John Curl's Blowtorch preamplifier part II

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No when criminal activity is proven in a civil case there may be an application of what is known as RICO. That triples the award and in this case would have forced the US attorney to do something after they declined to get involved. (Strong hint of politics as the lead investigator was transfered to a very similar issue in another region where the dominant folks were from the other political party.)
Criminal activity is not proven in a civil case. Not proven in the legal sense (ie, found criminally guilty), which is the context in which I'm writing. But it can certainly be the catalyst for a subsequent criminal trial.
RICO is a special case, and is not any criminal activity brought to light in a civil trial. So is treble damages, to the best of my knowledge (It'll be spelled out in the jurisdiction's penal code). Your situation may well have been one of those special cases.
I won't delve further into arguments of law here.
 
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However the metal box could influence (reduce) the interference that the cable would conduct into it, or it could increase the currents with the larger capacitance to pass noise currents back to ground. This stuff is never easy to look at and the real network is very complex when external power is added to the mix.

If you look at what is required for FCC testing of conducted EMI (a one dimensional test) its pretty involved. For the radiated testing its much more involved. Meeting something like TEMPEST https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tempest_(codename) would be an admirable goal for a really high quality audio product. Fortunately the specs are secret so its perfect audiophile fodder.


[The requirements are set out in document NACSIM 5100A. But --
the doc is classified as level- Secret]
 
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Let me give an example which recently came up here and how it has been addressed in AudioLand -->

Phonograph interconnect (cart to RIAA preamp):

When millions of people from all over the world say they hear differences between phono cables (the metadata) we tell them -- its all in your head. and as proof: The cables are measured for THD/IM and freq response. Conclusion? The cables measure perfect. Its all in your head.

Instead we should look at the developed 'metadata' and measure as a system and there you will see the frequency response changes with cable C etc and cart damping of resonances. Shifted resonances etc.
It is not all in thier head or some witchcraft or bias.

WE have a lot of metadata to investigate if you-all will get your heads out of the sand/b...t.

Thx-RNMarsh
[call me impatient... only been hearing this crap for just one life time!]

Richard, I think this is not completely fair. Most of us are well aware that capacitive loading can make a difference with cart cables, and it is not that all of us say 'it's all in your head'. However, if all the well know physical factors have been accounted for, and still people report differences, we enter the realm of 'if 50 million...'.

I am sure that you are well aware that it is fairly easy to make large numbers of people believe something that is absolutely not true, see the 'canals on Mars' story I linked to earlier, or any modern advertising campaign to 'position' a product. So it's a bit more subtle than you're posting. Meta data studies only lead to better insight if there is some basis to the reported data, if not, it just leads you further astray.

jan
 
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Meeting something like TEMPEST https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tempest_(codename) would be an admirable goal for a really high quality audio product. Fortunately the specs are secret so its perfect audiophile fodder.

This brings memories of tempest testing of a European NATO HQ that should remain unnamed. At one time, we had a team of mobile testers at about 300 yards outside of the fence, and when I paid them a visit they showed me VDU screens in the van that were perfectly copying everything the guy behind the window 500 yards away was typing on his computer (this was DOS time and Bill Gates wasn't at his 1st billion yet). So, not only could they detect the radiation, they could decode and synchronise it and make it perfectly legible.

There was a company that made a killing with tempest proofing computers.

jan
 
Ah good old Tempest, that has brought memories of the last 6 years of projects I have been working on. Just following basic EMC guidelines for commercial product is a start, and not just passing but passing easily. often commercial products will just pass, due to cost constraints, so the EMC components are limited to where absolutely necessary to keep costs down. The main thing is shielding, and when a lot of audio people like to only connect the shield at on end or use pig tails to a systems "star of stars" grounding point you aint going to get anywhere.

http://www.fas.org/nuke/intro/nuke/emp/c-6body.pdf

Power Line Communications:
however you look at it or defend it, it is still adding EMC to the mains wiring system, this cannot be good...It even has a dispensation from CE, because it cannot be tested for EMI as it is EMI, so as RNM has pointed out you need ferrites to remove it from entering your equipment (it is still surrounding us in the wires). But again, anyone any serious measurements on how badly ferrites affect the audio signal, cos I see them all over on equipment and from what I have seen the effect is negliable.

EMC: The Impact

http://www.nutwooduk.co.uk/default.aspx?id=17
 
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sofaspud;3545180 And of course defamation is a civil matter and won't be heard in a (USA) criminal court.[/QUOTE said:
"In some civil law jurisdictions, defamation is treated as a crime rather than a civil wrong.[5] The United Nations Commission on Human Rights ruled in 2012 that the criminalization of libel violates freedom of expression and is inconsistent with Article 19 of the International Covenant on Civil and Political Rights.[6]"

Defamation - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia Good info there.



Meeting something like TEMPEST would be an admirable goal for a really high quality audio product. Fortunately the specs are secret so its perfect audiophile fodder.

Informative post (as always) !


https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tempest_(codename)
“Compromising emanations are defined as unintentional intelligence-bearing signals which, if intercepted and analyzed, may disclose the information transmitted, received, handled, or otherwise processed by any information-processing equipment.”

In our case and for our own interests, this means any change of any parameter of any sort that is the result of direct or indirect modulation by the primary –say musical- signal :hypno2:


they showed me VDU screens in the van that were perfectly copying everything the guy behind the window 500 yards away was typing on his computer
jan

So, every Big Brother employee knows I am frequently visiting "redtubing, hose & shaft.com" :wave:

George
 
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In our case and for our own interests, this means any change of any parameter of any sort that is the result of direct or indirect modulation by the primary –say musical- signal
Not quite, as Tempest is for communications equipment primarily, so you have the vocal modulations, which is audible sound. It is primarily to limit and stop any unintentional broadcasts, CE compliance with balls (ie its got to pass and is tested, you cant just stick a sticker on your gear.
 
English Libel Law

http://www.nytimes.com/2013/04/26/w...s-suing-for-libel-harder-in-england.html?_r=0

As of April of these year, certain aspects were modified to reduce the amount of libel tourism in England. The "burden of proof on defendant," which effectively made cases indefensible under most circumstances was modified to allow a "good faith that statements are in the public interest" to be a valid defense. The English libel laws are still unduly weighted toward plaintiffs, but not quite as grossly so as they were a few months ago.

My apologies for not being current in this area. However, the old laws were still in place when the indirect threat was allegedly made.
 
I am sure that you are well aware that it is fairly easy to make large numbers of people believe something that is absolutely not true, see the 'canals on Mars' story I linked to earlier, or any modern advertising campaign to 'position' a product.
You may be able to hype something before acquisition, or if it's something that doesn't intrude in your life on a regular basis - but if you have to then live with the result, and it's something that directly impacts one of the primary senses, I would suggest that there could be something more to it ... :)
 
A high percentage of readers here would be getting the Audio Precision newsletter; for those who don't, something of interest - a memory of a 'disturbing' artifact from when the company moved into new quarters:
There is more to their problem than swapped neutral and grounds as in a nec compliant commercial or home installation the only place that neutral and ground should meet is at the main circuit breaker box . To induce current flow through the water and drain pipes they have to be in the circuit making that big loop inductor . I not saying this could not happen rather I am lead to believe that the grounding system need much more attention . To induce a field that strong in plumbing ( water and drain ) should take more than a couple 120v outlets. On the basic of the article quoted the ground was not returned directly to the main box but hooked to the piping then returned to ground where it left the building . How this passed inspection is a total unknown to me.
 
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You may be able to hype something before acquisition, or if it's something that doesn't intrude in your life on a regular basis - but if you have to then live with the result, and it's something that directly impacts one of the primary senses, I would suggest that there could be something more to it ... :)

Could be, but the evidence doesn't support it.
Audio, cars, sunglasses, shoes? (Ever bought Uggs?).

jan
 
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Yes but is it real or in your head...

Rapid advances in Brain-Computer Interface field of research, will soon start bringing-out for the masses what is happening inside our brain.
I think that only young computer gamers are ready to meet this new “reality” without been hit by a strong cultural shock.

>Edit: OK. Maybe Jacco too

George
 
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Jack found that the neutral-ground can actually be more affected than hot to ground. I don't know why. One device is normally in the hot load, another in the neutral from load.
Neutral/ground is a lower impedance loop. The experimental design was entirely insufficient for low impedance measurements performed in a lackadaisical fashion.

Many who just buy high end test equipment and hook it up without understanding, are going to misinterpret the bad measurements.

Well people can IGNORE technical information. However, it has been presented today, just like it was, years ago.

What was presented was not valid.

As I said everyone. Even technical measurements are discounted with it comes to Bybee.
No. But invalid, poorly designed ones are.

In one instance, 240V power supply cable of cheap Teac shelf system running in the garage whilst we were repairing a vintage/classic Aussie Ford car.
I fitted the ferrite filter when nobody was looking and two in the garage asked what had I done to the sound....that's a perfectly valid blind test in my understanding.
View attachment 357060

Dan.

Simply clamping a ferrite over hot, neutral, and ground will have more impact on ground loop reactance than hot-neutral. Yes, some rf will be dissipated, but since both current carrying conductors are within the ferrite loop, LF impact hot-neutral will be very diminished. It would be better to split hot/neutral and run each independently through ferrite holes.

Richard

Evaluating the effects of cables by various measurements at the output of the system they are attached to -and not measuring cables in isolation- is the proper thing to do and the reasoning for this has been already addressed in this site.
Stated well.
There is more to their problem than swapped neutral and grounds as in a nec compliant commercial or home installation the only place that neutral and ground should meet is at the main circuit breaker box . To induce current flow through the water and drain pipes they have to be in the circuit making that big loop inductor . I not saying this could not happen rather I am lead to believe that the grounding system need much more attention . To induce a field that strong in plumbing ( water and drain ) should take more than a couple 120v outlets. On the basic of the article quoted the ground was not returned directly to the main box but hooked to the piping then returned to ground where it left the building . How this passed inspection is a total unknown to me.

At the level AP works, I suspect one luminary would be sufficient if wired neutral/ground reversed. The loop is really big, and the victim is in the middle.

We have the same problem on the east coast...there are actually earth currents as a consequence of running earthing rods every second or third telephone pole. We use single bushing transformers, and somewhere between 5 and 10% of the 3 phase distribution currents run through the planetary surface (saying "earth" gets confusing). On occasion, the gradient becomes sufficient to cause discomfort when standing on wet dirt and touching an object that has been bonded to safety ground back at the load panel. This can be an extreme hazard at swimming pools, and is the reason Mike Holt recommends the east coast utilities switch over to two bushing transformers.

jn
 
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Simply clamping a ferrite over hot, neutral, and ground will have more impact on ground loop reactance than hot-neutral. Yes, some rf will be dissipated, but since both current carrying conductors are within the ferrite loop, LF impact hot-neutral will be very diminished. It would be better to split hot/neutral and run each independently through ferrite holes.

jn


Suggesting Differential-Mode filtering over Common-Mode filtering and visa-versa has to take into account the type of noise that is causing trouble.

Both types of noise need to be minimized. However, having said that, one type is usually dominate most of the time in homes.

Thx-RNMarsh
 
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