) a custom MLTL / reflex we did back in '11. Hybrid because I use the same definitions GM does. Which presumably means we're dinosaurs. Excellent.
For comparison, in volume terms it's a 10.5ft^3 [nearly] cabinet; for comparison the Stonehenge III is 5.6ft^3 & Stonehenge V, which IIRC is in essence a restyled 620 is 9ft^3. Fb is 30Hz [about]. Going by slightly fallible memory & reverse engineering what I did 6 years back (I've misplaced my notes), then assuming the GPA 604-8H-III, on a voltage source amplifier it has a moderate EBS style alignment for near-wall or corner usage. With the 2.5ohm - 4ohm typical for SET amps that shifts to a more conventional lightly damped alignment so may need slightly more space from the front wall but will still be relatively forgiving of placement & should give good output to the mid 20Hz region with typical room gain; with the SET amps it could easily be tuned slightly lower to get a bit more damping if desired; this is not a difficult box to tune as it's quite large. All panels are doubled as it's a big box. Lateral driver offset is optional to dissipate standing waves across the baffle (rocket science this isn't & I see no reason a degree of this could not be applied to the other boxes where sufficient clearance is available). Vent placement is optional; front, rear or down-firing with plinth & spaces, which would be my preference.
Bison was (thank you for the reminder Dave) a custom MLTL / reflex we did back in '11. Hybrid because I use the same definitions GM does. Which presumably means we're dinosaurs. Excellent.
For comparison, in volume terms it's a 10.5ft^3 [nearly] cabinet; for comparison the Stonehenge III is 5.6ft^3 & Stonehenge V, which IIRC is in essence a restyled 620 is 9ft^3. Fb is 30Hz [about]. Going by slightly fallible memory & reverse engineering what I did 6 years back (I've misplaced my notes), then assuming the GPA 604-8H-III, on a voltage source amplifier it has a moderate EBS style alignment for near-wall or corner usage. With the 2.5ohm - 4ohm typical for SET amps that shifts to a more conventional lightly damped alignment so may need slightly more space from the front wall but will still be relatively forgiving of placement & should give good output to the mid 20Hz region with typical room gain; with the SET amps it could easily be tuned slightly lower to get a bit more damping if desired; this is not a difficult box to tune as it's quite large. All panels are doubled as it's a big box. Lateral driver offset is optional to dissipate standing waves across the baffle (rocket science this isn't & I see no reason a degree of this could not be applied to the other boxes where sufficient clearance is available). Vent placement is optional; front, rear or down-firing with plinth & spaces, which would be my preference.
Attachments
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I have, and also linked his page in this thread. He's using a different 604 and there's no plans that show how to build the whole cab. Nice cab though
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Thanks Scott! So it seems the Bison cab should work well then for the GPA 604III as is? Then with various room placement he could adjust the sound nearer or farther from the wall as he likes the sound etc..
Are there plans available for purchase for the Bison? I think he mailed you about them after I mentioned about the cabs. You'll probably see his mail.
Edit: He recently purchased the Vulcan plans a few days ago for his fe206en drivers that he wants to put in a different room, so you may know who he is already. His name is Rob, and he's in the Toronto Ontario area.
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Sure, that's what it was designed for. I'm looking at the pdf as I type. It's a flexible design, easy to place & tune. Advantage of an acoustically large enclosure.
Yes, plans are available for a small charge -not for me, I don't want anything; it would go direct to Dave, who did the CAD drawing.
Yes, plans are available for a small charge -not for me, I don't want anything; it would go direct to Dave, who did the CAD drawing.
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Probably easier than going through me; saves needing to relay emails!
I should add -if the space is available, GM's big MLTL will almost certainly blitz them all. I haven't looked at the details, but I'd take that one as read, above all since it's Altec.
Okay sounds good!
Yes he can go big no problem, isn't GM's big MLTL for the 416 though? I didn't see one with plans available for sale specifically for the 604III. I may have missed something as usual lol. The guy will need actual plans to go by though, as he will need to pass them on to his woodworker, so I figured the Bison's would probably be his best bet as there is a plan set for them. I'm far from where he lives so cannot help him tweak anything, and he's not a diy'er at all.
Edit: Oh is it this one GM linked? I did see this before but no plans or stuffing recommendations etc. If there are plans for this cab for sale, maybe that will be the one to go for then. Whatever is easier for the guy to have built and sounds good, and I know that both these designs would sound good.
https://www.audioasylum.com/forums/hug/messages/16/162252.html
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Okay thank you very much for responding to my thread Scott, and for your time and advice re the Bison's and GM's cabs. Really appreciated! Now the only bitter sweet deal with this whole darn thing is I wish it was me being able to buy the drivers and build these cabs lol. And have my amp back too! lol
Cheers and thanks
Dave.
Cheers and thanks
Dave.
No worries. Ah, the joys of the monograph. I'm currently stuck working on a pair of the things, one a co-production with my old doctoral supervisor, the other I'm 'editing', with an essay / introduction & references, explanatory annotation & other additions, plus new appendix etc. Glad to take a break from it for a few minutes TBH, love the subject though I do.
That's two of us -wish I could afford a pair of 604s.
That's two of us -wish I could afford a pair of 604s.
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Not surprised there's no DF or impedance specs, God forbid they would publish something that might keep someone from buying them and if they don't play well with one's speakers, then let's try different tubes, speaker wire, speakers, etc., or worse, sell it at a loss and try a different one; assuming of course the owner would know if they did or not unless they had significant experience with 'stone age' systems that listed these specs as standard.
GM
Not sure Greg. I bought the amp on faith and research at the time, and it always sounded really good to me and had a nice synergy with the speakers I used. I like to keep my system simple. So it was cd player to amp or laptop via DAC to fe108 drivers, then I added in MJK's 18" Goldwood H-Frames with a Dayton sub amp, and the bottom came in nicely. I was never upsold or pressured or anything, and the amp had a lifetime warranty to the original owner. I guess you mean more specs should be included? They might have been in the white paper somewhere, but that's all the info I had from in the manual.
Thanks to you, and Scott, Dave, and everyone that replied, I appreciate it. I was looking quite a bit and found lots of designs, but also couldn't find some things people mentioned until they linked them. I wonder if it's a Canada thing compared to searching in the US. My searches couldn't find some things that people mentioned no matter how many different times I worded things..
Dave.
Thanks to you, and Scott, Dave, and everyone that replied, I appreciate it. I was looking quite a bit and found lots of designs, but also couldn't find some things people mentioned until they linked them. I wonder if it's a Canada thing compared to searching in the US. My searches couldn't find some things that people mentioned no matter how many different times I worded things..
Dave.
Hmm, I've done no specific design for any of the Altecs, only made suggestions based on personal preference and/or others specific performance, size requirements, posting a range of specs as a guideline that will work for any brand/model of driver that falls within the range in an earlier post.
Again, depending on the amp, driver's actual Fs, the vent tuning [Fb] needs to closely line up for best overall bass performance when using low power SET, so a good plan to maybe pay extra to have GPA make matched drivers at 'x' Hz Fs, so the vent can be correctly designed if there's definitely no one nearby to fine tune them in room and 'y' Ft^3/L [Vas] to build the largest practical cab.
My drawings typically are just notes on scraps of paper, wood, etc., so most disappeared from sight once done, keeping only useful details for future reference.
I don't have quick access to the 'Jay Fisher' design, which is the one I linked to implies it basically is, but you can contact Jay for drawings, which are quite detailed IIRC, but don't know if the fancy motor brace fits the S3, though Jay could modify the drawing if need be.
Otherwise, I guess just build the Bison since it's for the S3, is bottom vented and a bit larger than the SH-V.
GM
Again, depending on the amp, driver's actual Fs, the vent tuning [Fb] needs to closely line up for best overall bass performance when using low power SET, so a good plan to maybe pay extra to have GPA make matched drivers at 'x' Hz Fs, so the vent can be correctly designed if there's definitely no one nearby to fine tune them in room and 'y' Ft^3/L [Vas] to build the largest practical cab.
My drawings typically are just notes on scraps of paper, wood, etc., so most disappeared from sight once done, keeping only useful details for future reference.
I don't have quick access to the 'Jay Fisher' design, which is the one I linked to implies it basically is, but you can contact Jay for drawings, which are quite detailed IIRC, but don't know if the fancy motor brace fits the S3, though Jay could modify the drawing if need be.
Otherwise, I guess just build the Bison since it's for the S3, is bottom vented and a bit larger than the SH-V.
GM
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