which input capacitor is best for SS? I have personally used Polystyrene and found ultra high resolution in the sound but since I never listened to Mundorf silver oil caps thought if anybody might have compared these two caps would help me in saving 200 dollars... can anybody tell me how does it compare? can polystyrene beat Mundorf silver oil?
technically speaking polystyrene should be better than any polypropelene but how is the sound compared when compared to Mundorf is a big question...
technically speaking polystyrene should be better than any polypropelene but how is the sound compared when compared to Mundorf is a big question...
Unfortunately you are in (almost) completely subjective territory here, and in reality the only person who is going to be able to decide is yourself.
The reason I said almost is because when you start getting very large capacitors (that the board was probably not designed to cope with) there is a real possibility that there could be unintended negative effects (which may be quite quantifiable).
In the end your ears and brain will tell you whether or not you have wasted your money, and for each individual this could be different.
If you have any doubts (or could spend the money more wisely on something else) I'd not fork out the cash.
Tony.
The reason I said almost is because when you start getting very large capacitors (that the board was probably not designed to cope with) there is a real possibility that there could be unintended negative effects (which may be quite quantifiable).
In the end your ears and brain will tell you whether or not you have wasted your money, and for each individual this could be different.
If you have any doubts (or could spend the money more wisely on something else) I'd not fork out the cash.
Tony.
Only get caps from reputable manufacturers with proper science and research behind their products, like Panasonic or Rubycon, etc. Mass produced and cheap, and working as they should.
I would expect that Mundorf or other small "audiophile" companies don't not fall into this category. They simply can't afford to compete with the expertise (and R&D) of proper capacitor manufacturers.
I would expect that Mundorf or other small "audiophile" companies don't not fall into this category. They simply can't afford to compete with the expertise (and R&D) of proper capacitor manufacturers.
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To be fair, Mundorf's parent company is one of the largest capacitor manufacterers in the world.
I would pick the Mundorf Silver/Oil because I have heard them (using them in my tube amp) and they sound very good to me. They are also quite small in size, for their voltage rating.
I doubt anybody could hear a difference between polystyrene and polypropylene caps of the same value in a blind test. The losses and distortions are so low as to be almost unmeasurable. Even with a ppm resolution bridge and various other tests I wouldn't be able to tell the two apart with any certainty. The differences between two manufacturers of the same type would almost certainly be larger than the differences between the dielectrics in general. I'd be more interested in microphonics, if they're an issue at all, and capacitance to nearby grounds and circuitry due to size differences.
My question is what preamp before this amp ? Why do you think you need this cap ? Cap where used in the signal path of tubes because power supplies where expensive and thus used only one ht supply and blocked dc between stages . Point being is you may not need them at all saving 100s of dollars . No cap sounds like no cap at all. Please explain why you want in input cap .
well .... i can tell that i noticed listenable difference between 2.2 ufd from wima mkp or mks next to a Chinese unknown manufacturer which the Chinese was better for sure the choice of the input capacitor will play some audible role ...
keep in mind that polarity of especially exotic and big caps will also have some effect in the sound due to the built of the capacitor...
eventhough these are called non polar caps still from the manufacturing there is polarity and this will play some role
capacitor will also play some role always depending on the rest of the filter
Kind regards
sakis
keep in mind that polarity of especially exotic and big caps will also have some effect in the sound due to the built of the capacitor...
eventhough these are called non polar caps still from the manufacturing there is polarity and this will play some role
capacitor will also play some role always depending on the rest of the filter
Kind regards
sakis
i have compared with hand wound polypropelene with 1uf polystyrene....
polystyrene gave very very transparent presentation.... I guess mundorf would have softer presentation than much clear pres as styrenes...
I would like to remove the input cap this cap is just to block the DC.
there will be a preamp before this which is opa627
the reason why i want to use get that signature of that capacitor is very much perceived when used in signal path...
polystyrene gave very very transparent presentation.... I guess mundorf would have softer presentation than much clear pres as styrenes...
I would like to remove the input cap this cap is just to block the DC.
there will be a preamp before this which is opa627
the reason why i want to use get that signature of that capacitor is very much perceived when used in signal path...
I have mentioned the following in another thread, but the subject of caps comes up so often that I hope repetition to be forgiven.
Not to upset the apple cart - certainly not to grate those with golden ears .... but before we go all agog about the "sound" of caps "in the signal line" we might review a few electronic basics:
The signal path: I think most of us have learnt that current flows in a circle/circuit. I am therefore puzzled why mostly only those capacitors from say signal input to perhaps a transistor base is considered "in the signal path". Electricity cannot suddenly appear in a circuit, nor can it disappear into thin air. Every minute bit of signal going through an input capacitor thus also has to 'return' somewhere through a power supply or at least a bypass capacitor. But no one seems to be so very worried about the quality of those - surely the weakest link in the circuit determines the quality!
Then the action of a coupling capacitor: For signal frequencies coupling capacitors are supposed to be shorts, i.e. contribute a negligible atternuation/effect to the circuit. It is as if one has a 10 ohm resistor in series with a 10K resistor, and one spends one's attention only on the quality of the 10 ohm!
How can that be logical?
Not to upset the apple cart - certainly not to grate those with golden ears .... but before we go all agog about the "sound" of caps "in the signal line" we might review a few electronic basics:
The signal path: I think most of us have learnt that current flows in a circle/circuit. I am therefore puzzled why mostly only those capacitors from say signal input to perhaps a transistor base is considered "in the signal path". Electricity cannot suddenly appear in a circuit, nor can it disappear into thin air. Every minute bit of signal going through an input capacitor thus also has to 'return' somewhere through a power supply or at least a bypass capacitor. But no one seems to be so very worried about the quality of those - surely the weakest link in the circuit determines the quality!
Then the action of a coupling capacitor: For signal frequencies coupling capacitors are supposed to be shorts, i.e. contribute a negligible atternuation/effect to the circuit. It is as if one has a 10 ohm resistor in series with a 10K resistor, and one spends one's attention only on the quality of the 10 ohm!
How can that be logical?
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johan .. your approach is wrong to my opinion
first of all see for your shelf ...get a very basic amplifier and degrade all capacitors in the ''signal path " as described above with the lowest quality available ..then you will know ...
This theoretical approach might come out of a book but music is not just an AC signal there is way too much information travels through this capacitor and its a type of many signals mixed
So of course there is going to be both audible difference and orientation like X cap plays good with this music and some other better or worst ...
If you are only trying to listen 1KHZ signal ... most of them will sound pretty much the same
kind regards
sakis
first of all see for your shelf ...get a very basic amplifier and degrade all capacitors in the ''signal path " as described above with the lowest quality available ..then you will know ...
This theoretical approach might come out of a book but music is not just an AC signal there is way too much information travels through this capacitor and its a type of many signals mixed
So of course there is going to be both audible difference and orientation like X cap plays good with this music and some other better or worst ...
If you are only trying to listen 1KHZ signal ... most of them will sound pretty much the same
kind regards
sakis
I must say I am at a total as why you want to flavor the music with caps . Johan approach as far as I understand it is on based in logic . My question is not to the audible difference in cap which I agree is there but to why do you want to use them as tone controls in a solid state amp ? If it is as tone controls then so be it . This not the road taken by many of us on the board .
I just wonder of this:
Why doesn't anyone find theese presumeable big differences in sound-signature when such caps are testet in a double blindtest?
I am afraid there is all too much of a placeboeffect going around here.
As long as we have caps of reasonable good quality, there must be exstremely hard to find any real good arguments to prefer a $100,- cap over one cost $2,-
The paralel Johan points at is really a good one.
There is so much going on in an amp that reduces the audible effect of an input-cap to be as close to zero as anyone can imagine.
And as I said: Why can't anyone determine this in a double blindtest? Ever?
Why doesn't anyone find theese presumeable big differences in sound-signature when such caps are testet in a double blindtest?
I am afraid there is all too much of a placeboeffect going around here.
As long as we have caps of reasonable good quality, there must be exstremely hard to find any real good arguments to prefer a $100,- cap over one cost $2,-
The paralel Johan points at is really a good one.
There is so much going on in an amp that reduces the audible effect of an input-cap to be as close to zero as anyone can imagine.
And as I said: Why can't anyone determine this in a double blindtest? Ever?
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