Meow
Normally and most of the time, bluekitty only purrs and won't scratch anybody, unless one rubs him up the wrong way (by first having a big mouth and then walking away, for example). Also - as strange as it might look - bluekitty isn't very fond of red herrings.
C. E.
Normally and most of the time, bluekitty only purrs and won't scratch anybody, unless one rubs him up the wrong way (by first having a big mouth and then walking away, for example). Also - as strange as it might look - bluekitty isn't very fond of red herrings.
C. E.
I've not heard Lowthers, but from all accounts they are very good at revealing subtle differences - so long as your ears don't bleed in the process.
Cheers,
Alex
The ones I've listened to were horn loaded for bass, not my cup of tea, and there were a lack of HF compared to what I'm used to.
This is completely wrong! Do you grasp what this is about??
What you, and John, have to gain is being the first to show conclusively that burn-in causes audible differences. Can you actually imagine the concept? No more insults. People will talk about you for the next 30 years!
jd
And if it is proven, so what, seems like very few notice it anyway.
What is it, get two wrong and the insults would not end for the next 30 years?
Doing it against such odds, I must be crazy. 
No Andre, quite contrary.
As you claim to be able to hear the difference, there should be no discussion of odds, but rather it should be a walk in the park to you.
After you have proven your claim, I tell you VERY many will notice, and you will have good basis for writing an AES paper.
Magura
As you claim to be able to hear the difference, there should be no discussion of odds, but rather it should be a walk in the park to you.
After you have proven your claim, I tell you VERY many will notice, and you will have good basis for writing an AES paper.
Magura
Banned
Joined 2002
I can scare up 4 pairs of these if I get to keep the cables afterwards
jd
they are not to expensive either, if you send me 4 of these, i'll build you the cables. Ebay 20$ ish a pair.
Jase
Seems like bluekitty is lying on his back, waiting for someone to rub him up the wrong way.
Agree.
Horn loaded bass is very different to TL bass - and difficult to get right.
Your TL's would probably have better extension at both ends of the frequency range. This is one of the things that fullrange drivers can't do as well as a two way (or 2.5 way
)Look, I don't want to insult you, etc., and I'm trying here to be as civil as I can. But you're still not getting the concept of 'Control' (nor are several others here).
In your case, you WANT the control sample to be as crappy as possible - you want the $15 Best-Buy specials. You want to make it as easy as possible on yourself to tell the difference between the control and your best cables.
Those of us who DOUBT you can do what you claim don't get much to say in the matter. You get to pick whatever two sets of cable you want, and show that you can tell a difference. The 'experimental' or 'variable' is your choice of cable - your best and most likely case for success - to be put against the 'control' which is the generic set from Best-Buy.
Here is a great link to read about it.
Others here may want to read this for the basics as well.
Exactly. All that is needed is a 'control' sample. - The basic off the shelf cable - and the 'experiment' which is a cable of Andre's choice. That's it.
If later we all want to test different brands of cable we can. However, unless someone thinks there is another cable besides Andre's experimental one which can be detected vs. the control, it's redundant.
That depends on the cables used.
After you have proven your claim, I tell you VERY many will notice, and you will have good basis for writing an AES paper.
Magura
Pity I can't write.
exactly.
No, the claimant should be responsible for producing exactly the cable he wants to test. Anything else is to introduce additional variables which can't be accounted for.
I think these are valid points. I like the idea of headphones for the simplicity and directness. Also no room accoustics, etc. Kinda hard to do with amps though.
No, level matching is ALWAYS required ESPECIALLY with a switch, etc. slight volume changes are the most likely way an audiophile is able to 'hear' differences between to pieces of equipment. The only way to ensure that volume is not a factor is to precisely measure voltage using a multi-meter and a square wave.
Agreed, but we then must simply take his word for it, as he is insisting we do now. The testing would need to be conducted with both parties equally represented. And no Sy, you can't come. Your brain waves are way too strong to get accurate readings of these cables.
X2 Clear, concise, and correct.
And if it is proven, so what, seems like very few notice it anyway.
What is it, get two wrong and the insults would not end for the next 30 years?
Odds?? What are you talking about? You said you were 100% sure, remember?
jd
Ahh yes, good point! We don't want to end up in the situation that the test comes out null and that the argument will be: it was the wrong cables. So the claimant says which cables to use.
Is anybody keeping track?
jd
No can do. He must not be allowed to see or handle the cables at all. To do so is to create the possibility that he may be able to tell a difference with something besides his ears.
When testing starts, the only thing he does is walk in, sit down and ask for 'Sample A' or 'Sample B'.
Without him being able to see or hear the process of switching the cables, (ideally it's done in another room) whatever sample he calls for is played.
He can switch as many times as he likes, and take as long as he likes. He can use whatever music or sounds he likes, and whatever sound system he likes. - As long as the one and only variable in the system is the two cables.
When he makes a selection, for example, "Sample A is my burned in cable" the result is then recorded. The correct answer is NOT however revealed.
The sample designations are then randomly shuffled. for example: the A and B stickers come off, and a coin is flipped for each cables new designation. Example: the burned in cable was sample 'A', but because of the coin toss landing tails this time instead of heads (as before), it becomes sample 'B'. If the coin toss landed heads again, no change is made to the designations.
The test is repeated this way at least 10 and preferably more times to narrow the chances of correct guessing. Andre is allowed to take as many and / or as long breaks as he likes, so that 'ear fatigue', 'stress' etc. cannot be used as an excuse either.
Only after the test is complete may the subject know whether his answers are correct or not to eliminate false bias possibilities.
Also, and very important - The voltage using a square wave and a digital multimeter must be measured at the end of each cable. The reading must be precisely the same every time. This is to ensure exact volume level match. The human ear is very good at telling the difference between even slight volume level changes. These changes are most often what audiophiles hear when they claim that one item is 'brighter, deeper, more sound-stage, resolving', etc. over another.
I did not make up these rules. It is nothing more than scientific method, and is the only way a listening test can be valid using a 'simple A/B test' as requested by Andre.
More can be read HERE and HERE
Are you talking about a cable difference test or the proposed burn-in test where ten of the same cables will be used and I must sort which are burned in and which are new?
Absolutely.
You get to put your very best cables up against any other set of cables you like. As long as the gauge and length of the conductors are similar and the cables are made correctly, it's your choice, not ours.
A cable difference test done first would be the simplest. It only requires two cables. If you are unsuccessful in this first test, another, more complicated test with many different sets becomes unnecessary.
No. You missed the point of the test, apparently. The only difference in the ten (or so) cables is that each is coded and randomly broken-in or not. He needs no-one else there, just needs to separate the cables into two groups, broken-in and not-broken-in. Once he's done that, he gives his scoresheet (via email is fine) to whomever is holding the key. There's no cheating possible, either there's a difference that can be detected under the claimed conditions or there isn't. The initial two cables are sighted, that is, he knows which is the broken-in versus not-broken-in to confirm that he hears a difference; that's part of the setup, not the test itself.
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Joined 2002
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